When torturing is OK for feds shouldn't it be allowed for others too?

[Arlo]

True enough, but it wasn't founded on the rights of Achmed Saheed Skyhook to slaughter women and children---if they want to be treated like real POW's, try wearing a uniform, attacking OTHER people wearing uniforms, and not hiding behind women and children---Rich pretty well states my view--I doubt there is going to be a 'meeting-of-the-minds' on this subject

Apparently not.

So keep spinning straw. You could have just as easily posted that it wasn't founded on the rights of domestic murderers, rapists, robbers and drug addicts .... for that matter speeders, wife-beaters and those who don't pay their taxes ... so why even bother with a public defender or a trial because:

a: They're all guilty
b: You never are

 Your view is that civilized law has had it's day and should die. Mine is .... what America did you grow up in?

[AKIron]

We've been down this road before but what the heck. Terrorists are not enemy soldiers. They are more like spies than anything else. I suppose some of you feel hanging is way out of line also? Maybe we oughta give 'em a choice? Hanging or waterboarding. Which would you pick?

[Arlo]

If we are at war with a country that tortures our people then we should do the same. You folks that think your taking the high road by not doing so will kill more of your own.

You simply weaken your side because of your personal feelings. War is not a pretty thing... no matter if your on the wining side or the losing side. Decesions have to be made that under other circumstances would be considered cruel and unusual.

I was once asked if I thought my truck was worth shooting and killing a guy for just because he was stealing it. I did not make that determination... the guy stealing the truck made the decision that he thought his life was a decent trade. I was just protecting my belongings.

One of the oddest comparisons I've ever heard unless you caught him, tied him up and dunked him repeatedly in your bathtub without calling the cops before you shot him.

You've got it backwards anyway. Not conforming to the broken morals of an enemy is not weakness, it's strength. And it's been a long-time American trait and tradition. If I have anything to say about it, it will continue to be.

Carry on.

[Arlo]

We've been down this road before but what the heck. Terrorists are not enemy soldiers. They are more like spies than anything else. I suppose some of you feel hanging is way out of line also? Maybe we oughta give 'em a choice? Hanging or waterboarding. Which would you pick?

Doesn't matter what they are. You don't torture someone in custody! Can you get that? Himmler couldn't either.

[Arlo]

Can you name one war that was won by using civility and decency?

Well hell then ... can you name one that was won on purely the merits of torture?

[Arlo]

how then do you suggest we acquire the needed information sir?

We've been aquiring needed information without torture for years now. Welcome to the nineteenth century ... up to the twenty-first.

[NUKE]

Well hell then ... can you name one that was won on purely the merits of torture?

I'd bet my life that all nations that have ever won a war used torture and any other thing they could dream of in order to win.

That's just real life.

[Arlo]

War is brutal and the idea is to win at all costs. That's just the way it is.

No, it isn't. All costs has never meant succumbing to methods that threaten the very American idealism this nation was founded on. Many an American died in battle saving someone else from the attrocities you claim are a necessary evil. Those Americans didn't seem to think so.

[midnight Target]

I can't believe people are actually defending torture.

Sad .. really.

[Arlo]

I'd bet my life that all nations that have ever won a war used torture and any other thing they could dream of in order to win.

That's just real life.

Real life is that if torture, for any reason, is given judicial sanction in this nation then it stops being the America I grew up in. Rationalize it all you want. I'm against you.

[NUKE]

No, it isn't. All costs has never meant succumbing to methods that threaten the very American idealism this nation was founded on. Many an American died in battle saving someone else from the attrocities you claim are a necessary evil. Those Americans didn't seem to think so.

Really? War is war and to win a war, you have to do anything it takes. Like firebombing Japanese and German civilians by the hundreds of thousands....and dropping atomic bombs. That's the kind of things that were needed to win your current freedom.

Like it or not, the world has always been ruled by absolute force.

[NUKE]

I can't believe people are actually defending torture.

Sad .. really.

Maybe you would think differently if it meant the differnce between life and death for your family.

[Arlo]

Really? War is war and to win a war, you have to do anything it takes. Like firebombing Japanese and German civilians by the hundreds of thousands....and dropping atomic bombs. That's the kind of things that were needed to win your current freedom.

Like it or not, the world has always been ruled by absolute force.

Spoken like a true Fascist, Nuke. Think about it.

[Arlo]

Maybe you would think differently if it meant the differnce between life and death for your family.

You're watching waaaaaaaaaay too much 24.

[Lumpy]

Look up "highway of death" then report back.

War is brutal and the idea is to win at all costs. That's just the way it is.

Killing enemy soldiers, even from afar, is not indecent and certainly not uncivilized, no matter how defenseless they are. Torturing captured enemy soldiers, criminals or whoever is indecent and uncivilized no matter how you rationalize it. The sole super power of this world should not need to use such methods to win against third-world nations or a ragtag band of terrorists. Every time I visit this forum and read opinions like yours I'm reminded of just how completely the terrorists have won. Hitler couldn't do it. Hirohito couldn't either. Nor could the once mighty Soviet Union. But a small band of determined fanatics have managed to turn most Americans into a fearful heard of sheep, obsessed with protecting themselves from an almost negligible threat to their lives; now willing to become monsters and drag the rest of their nation down with them. Congrats Osama.