Author Topic: New HQ. (Read 2386 times)

SD67 · « **Reply #45 on:** January 31, 2008, 05:47:24 AM »

Nope, I reckon leave the idea as it is.
It would only take once or twice for the horde to realise they can no longer get their uber rides once the factory goes down. Then the action begins.

moot · « **Reply #46 on:** January 31, 2008, 07:00:45 AM »

Plane factories would get abused, and then it's HTC's customer service that'd get abused... Face it guys, strat play is too much for the yank n bank, spray n pray crappy players. Anytime they are present in an arena, you can kiss fair play goodbye.

zilla · « **Reply #47 on:** January 31, 2008, 07:42:52 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by moot
Plane factories would get abused, and then it's HTC's customer service that'd get abused... Face it guys, strat play is too much for the yank n bank, spray n pray crappy players. Anytime they are present in an arena, you can kiss fair play goodbye.

Hey!! I resemble that remark!!!

moot · « **Reply #48 on:** January 31, 2008, 08:01:31 AM »

I mean the really crappy ones that get their dive bombing lancasters as soon as they lose a GV fight, or the ones that'll suicide your field or CV because they can't get just 1 kill out of the furball or even "just because" - nevermind killing others' fun, or the dweebs that'll gang you 10:1 (no exageration) because you beat them in 1:2 odds (in their favor) or (gasp) 1:1.

The only definite positive I'd see from a plane factory strat is if the anti-gameplay toolsheders can get their planes shut down too. That's reaching for positives, though.

In any case, abusable strat has been tried before. No matter what happens, it gets abused. The only good strat is one that can't be abused enough to ruin gameplay for others. As limited as the one we have now is, it's the best compromise.

Noir · « **Reply #49 on:** January 31, 2008, 09:01:35 AM »

put 5inches on that factories and we'll see who gets abused

LilMak · « **Reply #50 on:** January 31, 2008, 09:48:26 AM »

Maybe we could call it a ball bearing plant or something. So it would affect ALL rides with low eny (bombers, and GVs too). Make it so uncapturable bases are not affected. That way, if your side is getting creamed by the win the war folks, you can still get those uber planes out of the stable. The crybabies can still have their temps, mustangs and LA-7s as long as they're willing to fly 20 sectors to get to a fight.

OR

You could have the ball bearing factory not eliminate the low eny planes but assign a severe perk value to planes (based on eny) that normally wouldn't have a perk. You could have several plants (say 3) and each plant going down could add a perk value. Level the first and perks are added to 5 eny or less planes. Lose two factories @ the same time and perk values are added to 10 eny or less planes...and so on. You could have huge organized raids that try and destroy three factories at once. Defenders may be able to fend off one or two raids but the third may get through. It would add a lot of high alt bombing and some players would learn why certain planes, considered great in the WWII @ high altitudes, got their reputation. Plus it would give those dudes with 5 bazillion (and never used) perks something to spend their perks on.

moot · « **Reply #51 on:** January 31, 2008, 10:58:39 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Noir
put 5inches on that factories and we'll see who gets abused

Yeah, but that hasn't helped CVs much.. Those factories wouldn't even be able to dodge the bombs, nevermind rockets.

LilMak the problem is that you're trying to tell other players what they can or can't fly. The arena caps are already bad enough.. And so is ENY.
The perk cost from losing strat (ball bearing in your example) is a good idea but still very easily abused.

The very best single way to beat the hordes and win-the-war zombies still is simply good team tactics. Fly in pairs, keep a good SA. Don't waste ammo saddling up 10 on a single con. Don't dive in when 10 of those guys are on that con.
&c.

LilMak · « **Reply #52 on:** January 31, 2008, 01:11:59 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by moot
LilMak the problem is that you're trying to tell other players what they can or can't fly. The arena caps are already bad enough.. And so is ENY.
The perk cost from losing strat (ball bearing in your example) is a good idea but still very easily abused.

The very best single way to beat the hordes and win-the-war zombies still is simply good team tactics. Fly in pairs, keep a good SA. Don't waste ammo saddling up 10 on a single con. Don't dive in when 10 of those guys are on that con.
&c.

Maybe I missing the point of the thread. I thought the whole point was to encourage teamwork by adding strats that people will actually defend and attack. The furballers and hordes could care less about radar or how long it takes thier base to resupply as long as they can up their Panzer/LA-7/Lancsuka. As I see it, neither of my ideas prevent anyone from flying whatever they want whenever they want. All they do is change where or how much it costs to pick that plane out of the hangar.

It also gives a side an option that slows down the horde in two ways.

First, you up a large mission and pull some of the poeple away from the hordes and give them something to shoot at.
Second, if you're succesful in your mission there is a penalty to the opposing side for not defending thier strat.

As wonderful a game as AH is, I see many complaints from (what I believe) is a significant part of the population. 1, The guys who really love flying bombers want thier efforts to mean something and really don't desire the milk run. They would prefer to fight to an objective and make their eggs count for something. And 2, fighter jocks like me want something else to do besides try and defend a base from a horde or pick people off a runway. If there are strats that have greater meaning to the game play, will this not encourage better game play?

I could be completely off base here and these are just my opinions.

Overlag · « **Reply #53 on:** January 31, 2008, 04:18:46 PM »

totally agree. right now, the effects of strat is so small that no one really notices. kinda makes the bombers job worthless, hence they are called milkrunners.

i attack strats, as well as defend them. so much more than just furballin on the deck. and thats one of the reasons the game appeals so much to so many people. theres lots of things you can do. if you bored with fighters, up a tank, bomber, etc etc.

those mass b17 raids to hq's are great, as are the mass defence sweeps these days. but its a shame that other strats dont pull in that much interest.

it does work, but requires alot of work, with very little results. fester done it when the b24 was released. knocked cities to below 10%, troops to below 10%, then we bombed hq and near by supplies at the bases... the HQ was down for hours. but instead of learning to defend it the country logged of and posted on the bbs....

angelsandair · « **Reply #54 on:** January 31, 2008, 05:23:09 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by VansCrew1
if Clinton becomes president....you never know.

well if she does vanscrew, im going to canada.....

moot · « **Reply #55 on:** January 31, 2008, 11:04:28 PM »

"the HQ was down for hours. but instead of learning to defend it the country logged of and posted on the bbs...."

And that's the bottom line... You guys want strat, CT will do it.

SD67 · « **Reply #56 on:** February 01, 2008, 12:40:07 AM »

Yep, and that's the sad part. These days people would rather whine and cry about it rather than do something constructive to help or prevent it.

Overlag · « **Reply #57 on:** February 01, 2008, 06:30:41 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by moot
"the HQ was down for hours. but instead of learning to defend it the country logged of and posted on the bbs...."

And that's the bottom line... You guys want strat, CT will do it.

it wont though will it? CT wont really be a "war" the outcome will always be the same with the allies trashing the germans (i think?)

LilMak · « **Reply #58 on:** February 01, 2008, 06:54:10 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by moot
And that's the bottom line... You guys want strat, CT will do it.

We don't have CT and might never get CT. I also don't buy into the fact that CT is a fix for many of the gripes that frequent these boards. There are clearly not enough strats (or strats the mean something) in game and just saying that "CT will fix it" is ignoring a large part of the customer base that's paying for its develpoment. If they continue to be ignored, all this effort HTC has put into CT is completely wasted because the core player that CT is geared toward will have canceled thier fifteen dollar payment by the time it ever gets released.

Besides, where will all the 262 dweebs get all thier kills if the bomber pilots are all playing CT?

moot · « **Reply #59 on:** February 01, 2008, 08:37:07 AM »

So... Like I already said, there were more sensible strats already, and they were abused. Players don't want to be told or limited in what they can fly, or when or where. That's what the MA's about, furballing with consequences if you lose the furball.
I'm not going to re-tell the last years of massively multiplayer online dogfighting games that lead up to where we are now, and anyway HTC has done it from both the player and developer side of it all.. Warbirds was theirs, and they were in AW, maybe further.

Now, if you think CT will never come, that's your assertion, and an assertion with no facts to back it up. You can say CT won't ever come, and I'll say it'll come, and you're the one that's wrong. On the matter of "when" is what I won't speculate, but obviously it's been a while, and that's the only thing anyone can complain about for now, because:

Everything that could sensibly be tried without disrupting customers' playing already has been tried, so you can't, in fact, say that HTC are ignoring the customers.
And the "customers are paying and have a right to say what HTC should or shouldn't do" is a dead horse. Beat it if you want, but you'll be the only guy who thinks he's getting anything out of it.

And the 262 dweeb will be getting their kills in CT. I don't see what the point of saying that is, either in jest or seriously.

The MA just isn't where you should play if you want historical gameplay. The players have been let loose on all the attempts HTC has made to make the MA have strat, as well as on their attempts to disfavoring mass vulching, porking, hording, offmap-ing and every other dweeby exploit that an arena as unhistorical in purpose as the MA is, and today's MA is the result.

I'm not saying CT will fix everything, I'm saying it will counterbalance the MA, and from there things will improve. You guys insisting on trying solutions already tried in the past are just not on the right track.

I've also never seen a gripe be sentient to the point of frequenting forums on its own.

Overlag, I don't know. I do know HTC aren't blind and know their stuff. How long have they been at this?

p.s. I am drunk, so while I know there's some rhetorical funk in the above, I'm not going to proof read it.. But the points are there for you to plainly see.