the world's largest and most expensive science experiment starting soon

[crockett]

Moot,

It's not worth much, if anything.

Wasting money and mental energy on a multi billion dollar intellectual jerk off is just a scam. Privately funded science is one thing. Publicly funded white elephants are another. When the amount of energy and funds invested in academic mental masturbation starts to equal the GDP of a small industrialized nation I start to hope they have at least a cogent hypothesis to prove.

You do realize even if this whole thing is a flop and the flip the switch and then nothing happens. We will still get a completely new Internet out of the deal, that's capable of transferring a full DVD in less than 5 seconds? In fact it's already here because they had to build it so they could deal with all the data this hardon thing is gonna spit out.

That alone will more than make up for the money spent because it will change the way computers are used and how they are connected with each other across the world.

[Strip]

Antigravity?  Just my speculation - but Feynman himself toured the CERN facilities where his theories were to be put to the test, so he was aware of the intended experiments, and Feynman himself pretty much categoricaly said he saw no way for anti-gravity to happen.

I would be very curious to know how Feynman toured a portion of the facility that wasnt even in constuction at the time of is death?

You do realize even if this whole thing is a flop and the flip the switch and then nothing happens. We will still get a completely new Internet out of the deal, that's capable of transferring a full DVD in less than 5 seconds? In fact it's already here because they had to build it so they could deal with all the data this hardon thing is gonna spit out.

That alone will more than make up for the money spent because it will change the way computers are used and how they are connected with each other across the world.

Invention by necessity....very good point Crockett.

Strip

[moot]

Sheesh.. Ground breaking physics and some guys' first thought is p0rn

Russian & Strip, I can't remember where I first read him saying so, but there's an interview of him saying that pretty much word for word.  He didn't visit the present LHC obviously, but did tour some previous test site, about which there's some anecdote in the interview which mentions that his theories would be tested on that site.
I'll try and see if it's on youtube or something.

[Strip]

I see what your saying Moot.

My only counter point is to mention the technology 20 later is light years ahead of what Feynman could have imagined. LHC wasnt even a off the back of napkins then.

Strip

[Simaril]

And before anyone reacts, it's a joke.

[moot]

Don't quote me on this, but I think 20 years ago they were already done (relatively) with theories that are still untested.. Einstein's theories are still being tested by Gravity Probe B, for example.  Gravity waves are another one that technology still hasn't caught up to provide the means to test.
Feynman reducing the probability of anti-gravity to "I can't think of any way for it to happen" (or something like that) is one of those times where credible specialists who usualy avoid absolutes will see a strong enough probability to bite the bullet and use an absolute like that.

Feynman makes an anti grav quip at some hippy somewhere in this dcoumentary: http://youtube.com/watch?v=knDXAr4ltMA&feature=PlayList&p=856EE31881996E0B&index=0&playnext=1

[Strip]

     The Higgs Boson theory dates back to Feynman but there are a few new theories that just really came into the full view of the physics community just 10 years ago. The old LEP site (the site were LHC now sits) came online a year after Feynman's death. His theories are are almost a full generation behind the current experiments. Most have stood the test of time but others have been modifed or set aside. One cannot denie is opinion still hold considerable weight but some disagree with his anti-matter beliefs.

Strip

[WilldCrd]

I read recently about the new "internet 2" setup they had to put in to just transmit the data from the LHC Its 100% all fiber optic, no copper in the loop. They only recently got THAT completed plus having all the larg teribit HD's to store it. Even then it will take a looooooong time to go thru all the data they will collect

[Thruster]

Sorry moot, I rarely maintain/destroy home appliances with completely inappropriate utensils while inebriated. That's a lesson I learned in my teens when I started using hand tools for their intended purpose. I'll have to respectfully concede that one. 


I'm familiar enough with the science to be intrigued but I don't personally feel confirming the theoretical existence of the effects of theoretical subatomic elements is worth the investment. I've always felt that the most useful science is spawned from the private sector. I'm not against mankind seeking all there is to know but it's gone way beyond the $64,000 question. As I understand there are more breakthroughs than the data issue with regards to construction, EMR isolation and insulation, geology, etc. Innovation happens. I just happen to believe these colliders are a ham fisted methodology that can only necessitate an even greater commitment in order to start to apply any discoveries that are made. These guys only think they know what they are looking for evidence of, much less do they have any idea which direction any application of this data will take.

And don't pick on Maria, even she knows that hammers and chisels belong in the hands of a professional, sounds like she could teach you a thing or two.

[Gh0stFT]

something will be discovered for sure, and we are close to 2012!

There was this Maya prophecy topic not long ago here, they predict that in
the year 2012, there will be a critical mass of holes that will create this
giant tear in the fabric. We will have gone beyond technology as we know it.
We will have gone beyond time and money. <- allready gone seeing the cost of LHC

That dont sound like a Doomsday, rather a new discovery,
but back to the topic 

[Russian]

.... I've always felt that the most useful science is spawned from the private sector. ...

If only that was true.....

[bozon]

I'm familiar enough with the science to be intrigued but I don't personally feel confirming the theoretical existence of the effects of theoretical subatomic elements is worth the investment.

It is going to investigate more than the Higgs boson. They didn't build the machine just for that.

[myelo]

I would be very curious to know how Feynman toured a portion of the facility that wasnt even in constuction at the time of is death?

Dude, he's like, a physicist. Hello? Spacetime is totally NOT a problem for him.

[Mini D]

It's important to keep unraveling the mysteries of the universe. It's what the human race thrives on. There will be excellent learning that comes from it. Of course, there will also be oddities discovered that have no explanation which means there'll be a whole new slew of holes for theorists to fill.

I wonder if anyone is tracking the number of the "this proved a theory right" discoveries to "oh... so that's how it works" discoveries ratio. Most of my work with science and scientists has spawned the latter, though a theory was needed to make the discovery.

[moot]

Thruster if you weren't so busy trying to find any way to talk smack you might have taken the 0.5 seconds it takes to lookup what the CERN LHC is about. 
Either way, you aren't a specialist.. For all your 'down to earth' pragmatism you didn't pay the years of study those professionals did to gain authority on what the LHC means to shed light on, and so can't do much more than make a few bytes' worth of uninformed protesting noise about it, somewhere on the intardnet.  200M euros+ aren't given to random scientists with random experimental ideas. 

I wonder if anyone is tracking the number of the "this proved a theory right" discoveries to "oh... so that's how it works" discoveries ratio. Most of my work with science and scientists has spawned the latter, though a theory was needed to make the discovery.

All that matters is progress.