Intellectualist Elitists are anti-American and we just ain't a-gonna take it no more!

[kamilyun]

I'm having a hard time empathizing or sympathizing with the author's point of view.  I agree that today we reckon and figur' more than actually 'think' about topics, however, one population of 'intellectuals' has directly contributed to the dumbing down of America:  Educators.  Curriculums have been reduced into corn-syrupy, feel-good, self-love fests in which nothing really matters so long as we all care about students' feelings (to the neglect of their actual learning).

'Intellectuals' have claimed that topics in English class should be 'relevant' to students' backgrounds and lives...so out go the classics, and in comes "Poetry of Rap".  The analysis of proven standards goes by the wayside, so we can keep them entertained.

I do understand the problem...I teach a core subject at a private university in a large metropolitan area.  The students constantly ask "Will this be on the test".  Forget learning about how the universe works...or even why Tylenol kills your liver when you're drinking alcohol.  They just want an 'A' so they can get into Med school.

I don't have an answer, b/c, damn...the situation is way too far gone.  I'm amazed that anything actually gets done anymore.  Seriously.  Who comes up with the energy efficient backlighting for our iPods so they run for 6 hours and weigh 4.5 oz?  Or encode the gene into bacteria that produces the next anti-tumor wonderdrug at Genentech?  Actually, I do know b/c I've seen these employees...and their accents are a dead giveaway that they're not a product of the American educational system.

[Suave]

Originally posted by moot
I guess that's why you don't see the relevence of what I mentionned earlier.  HDTVs and Myspace just don't matter as far as education is concerned.  
If a kid is taught to think for himself correctly (i.e. has understood logic underlies everything), he'll recognize britney spears and other crap like it as just ephemeral artifacts, just fads, just bait on someone's hook.

When I studied cognitive developement, one of the things that struck me was the statement that nearly half of all adults never develope to the point at which they can reason logically things abstract.

[Suave]

Kamilyun are you sure you're not talking about psuedointellectuals?

[moot]

I think those mediocre people in the US are that way because they're spoiled.  And they don't eat to live anymore.. They live to eat - junk food, junk TV, junk everything that keeps them alive enough to keep the commerce going, but not enough for them to be all they can be.
Hangtime and others are right, without any peril people grow too complacent.  Being sheltered by too much comfort fools people into thinking that they can just sit on their laurels..

I've been out of the US for 3 years now, but that's what I remember.  YMMV.

Originally posted by Suave
When I studied cognitive developement, one of the things that struck me was the statement that nearly half of all adults never develope to the point at which they can reason logically things abstract.

Yep.. I don't mean to brag but I recognized this myself at around 13-14yo, if not before that.
People's brains seem to solidify if they stop exposure to variety for long enough.  I tried like hell to keep my little brothers' brains plastic enough.  I hope it works out because it makes a huge difference, long term.

Idealy (IMO) you should be living in a constant flux of Problem -> Solution.  The instant a problem is clearly defined, a solution (even if only its topology) should appear.  This cycle should be as fluid and free as possible, never ending because no two moments in time are the same.. No one solution can really be used twice.
Sorry for rambling

[Arlo]

Originally posted by moot
I guess that's why you don't see the relevence of what I mentionned earlier.  HDTVs and Myspace just don't matter as far as education is concerned.

I think you focused on the wrong element of my statement. I could of said ".... more important to the parent than their car." Or " .... more important to the parent than their new girl/boyfriend." The most important part of nurturing positive traits into children is their parent caring enough to do so. It's not the idol/altar we choose to sacrifice our children on ... it's the decision to make the sacrifice for our own selfish ends.

It's not an uncommon opinion.

That being said, we seem to agree about the importance of a practical education. I just believe the effective method of the rearing/education of children involves parental involvement.

I could have had all the mandatory classes/tools available at the school facilites one could possibly dream of but if my parents failed to instill in me a desire for growth my grades would've been superficial (and quite possibly marginal). I could have little to no resources and no mandatory classes of any kind enforced on me yet if my parents managed to instill in me a strong thirst for knowledge and the basic tools of critical thought and problem solving ... I could quite possibly manage to still aquire the additional knowledge necessary over a lifetime of library visits, community college night courses or even the dreaded electronic medium via PBS.

The Yale of Bush's college days had all the tools necessary to form a mind capable of effective critical thought. And yes, there are times I wonder if the Bush family was as functional (versus disfunctional) as it pretends it was during W's formative years (no more than suspicion born of characteristics observed, however).

[Arlo]

Originally posted by moot
I think those mediocre people in the US are that way because they're spoiled.  And they don't eat to live anymore.. They live to eat - junk food, junk TV, junk everything that keeps them alive enough to keep the commerce going, but not enough for them to be all they can be.
 

I completely agree. I may do so with somewhat of a guilty conscious but I do. This may lead to a personal [re]awakening.

[moot]

Of course parents' involvement is cruical.. Kids are still predisposed for it.  It would make for a pretty alien livelihood otherwise.  It would be a less elegant solution, to the "problem" of raising kids.

[Vulcan]

Originally posted by Arlo
Despite an aggressive marketing campaign aimed at encouraging babies as young as 6 months to watch videos, there is no evidence that focusing on a screen is anything but bad for infants and toddlers. In a study released last August, University of Washington researchers found that babies between 8 and 16 months recognized an average of six to eight fewer words for every hour spent watching videos.  

Interesting study. Our son has had free reign of the TV since he was a toddler (he turns three tommorrow). Primaily we let him watch the educational disney channel, no advertising, and has some nice stuff like Little Einsteins (and I don't mind watching the girls on Hi5  )

He hasn't turned into a tv gazing gaping kid as predicted.  He likes to mix up his activities and prefers to relax in front of tv with one of us rather than watch it alone.

His vocabulary is quite suprising too, from example he identifies different types of birds, such as ducks, seagulls, hawks and owls. Now at no time has anyone taught him about owls, he must have picked this up from TV. There are many other words in his vocabulary we know he must of picked up from TV.

Maybe it's what they're letting them watch thats the issue.

[moot]

The types of media should be as varied as possible.. Obviously kids should learn to live in the real world that encompasses everything else, not only the laws of the cathodic tube's world.

 Kids learn multiple words and "things" of a same type at a time.  And they have a sense of numbers as early as three months.

My mother put on classical music on her belly while I was in there.. I can't say much about that, but I do remember loving to learn more of those books with an object for each letter, and from books that illustrated how things worked.  It was like a drug.. It set the cogs in my head in motion and I loved it.
This was very early.  Like 3-5 years old I think.. That I can recommend.

[Arlo]

Originally posted by Vulcan

Maybe it's what they're letting them watch thats the issue.

Could well be. I'm a strong advocate of public television. Even for adults. Good stuff there.

[Suave]

Moot it's interesting you bring that up. My TV stopped working years ago and I never replaced it. Last time I went to visit my family and their kids I was surprised by what total crap was coming out of the TV, guess I had just forgotten. As far as I'm concerned you could've just put a big neon sign in the living room that said "BUY STUPID CRAP" and that would've achieved the same thing as the TV but quieter. But the thing is, the TV was like the center of their domestic world. And I imagine most other families are the same; go to work/school come home do chores, eat, everybody sits around the TV, go to bed, repeat.

TV is just an animated billboard in your house. Britney spears and modern pop stars remind of NASCAR race cars, product logos stamped all over them. I think "Musicians" are created now ala american idol by the corperate merchants to promote consumption.

There are some usefull things on TV if you look for them. Sometimes I'll be at a hotel or a friends house and I'll catch something interesting on bbc or military channel or something. But it's rarely worth the time, it's just something to occupy oneself when you can't get back to your life at the moment.

[moot]

Originally posted by Suave
TV is just an animated billboard in your house. Britney spears and modern pop stars remind of NASCAR race cars, product logos stamped all over them.

Yeah.. Going round and round, leading to nowhere else than themselves.. An endless repetition.

[bozon]

It is past time for a serious national discussion about whether, as a nation, we truly value intellect and rationality.

You better have a quick snappy slogan for this discussion or you will not get the message through. Better hire some fancy Hollywood celebs to host it in order to attract ratings and commercial breaks to sponsor it: "the following intellectual discussion is brought to you by McDonalds. Big Mac, food for thought".

The situation is near hopeless. It can only be reset by a big nasty explosion that no one, especially the intellectuals would like to witness. Entertainment is more attractive than thinking, just like drugs are better relief than working to improve your life. This is how humans are built.

Schools do not need to teach that the Sun revolves around the earth. For the vast majority of people this will not make any difference in their life if they had it the wrong way around. What schools do need to teach, and here they fail miserably (for a good reason that will follow), is how to learn. Schools need to supply the tools, not the knowledge (this will come as a welcomed by product). They need to teach how to read a text or watch a film (text in its wider sense) and extract the main points out of it. To sort out the information by type (fact vs. deduction vs. opinion). To be able to retrace logical reasoning and find faults in it - if there are. And finally, to be able to extract previous information and use it on a new situation. No school that I know teach that way.

Schools will continue to be the way they are because the state prefers a system that indoctrinates its children for lowest kind of patriotism and complete lack of rational criticism. This works well for the men in power and the men with money by making the public easier to manage and reduce social mobility. There is simply no interest for a real change in those who have the power to do it without bloodshed.

[bozon]

Originally posted by Suave
... But the thing is, the TV was like the center of their domestic world.  

I don't have a TV for years now. Just never got one since I moved out of my parents place. My wife and I always find it interesting how in a house that have a TV, there always seem to be some form of shrine built around it.

Old living room furniture had a place for the TV that was part of a cupboard that you could close and hide the TV. Most of todays living rooms display the TV as a centerpiece for the whole room. The pride and main focus of the room design. No designer in their right mind would imagine their customer would wish to NOT see the TV.

[lazs2]

comes down to socialist schools in the end don't it?   teach down to the dumbest.. make it so schools get paid by the head and by attendance and this is what you get.

make sure those teachers get more and more money for working less hours tho... new holidays and teachers days and yoga days.

lazs