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Author Topic: Plane package for 1.07  (Read 3760 times)

Offline lasse

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Plane package for 1.07
« on: February 28, 2001, 02:13:00 AM »
I know that 1.06 not yet is released, and probably HTC already have laid their plans for 1.07, but:      

I really think it is in its place that we get some early planes in AH.(I for one miss them).

The reason for flying early planes are naturally to gain more perkpoints, so they can fly their late war (wet) dream.
Naturally, early planes should earn ALOT more perks when they kill a late war plane, and thus have the odds against them.

So I think the 1.07 release should be an early war release, naturally with the obligatory *perk rides* included  

So in 1.07 I would be very happy to se:


Spitfire I (With the carburetor overflow modelled)
Hurricane I and II (With the carburetor overflow modelled)
Messerschmitt BF 110
Brewster Buffalo
P40 B Tomahawk
P40 E Kittyhawk
Stuka (Tank killer version)
Junkers JU 52, slow but have (some) guns.
Early Zero
I'm not so into the Italian and russian planes but some of the early versions of these should also be included.

I doubt that we will see such a release, but dang it, it would be cool, I've always been a Early war fan  

Best time of a tour in WB was always the 2-3 first days  


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The Wild Vikings
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lasse-

[This message has been edited by lasse (edited 02-28-2001).]
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Offline Vermillion

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« Reply #1 on: February 28, 2001, 06:47:00 AM »
*sarcasm mode on*

Oh YES, just what we absolutely NEED!!

MORE US, British, and German aircraft, I mean we are only getting 4-5 of them in this release already, and lets not mention that they already totally dominate the current planeset. MORE, MORE, MORE.

*sarcasm mode off*

Sorry Lasse, not picking on you, its just a sore issue with me.  The last thing we need right now, is another heavily Euro dominated planeset release.

The Russian and Japanese planesets are extremely lacking right now, and if we ever want to do Pac or Eastern front Scenarios, they need serious beefing up.

At a minimum we need these types added to the planesets, to flesh out our mid/late war sets before we even begin to think about going back to an early war setup.

Japanese:

Dive bomber - D4Y "Judy"  
Torpedo Bomber - B6N "Jill"
Bomber - P1Y "Frances" or Ki-67 "Peggy
Army Fighter - Ki-84 Hayate or Ki-61-II "Tony"

Russian:
Attack Plane - IL-10 or IL-2
Bomber - Pe-2 or Tu-2

Lets be fair to the Italian players too, so how about a G55 Centauro.

And thats just a minimum to run a PAC or Eastern Front. It would also be nice to have the FM2 Wildcat and the S2B Helldiver (ick.. did I say American aircaft   ) for PAC events.

I don't hate early war stuff, I just want us to finish out the sets we have (so we can do scenarios) before we go off down the early war path.

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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
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Offline gatt

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« Reply #2 on: February 28, 2001, 06:53:00 AM »
Verm, we can wait till the plane set will be more balanced (more Japanese and Russian stuff, that is) ... we can wait ... one moment ... hmmmmm ... pfffffffffffffffft ... arghhhhhhhh ... SUPERFLY BRING THE G.55 ASAP !!!  
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"And one of the finest aircraft I ever flew was the Macchi C.205. Oh, beautiful. And here you had the perfect combination of italian styling and german engineering .... it really was a delight to fly ... and we did tests on it and were most impressed." - Captain Eric Brown

Offline lasse

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« Reply #3 on: February 28, 2001, 08:18:00 AM »
None taken, Vermillion  

I agree, we should absolutely get more of those planes you mention, but my knowledge  of those planes is rather small, but we sure should include them.

Quote myself:
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I'm not so into the Italian and Russian planes but some of the early versions of these should also be included.
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Anyway I really miss some early planes, I think those are more fun to fly, more challenging.

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The Wild Vikings
Commanding Officer
lasse-

[This message has been edited by lasse (edited 02-28-2001).]
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You smell that? Do you smell that?
Napalm, son. Nothing else in the world smells like that.
I love the smell of napalm in the morning.
The smell, you know that gasoline smell, smelled like victory.

lazs

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« Reply #4 on: February 28, 2001, 08:24:00 AM »
I believe that the next planes to be added to the arena will be the F86 and the Mig15   They will cost a few perk points tho.

I love the early war planes too lasse but the guns on a Spit one are not even capable of penetrating later war armor.   The Zeke we have is a very late war version and it is allmost never used.   If not for the carrier it would be totally shelved as would any early war plane introduced.  Only the very eccentric would fly em in the current arena.  The idiotic perk sytem will just make things worse.
lazs
lazs

[This message has been edited by lazs (edited 02-28-2001).]
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Moose11

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Plane package for 1.07
« Reply #5 on: February 28, 2001, 09:15:00 AM »
Hey Verm, why a helldiver?

The Dauntless was superior and racked up the most a2g kills in the war if I remember right. (at least on the pacific side)
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Offline Torgo

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« Reply #6 on: February 28, 2001, 09:43:00 AM »
Yeah, the Helldiver is pointless for a wide variety of reasons:

1) Wasn't around at all for all of the interesting, balanced CV battles (Coral Sea through Eastern Solomons and Santa Cruz.)

2) Was considered one of the great disappointments of the war; hated by pilots, in practical terms it wasn't any more capable than the Dauntless. A real boondoggle.

3) By the time it came out, Dive bombers were basically obsolete; nothing the Helldiver can do, that can't be done by a Corsair even better. Fighters began carrying large bomb loads and taking their jobs. Hence, very late in the war, CV groups were simply getting rid of their divebombers totally in favor of multirole aircraft.
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Offline Vermillion

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« Reply #7 on: February 28, 2001, 09:55:00 AM »
Why the Helldiver?

1.) Its never been done before  
2.) The S2B Helldiver fits our mid/late planeset better.
3.) The Helldiver has better guns (20mm on S2B) and armor/passive protection (Dauntless has very little of these)
4.) More Helldivers were used (would need to check hard numbers on this, its just my impression and I could be wrong)

Just my opinon   I am very fond of the Dauntless though

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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
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Offline Dingy

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« Reply #8 on: February 28, 2001, 10:00:00 AM »
Verm,

Why the "Judy" and "Jill" when the "Kate" and "Val" saw much more carrier action?  

I agree with Lasse, I would love to see many more early war planes for scenario purposes but I've been aching for a reenactment of the Battle for Midway now that we got carriers!  

All we need are the Kates and Vals and the F4F and F2A!  

Im all for early war planes...just gimme scenario fodder!

-Ding
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Offline Westy

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« Reply #9 on: February 28, 2001, 10:05:00 AM »
 IMO Dauntless is a better choice for scenarios as it was used by USAAF and USN in just about every theatre excpet ETO.

 But the "Beast" was a better plane, on paper anyway. As we do not model manufacturing defects many of it's detracting <cough> graces would not be a problem.  

-Westy
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Offline LePaul

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« Reply #10 on: February 28, 2001, 10:14:00 AM »
<Dream mode on>

Mmmm, I can't wait for this war to progress into another server with a Korea War theme.  Must...fly....super....sabre. ...

While these planes we have are great, Im really itching for all the great gameplay we have in here, but with jets.  No one has really made a good early jet game (the most recent one by Empire really sucked).  Just imagine the crying a poor jet driver would do if any part of his loooong runway were fragged  

I'm not asking for F-15s and F-16s (yet!) but MiG 15s, F-86's, Scorpions and such....mmmm...maybe someday.

<Dream mode off>

I'm sorry, I seem to have drifted off, what were we talking about  



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Paul J. Busiere

Aces High Arena handle:  BD5Pilot
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BD-5 "T" (TurboProp) 90% complete, first flight in 2001 (We hope!)
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Offline Vermillion

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« Reply #11 on: February 28, 2001, 10:32:00 AM »
Dingy, for the same basic reasons as the Helldiver.

They go better with rest of the planesets which is centered around mid/late war.

The Kate and Val weren't used more, its just that they were used more in the "famous" carrier battles. ie Pearl Harbor, Coral Sea & Midway.

Really it all just goes with the idea of fleshing out the set you have, THEN going back and starting to model all the early war stuff from BoB to Midway.

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Vermillion
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Offline Dingy

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« Reply #12 on: February 28, 2001, 10:47:00 AM »
 
Quote
Originally posted by Vermillion:
The Kate and Val weren't used more, its just that they were used more in the "famous" carrier battles. ie Pearl Harbor, Coral Sea & Midway.

Really it all just goes with the idea of fleshing out the set you have, THEN going back and starting to model all the early war stuff from BoB to Midway.


Well I understand your viewpoint, Verm and agree to some extent BUT....

If we really want to get some good Pacific scenarios going, I'd love to see those planes.  Im just starting to get a little (ok Im getting ALOT) bored with the MA and was looking to get involved in another scenario.

-Ding
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Offline anRky

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« Reply #13 on: February 28, 2001, 11:38:00 AM »
Dingy wrote:
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...Im just starting to get a little (ok Im getting ALOT) bored with the MA ...
------------------------------------------

I was bored with the MA before I even installed AH on my machine.

anRky
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Offline Vermillion

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« Reply #14 on: February 28, 2001, 11:55:00 AM »
Well guys, all I can say, is that baring catastrophic problems, the next scenario should be announced soon.  

Torgo, I agree that the HellDiver was not any more capable (as a whole) than the Dauntless.  

And I also agree that late in the war, heavy fighters (F4U's, P51's, P47,P38's) were more effective and also had the benefit of being multirole. But that "benefit" in real life, turns into "detriment" in many scenarios.

The way I see it, and I'm sure some will disagree, using heavy fighters instead of a dedicated attack aircraft is bad.

As a scenario designer, you try and establish you "target" forcebalance, and then everything else is designed around that. Rules, Points, pretty much everything. The problem becomes that the heavy fighter-bombers can rapidly, and at need, fit into either "fighter" or "attack" categories. Thereby throwing the forcebalances off.

In many scenarios, the CO is then tempted to use them in a manner that disrupts the intended framework.

If however, you keep them in dedicated attack craft, they are not tempted to use their "attack" planes in a fighter role, but keep them in the role they were designed for.

Does that make sense? I know I'm rambling.

Just a personal design philosophy.  

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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
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