South Osetia under attack

[Sundowner]

   
US forces to deliver Georgia aid
US President Bush says military aircraft and naval forces are bringing aid to Georgia, following its conflict with Russia.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/

I wonder..is it wise to bring US and Russian military forces into close physical proximity with each other at this time?

Anyone else see how this could lead to an "accident" between the two forces and cause a situation that may not end well?

Do we REALLY want this possibility? 

Regards,
Sun

[Elfie]

Anyone else see how this could lead to an "accident" between the two forces and cause a situation that may not end well?

I think it's quite possible that instead of the Georgians being *vermin* or *rabid dogs* (both of which speak volumes about how *someone* views others outside his country) that a simple accident by one side or the other has caused all of this to happen.

[Russian]

I think it's quite possible that instead of the Georgians being *vermin* or *rabid dogs* (both of which speak volumes about how *someone* views others outside his country) that a simple accident by one side or the other has caused all of this to happen.

A skirmish with small arms can happen as a mistake. Rolling tanks cannot.

[Hangtime]

I think it's quite possible that instead of the Georgians being *vermin* or *rabid dogs* (both of which speak volumes about how *someone* views others outside his country) that a simple accident by one side or the other has caused all of this to happen.

Elfie, I dunno about 'accident'.. sure looks to me like the Russki's were rigging the deck. That's my opinion.. have no facts to back it beyond the stuff we've seen already... motor rifle divisions pre-positioned, etc.

Regarding the 'aid'... that may be a US exploitation of the loopholes of the Montreux Convention.. carrying humanitarian aid would be the only way we can get Warships (like a CVBG) into the Black Sea.

I hope web do... the russians will scream bloody murder; but bending the rules is a gimmick the russki's have no shame doing when it's to their benefit; and the presence of a CVBG there will give the russians a chance to chew on their own dictum: 'Choose Georgia or Russia'. They'll get to make the same choice...US or Georgia.

Choose wisely, Comrade.

[Elfie]

Elfie, I dunno about 'accident'.. sure looks to me like the Russki's were rigging the deck. That's my opinion.. have no facts to back it beyond the stuff we've seen already... motor rifle divisions pre-positioned, etc.

I think the Russians were just waiting for the excuse they needed.....prepositioned units, handing out passports, etc.

*PS. The accident I was referring to was between the Georgian army and the separatists.

[Hangtime]

I think the Russians were just waiting for the excuse they needed.....prepositioned units, handing out passports, etc.

*PS. The accident I was referring to was between the Georgian army and the separatists.

It was no 'accident' the Georgian military was met with 'separatist' artillery. The russki's have yet to explain how the separatists managed to get arty, tanks and btr's.  Must have 'liberated' it from the sound asleep russians... who decided to get more from the georgians. Last I heard, the russki's were emptying out the arsenals and barracks at Gori to re-supply the separatists.. seems they're running low on ammo while raping and burning uncontested villages over the last three days.

[Elfie]

It was no 'accident' the Georgian military was met with 'separatist' artillery. The russki's have yet to explain how the separatists managed to get arty, tanks and btr's.

I haven't seen information on that.


Links Please!


 

[Hangtime]

LOL Elfie. My apologies.

GEORGIA: TENSIONS FLARE OVER BREAKAWAY SOUTH OSSETIA
Giorgi Lomsadze 8/04/08


In the wake of an armed clash in Georgia’s separatist-minded territory of South Ossetia, all sides are eschewing conciliatory gestures and are instead embracing aggressive rhetoric.

Accounts of the number killed and injured vary. South Ossetia claims six civilians killed and 22 injured after Georgian forces reportedly fired on and later shelled the South Ossetian capital, Tskhinvali, during the night of August 1-2. Tbilisi, for its part, claims that six civilians and one policeman were injured when South Ossetian forces allegedly shelled four Georgian-controlled villages in the conflict zone.

Tbilisi initially blamed Moscow for the clash, saying Russia seeks to subvert recently intensified international conflict resolution efforts. Tskhinvali, on the other hand, charges that Tbilisi is trying to make a grab for South Ossetia. Separatist leaders vowed to retaliate. "We are not going to put up with this anymore," South Ossetia’s de facto interior minister, Mikhail Mindzayev, said in an interview with Media News. "Should another provocation take place, we will strike back at Georgian cities."

South Ossetian separatists have also pledged a general troop mobilization if another clash occurs, and warned that they will seek military assistance from the fellow breakaway region of Abkhazia, as well as from Russia’s North Caucasus area, including neighboring North Ossetia. Georgian media sources have reported a build-up of Russian military forces on North Ossetia’s border with South Ossetia. The information could not be independently confirmed.

On August 3, South Ossetia’s separatist authorities declined to meet with Georgian State Minister for Territorial Integration Temur Iakobashvili for direct talks about the situation in the conflict zone.[/b]

Timeline and article list here:

http://www.eurasianet.org/resource/georgia/articles/index.shtml

[FrodeMk3]

Elfie, I dunno about 'accident'.. sure looks to me like the Russki's were rigging the deck. That's my opinion.. have no facts to back it beyond the stuff we've seen already... motor rifle divisions pre-positioned, etc.

Regarding the 'aid'... that may be a US exploitation of the loopholes of the Montreux Convention.. carrying humanitarian aid would be the only way we can get Warships (like a CVBG) into the Black Sea.

I hope web do... the russians will scream bloody murder; but bending the rules is a gimmick the russki's have no shame doing when it's to their benefit; and the presence of a CVBG there will give the russians a chance to chew on their own dictum: 'Choose Georgia or Russia'. They'll get to make the same choice...US or Georgia.

Choose wisely, Comrade.

Hangtime, I was reading in another article (I think I posted part of it a page or two back) That stated that the Black Sea is too shallow for our CV's, but I haven't seen anything else about it.

[Elfie]

LOL Elfie. My apologies.

GEORGIA: TENSIONS FLARE OVER BREAKAWAY SOUTH OSSETIA
Giorgi Lomsadze 8/04/08


In the wake of an armed clash in Georgia’s separatist-minded territory of South Ossetia, all sides are eschewing conciliatory gestures and are instead embracing aggressive rhetoric.

Accounts of the number killed and injured vary. South Ossetia claims six civilians killed and 22 injured after Georgian forces reportedly fired on and later shelled the South Ossetian capital, Tskhinvali, during the night of August 1-2. Tbilisi, for its part, claims that six civilians and one policeman were injured when South Ossetian forces allegedly shelled four Georgian-controlled villages in the conflict zone.

Tbilisi initially blamed Moscow for the clash, saying Russia seeks to subvert recently intensified international conflict resolution efforts. Tskhinvali, on the other hand, charges that Tbilisi is trying to make a grab for South Ossetia. Separatist leaders vowed to retaliate. "We are not going to put up with this anymore," South Ossetia’s de facto interior minister, Mikhail Mindzayev, said in an interview with Media News. "Should another provocation take place, we will strike back at Georgian cities."

South Ossetian separatists have also pledged a general troop mobilization if another clash occurs, and warned that they will seek military assistance from the fellow breakaway region of Abkhazia, as well as from Russia’s North Caucasus area, including neighboring North Ossetia. Georgian media sources have reported a build-up of Russian military forces on North Ossetia’s border with South Ossetia. The information could not be independently confirmed.

On August 3, South Ossetia’s separatist authorities declined to meet with Georgian State Minister for Territorial Integration Temur Iakobashvili for direct talks about the situation in the conflict zone.[/b]

Timeline and article list here:

http://www.eurasianet.org/resource/georgia/articles/index.shtml

Very interesting information there.

[Hangtime]

Hangtime, I was reading in another article (I think I posted part of it a page or two back) That stated that the Black Sea is too shallow for our CV's, but I haven't seen anything else about it.

Frode... thanks. I spotted that and did some checking... the info is ummmm... questionable. Here's a link with a bit better topography.:

http://enrin.grida.no/htmls/georgia/soegeor/english/blacksea/blacksea.htm

The Bosphorus is as little as 70 metres deep and 700 metres wide but the depth of the Black Sea itself, exceeds two kilometres in places.



The Turks and Russki's operate subs, the russki's have also operated both their CV's and VLCC tankers in there. It's navigable area is about 5 times as large as the Arabian Sea or Persian Gulf.

[leonid]

A link to the CNN claim: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ksOCJsODaw8

A reference to Ossetian refugees: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/aug/12/georgia.russia

Easy to find these things on the net, guys, but you knew that. As for what's respectable, that's always dependent on your own opinion. It's just that maybe FOX or CNN might not have anything on it. Anywho, enjoy Life, and don't get too buried in the dogma. People are just people for the most part, it's the dogma that does us all in.

Hasta luego, Amigos.

[FrodeMk3]

It may not be the sea itself, Hangtime...



I would believe that trying to get through Both the Dardenelles and the Bosporous would be hazardous and time consuming, to say the least. Any advance warning given to the Russian Black Sea fleet at all, and all they would really have to do is mine those straits'.

[Hangtime]

Anywho, enjoy Life, and don't get too buried in the dogma. People are just people for the most part, it's the dogma that does us all in.

Hasta luego, Amigos.

My Karma ran over your dogma.

Sorry, Ma.

[leonid]

My Karma ran over your dogma.

Sorry, Ma.

Hey, dude. I still keep an account on AH, just haven't played in ages. Don't make me smoke your Stang in my Lavochka