Author Topic: Actress Brigitte Bardot on Trial in France for Offending Islam  (Read 2290 times)

Offline moot

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Re: Actress Brigitte Bardot on Trial in France for Offending Islam
« Reply #75 on: April 17, 2008, 10:58:16 PM »
I don't have a problem with her complaining. I have a problem with the exact facts not being reported in this thread, which leads to disinformation. I don't have a problem with it being the French, nor Bardot, nor muslims, I just think it'd be a shame if you guys were misinformed from this small fact here and from there let ideas grow on the wrong path.

I'm not afraid of muslims and do see the forest and the trees and the fungus on the bark, too.  I grew up in the melting pot of France, I think I mentioned this a bunch of times already, so I won't repeat the details again. 
The "problem with Muslims" in France could be resumed (it can't, but ill do it for the sake of conversation here) to a very plain fact that is true in any other country on this planet.  Both sides reap what they sow.  The french have their peculiarities, so do the maghrebins and other middle easterners, mix it all together in specific quantities and circumstances, and you cook up something that might have been different under a different recipe.

I don't deny that Islam has some (imo) back-asswards principles to it, at very fundamental levels, but getting in that argument would bring out the scholars, against which I have nothing to back what I'm nearly certain of, except about a dozen years lived on and off everywhere between podunk country side villages, dangerous suburbs in the middle of Paris' bowels, and very rich higher class families. 

All things considered, my only real problem is with misinformation.  Those backasswards muslims you guys rant about are as misinformed about you guys as you guys are about at least a few pretty critical things.  It's obvious it's not interesting to study things to such a depth just for the sake of it, but nonetheless that's the only way to make an accurate assessment of things.
You can't take a whole country's miriad of cultural elements and pick one, out of context, to extrapolate everything else from it.

Back to the freedom of speech thing - Bardot's a stupid old b***. There's few ways to say it more accurately.  Her problem isn't with criticizing islam or muslims, it's that the TRUE rationale behind her statements is racism, a racism that's the same affront to Good with a capital G that leads the US to do stuff like liberate some ragheads on the other side of the planet, etc.

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The author's following novel, Plateforme (2001), earned him a wider reputation. It is a romance, told mostly in the first-person by an aging male arts administrator, with many sex scenes and an approbation of prostitution and sex tourism. The novel's depiction of life and its explicit criticism of Islam and the Muslim faith, together with an interview its author gave to the magazine Lire, led to accusations against Houellebecq by several organisations, including France's Human Rights League, the Mecca-based World Islamic League and the mosques of Paris and Lyon. Charges were brought to trial, in circumstances reminiscent of the controversy over Salman Rushdie's novel The Satanic Verses at the end of the 1980s; but a panel of three judges, delivering their verdict to a packed Paris courtroom, acquitted the author of having provoked racial hatred, ascribing Houellebecq's opinions to the legitimate right of criticizing religions.

"... but the fear is allowed to rule." And there's truth to that Gunthr, the everyday average French folk's errors with respect to muslim immigrants are often enough only due to them being afraid of some strange people with strange customs.  The problem here is that even though you made a good diagnosis, Bardot's saying something similar, on the surface, is just a coincidence.  It's pretty unlikely her intentions are defendable as yours probably are.

Hell, I shouldn't have to argue this.. Check out Jean Marie Le Pen, yourself.  That's who Bardot's emulating. :lol
« Last Edit: April 17, 2008, 11:06:52 PM by moot »
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Offline moot

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Re: Actress Brigitte Bardot on Trial in France for Offending Islam
« Reply #76 on: April 17, 2008, 11:15:25 PM »
We now have roughly 15% of the population of mexico living here ILLEGALLY and with them, they bring crime, poverty and disease.  We have had an administration refuse to enforce our own laws, and those running for the white house in november have been right in line with this lawlessness.  We have a few of our border patrol agents who are now political prisoners who are in jail for enforcing our laws and shooting an armed drug smuggler in the rear-end!
I lived in Phoenix for a while, I know about that first hand.. and 15%, if that number's right, is pretty bad. 
What if an outsider picked up on this factoid and assumed it was the will of the American people?  You'll agree that's an overly simplified way of seeing it, right?

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Unregulated immigration cannot work - ever - particularly when the immigrants do not wish to assimilate or wish to do harm to your country and government.
The new french prez knows this and, from the start, went for a pretty stringent reform of immigration policies.  Among other supporting evidence, he cited specificaly the US for biasing their immigration to 'useful' additions to the country. He caught a bunch of flak for this, but the fact is he's right.. "Why should France have to bear the burden of the rest of the world?", as he put it.  But if I hadn't told you this, would you have accounted for it in your big picture of the way things are playing out in france?
« Last Edit: April 17, 2008, 11:19:00 PM by moot »
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Offline bj229r

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Re: Actress Brigitte Bardot on Trial in France for Offending Islam
« Reply #77 on: April 17, 2008, 11:20:06 PM »
Quote
.....the everyday average French folk's errors with respect to muslim immigrants are often enough only due to them being afraid of some strange people with strange customs....
...customs like....burning people's cars and blowing stuff up :aok---ok, I'll grant the need to pray 5X a day---but telling women to get out during this time, demanding areas where said prayers can be performed and 'footbaths' can be acquired, demanding Sharia law----They are trying to turn <insert fairly normal-western country here>  a nice NEW country into the chithole they left behind in Africa. Perhaps they might take 10 seconds to look at western culture and take note of how we don't live in huts with dirt floors, or stone our women for wearing nail polish. Bardot is probably all the things Moot says--(because she was once pretty doesnt make her nice) but it doesnt make the encroachment of Islam into western society any less troubling
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Offline moot

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Re: Actress Brigitte Bardot on Trial in France for Offending Islam
« Reply #78 on: April 17, 2008, 11:22:57 PM »
But that's not the way all muslims are, and the proportion that isn't that way isn't negligible.  I'm pretty sure it's not a minority, and as far as I know it is probably the majority.

I think one thing that's underestimated is the demographics factor.. You might be right, but if you're only 10 versus 1000, you're gonna get a footnote at most, in the history books, as far as who was right is concerned.  Spelling things out so that the rationale that makes you 'right' is so transparent and undeniable to even the most back asswards people, in that 10:1000 case, may just not be enough.
« Last Edit: April 17, 2008, 11:26:36 PM by moot »
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Offline bj229r

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Re: Actress Brigitte Bardot on Trial in France for Offending Islam
« Reply #79 on: April 17, 2008, 11:25:35 PM »
Can't speak to France, but in UK and parts of USA, said squeaky wheel is getting the grease
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Offline CptTrips

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Re: Actress Brigitte Bardot on Trial in France for Offending Islam
« Reply #80 on: April 17, 2008, 11:33:01 PM »


Moot, I don't know the lady, but I have no reason to doubt she is a vile pig if you say so. 

I also don't care.

Unless she was explicitly calling for acts of violence, I don't think her, or anyone else, should ever have to face arrest for expressing an idea.  No matter how unpopular.

France is entitled to its own laws, but I'd have thought there were certain ideals that should be so ingrained in Western societies as to be universal.

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Offline moot

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Re: Actress Brigitte Bardot on Trial in France for Offending Islam
« Reply #81 on: April 17, 2008, 11:42:36 PM »
You're probably right.. It doesn't matter what road something took, if it ends up in the ditch. 
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Offline LTARGlok

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Re: Actress Brigitte Bardot on Trial in France for Offending Islam
« Reply #82 on: April 18, 2008, 02:01:13 AM »
Nope 74

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OMG, are you sure that the figure on the left is not Jabba the Hut?????????

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Offline straffo

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Re: Actress Brigitte Bardot on Trial in France for Offending Islam
« Reply #83 on: April 18, 2008, 03:44:14 AM »
// to lot of people who posted in this thread

Why are you speaking of free speech ? it's an American phantasm not existing in France.


She will be judged and the judgement will be guilty or not according to our laws not your sentiments.

Offline SD67

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Re: Actress Brigitte Bardot on Trial in France for Offending Islam
« Reply #84 on: April 18, 2008, 04:15:34 AM »
I have to agree with Straffo here, the freedom of speech you hold so high exists only in the United Sates of America.
We have no such freedom here in Australia no matter how much the powers that be try to tell you.
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Offline Wotan

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Re: Actress Brigitte Bardot on Trial in France for Offending Islam
« Reply #85 on: April 18, 2008, 04:29:22 AM »
Quote
She will be judged and the judgement will be guilty or not according to our laws not your sentiments.

As she should be. As I said above this isn't her first offense. She knows well the laws she violated. At best she will be fined yet again.

Offline Saintaw

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Re: Actress Brigitte Bardot on Trial in France for Offending Islam
« Reply #86 on: April 18, 2008, 08:45:55 AM »
Yadayayayda... free speech is ok, but burn a piece of cloth with stars on it and see the folks posting here go running around with their hair on fire. pot, kettle etc...
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Offline moot

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Re: Actress Brigitte Bardot on Trial in France for Offending Islam
« Reply #87 on: April 18, 2008, 09:24:05 AM »
Saw, you know that's not every single american... You're doing the same thing they're doing with the free speech thing.
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Offline Holden McGroin

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Re: Actress Brigitte Bardot on Trial in France for Offending Islam
« Reply #88 on: April 18, 2008, 09:44:03 AM »
Yadayayayda... free speech is ok, but burn a piece of cloth with stars on it and see the folks posting here go running around with their hair on fire. pot, kettle etc...

Burning a flag is not illegal.  Your comparison is not valid.
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Re: Actress Brigitte Bardot on Trial in France for Offending Islam
« Reply #89 on: April 18, 2008, 09:54:10 AM »
Puts me in the mood to go watch some old Bardot films. I had forgotten how totally smokin she was at one time.
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