My thoughts and ideas about Perk Planes.

[qts]

I don't like the idea of perked planes. I do, however, think there needs to be some balance between early war planes and late war planes.

The easiest way to do this is to have seperate arenas for each year and allow planes from + or - 1 year. I don't think that this is practical, though.

HTC could limit the arena on a weekly basis (eg Week 1 has planes from 1939/40, week 2 has planes from 42/43, week 3 has planes from 44/45, week 4 has immediate post-war and 'what if' planes), but this would upset those who want to perfect one plane.

Perhaps the best solution would be to amend the scoring, such that a 1945 plane shooting down a 1939 plane does not get as good a kill score as the reverse.

[Tac]

I like the idea of points to be able to fly certain aircraft.

"Perk" planes would be the unbalancing planes like the 262 and Chog (109G10 perk? Dude it takes SKILL to fly that thing!). "Perk" planes would require the burning of points to fly them, would take away 2 points when you die in them and you gain 1 point per every 2 kills scored when flying them. Give 1 point per kill of perk plane when flying these planes.

"Bonus" planes would give extra point per kill you achieve in them. Logically, the early war planes and other underperforming aircraft like the 202 and P-38C (37mm cannon.. me want! heehee) would be in this category. Say, "Bonus" planes would give 2 points per kill and take away no points when you die in them. Give +3 points if you kill a perk plane in it.

"Normal" planes would give 1 point per kill and would take away 1 point when you die in them.Gain +1 point if you kill a perk plane.

That way we will see a nice balance of early war and late war planes in the arena. And there will be no greater pleasure than shooting down a Perk when in a "bonus" plane!

It could also give people a reason to fight agressively while avoiding death.. that MAY mean less ho'ers and ackrunners (if the ack gets the credit for the kill that is!).

What say ye to this HTC?

[funked]

Vermillion I was just throwing a date out there.  I'm talking about Ta 152H and stuff like that, planes that fought in miniscule numbers.

[Nath-BDP]

He 163? Us Luftwabbles will be happy with all our late-war toys that Allies can't counter.  

[Maverick]

Flakbait,

You missed the entire point of my post. Spatula and Sourkraut got it. I am not in favor of the idea of "perk planes" at all. I do not think that giving more capable planes to already high performing pilots is justified. It unballances the play and makes it even harder for new people to gain skills.

I have posted before that dividing up the arenas in terms of "era's" would work. That way an early war arena wouldn't have the 51's the 190D's etc. but would only have 1939 to 1941 planes. The same for a mid war, early planes plus 1942 to 1943, and a last arena for 1944 to 1945.

If you want to consider this to be "sour grapes" that's your problem. I doubt I will ever be interested in trying to go for a special plane. I haven't even looked at the dueling ladder in the BBS much less thought about trying it. I am interested in a more or less level playing field in the MA.

It is obvious that any change n the FM spawns an observable response in the planes that are flown. It used to be practically nothing but 109's and 190s with some F4Uc's before the FM change gave T&B planes a chance to be competitive. Now Spits are far more prevalent.

Mav

[Toad]

Seems to me that as the planeset really grows up into the 50+ range that we're going to have two choices.

You can have separate arenas by "war period" however that gets divided up. This ought to make a semi-level playing field.

You can have a "anything goes" MA. The field will NOT be level, perk or not. Anyone in something like P-51H is going to slice and dice a Hurricane I, if he knows his business at all. Even if he blows it, he can disengage at will. As someone pointed out earlier, that's half the battle right there.

So, if you don't perk an "anything goes" then most guys will gravitate towards the late war stuff. Not much point in even spending development time on the early war birds.

If you DO perk, there's the risk of running off the "average joe" pilot that gets sick of being in the "underdog" airplane all the time.

[J_A_B]

My problem with what most people think perking will be:

Campaign starts, people start to accumulate points.

A week later, Joe Pilot flies his first sortie of the new campaign, having not flown for the past week.

Now, instead of a level playing field, our hypothetical pilot has to deal with much much better planes than he is able to fly, because he doesn't have perk points yet and everyone else does.  So, instead of having fun, Joe Pilot gets shot down in his Hurricane over and over by P-51's and FW-D9's until he finally gets PO'ed and logs off.

Having to use "points" to "buy" a perk plane is not fair to people who can't fly every day, unless everyone starts the campaign with enough points to "buy" a plane or two.

Unfortunately, then nobody would ever want to get shot down.  


My biggest fear about perking, is that "Points Dweebs" will become utterly dominant in the arena.  Nobody will want to risk death, for fear of losing their perk ride.  It could, potentially, do more damage to the game than good.

AH already has a minor problem of some people being overly obsessed with K/D ratio.  Now, imagine what would happen if the game actually rewarded people based on score.  Score would go from being an unimportant number, to the POINT of the game.

Not at all a good thing for gameplay.  Unless, of course, you like AltDweebs, Runners, and Ganging.   Making score important will encourage those things to be more common than they already are.

I can only hope HTC has thought perking out REALLY well, and come up with a good way to implement it.

J_A_B

[EDIT:  This post was written at the same time as the one above.  LOL!]

[This message has been edited by J_A_B (edited 10-04-2000).]

[flakbait]

Sorry Mav, I didn't read any other posts of yours about creating other arenas. I thought you meant let anyone fly anything they want. My mistake. Creating other arenas would definitely work, but until we get the planes it's another idea that goes in the "For Later" box. Then you've got the "not enough peole for it" argument that goes on and on and on......

I'll most likely fly perk planes, both offline and H2H. Aside from a real thrill flying NOE in an Me-262 or Ta-152H, I doubt I'll use them on any regular basis.




------------------
Flakbait
Delta 6's Flight School
"My art is the wings of an aircraft through the skies, my music the deep hum of a prop as it slices the air, my thrill the thunder of guns tearing asunder an enemy plane."
Flakbait
19 September 2000

[Tac]

JAB, Perk planes would be the me 262, f4u-c, 163, meteor,p-38k *grin*, and other fighters that would seriously unbalance the game if they would be released in the MA right now.

That people wont want to die in fear of losing their points, I say thats GREAT! That will at least simulate human self preservation instinct. You not tired of kamikaze buffs or HO'ing & crashing chog dweebs?

Perks would burn points, which means people EARNED the right to fly them. And when they fly them they will still have to ACM good in them if they want to keep the perk and have fun. On the other hand, those wanting to get a perk plane or points for them would be flying either the early war planes for extra points (and more challenging dogfights) or the "normal" planes like P-51, 109's and stuff.

I do not consider P51D or 109g10 to be perky because right now in the MA they hold their own and are not uber. Sure, a 109g10 would probably chew and spit out a P-40 , but hey, if its a good P40 pilot he wont be able to. How many people see the 202 as an easy plane to kill? That slow little bugger, although its practically toothless, it does give you a good ACM.

'nuff said

[Karnak]

Tac,
Actually I think that Perks will cause more than was true prudence.  There is nobody here who is going to cout-marshal you and send you to the stockade for failing to do your duty.  Your buddies aren't actually going to die if you don't try to save them even if it means some risk to you.

There also seems to be an ongoing myth that WWII pilots didn't HO.  They did.  They didn't like it, but you can find numerous accounts of it.  Bob Tuck's 2nd kill was done by HOing with a Bf110C-4 while flying a Spitfire MkII (8 .303s against 4 7.9s and 2 20mm cannon).

Sisu
-Karnak

[Tac]

Yes, HO's did happen. But you see in the MA and H2H a lot of people who just who with no regard to anything else. Sort of like the crowd that come from arcade sims. I never said this would cure HO's, all I said is that if someone wants to have a chance at a perk, they will definetely have to watch out for themselves.

BTW, ground kills and strat kills would also give points.

[Karnak]

Tac,
You're right that HOs happen too often in AH right now.  I don't like doing them, but I will use one if I think it is my only shot (I've won fights doing that, such as when I was bounced by a Spit IX and I was in a 109G-2).  Any other way to get him is preferable though and I will try to do that first.

Sisu
-Karnak