Originally posted by Seeker:
Urchin,
I saw your unpleasant and unsporting tirade against that chap this morning on Ch1.
I'd like to ask you again what you thought you were doing trying to turn fight a B-17 at 30K? You're good enough to know that you have no chance in that situation, and old enough not to have to try and start a disruptive pissing contest about it with some one who's playing the game the way he wants to, in agreement with both the given performance parameters of the A/C and any rules HTC have put down.
Especialy as you've been so vocal on how useless the Ta 152 is. You had prime cause to use it here.
Deliberatly being unpleasant, provocative and insulting to some one you've never crosse words with before, simply because you're stupid enough to fly to his dictated terms hardly garners you any credit; and trying to continue the insults here is just lame.
Use the Ta-152 in Aces High!
Seeker- I'm not entirely sure if you know what you are talking about here. I could be wrong.
I'll go by a line by line response, mostly
I'd like to ask you again what you thought you were doing trying to turn fight a B-17 at 30K? You're good enough to know that you have no chance in that situation, and old enough not to have to try and start a disruptive pissing contest about it with some one who's playing the game the way he wants to,
I wasn't "trying to turnfight a B17 at 30k"- I was trying to INTERCEPT a b17 at 30k. When the B17 at 30k can fly out of the tailgunner position to fly neatly across the sky, it makes it almost impossible to intercept them without flying right up their 6. I'll explain to you the phrase I use to explain to this behaviour. I call it geekdancing, for no other reason than there is a geek in the bomber trying to dance.
Since I am smart enough to NOT fly directly at a B17 from it's 6 OC, that pretty much renders the entire contest down to a good old 45 minute geekdance. This is how the Geekdance goes.
1. See a bomber WAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYYY up high.
2. Climb up to intercept the bomber.
3. Bomber of course sees you coming, so he switchs to a gun position (preferably the tail gun, as that way he can make sure he is always pointed in the right direction).
4. Buff flies straight and level - until you get within 2 K or so. Since you have climbed to 30k to intercept the geek, you are already going pretty slow.
5. Buff stays in the tail gun position, using the rudder to turn so that his tail is always pointed at you.
6. Fighter pilot can never do both of these - 1. Climb ABOVE the buff, and 2. Stay in position to make an attack once he is above the buff.
If you say I'm wrong, thats fine. This is all just personal experience anyway.
7. Buff continues flying in circles, attempting to "intice" the fighter into coming up his 6. In this particular case, the buff driver actually REVERSED, to come back closer to me on several occasions where I had gotten fairly far away from him attempting to climb. This in particular marks him as a geekdancer, in my opinion.
I qouted this earlier, but the truth in it just rang out so clearly.
You're good enough to know that you have no chance in that situation
Exactly, I AM good enough to know that I have no chance to win a fight against a geekdancing buff at 30k. This in turn renders another statement of yours patently absurd.
Especialy as you've been so vocal on how useless the Ta 152 is. You had prime cause to use it here.
Why would I waste 40 perk points even TRYING to intercept a buff at 30k when he will make SURE that I have to approach from dead 6 to attack him? And you can blame this on my "inferiority" as a pilot if you feel the need, but if a geekdancer CAN'T make sure that he has the advantage at 30k, then HE is incompetent, not the fighter pilot.
I'll give you a clue here, as to how frustrating it is to attempt to intercept a buff at 30k. The "vaunted" Ta-152 climbs at between 1.5k and 2k FPM at 30K. This is at probably 180 mph IAS. The BUFF is flying at at least 200 mph IAS. Furthermore, the buff can turn perfect circles in the sky, without losing any altitude, something that the fighter does not have the luxury of doing.
I'll just use my own "formula" for attacking buffs here, but it should do OK. I attack from the 3-9 line (or 9-3) from probably a 2-3K altitude advantage. The reason I do this is because it makes me a harder target for the 8 guns that are shooting at me anyway.
So, lets apply this to a buff flying at 30k. I'd like to be on a parallel course to the buff, flying at 32-33k. I'd then break into him from a distance of perhaps 2000 yards, make a pass and repeat from the other side.
The Buffs defensive "tactic" is to -
1. Fly straight as long as it appears the enemy fighter will attack from the 6 OC position.
2. If the enemy fighter moves off to one side, you use the rudder to turn away from the buff so that your tail is always presented to him. You use the gunner position for this turn so that you will never lose any altitude by turning, which would of course render it easier for the fighter to get in position for an attack.
3. Repeat as long as nescesary, I.E. until the fighter gets so BORED by your stupid tactics that he decides to come up your 6 OC with a very minimal speed advantage so you can shoot him down from 1.5K away. Oh yes, I forgot- if the fighter is not stupid enough to charge up your 6, you can take potshots from as far away as 1.7 K and you may get lucky. If the fighter still doesn't charge up your 6, and your golden BB's fail to kill him, commence geekdancing until he runs out of fuel.
Deliberatly being unpleasant, provocative and insulting to some one you've never crosse words with before, simply because you're stupid enough to fly to his dictated terms hardly garners you any credit; and trying to continue the insults here is just lame.
Yes, I was probably out of line in the MA last night. I'm not going to apoligize for it. By the way- this is another particularly absurd statement on your part.
simply because you're stupid enough to fly to his dictated terms
There are no other terms at 30k, dancing with a buff that can turn without losing any altitude (or speed? I'll have to check into that) when you don't have that luxury. If you want to intercept a geekdancing buff at that altitude, you will be coming up his 6, or you won't be intercepting him at all.
By the way seeker, I'd be perfectly happy to take a B17 to 30k and let you TRY to intercept me in a TA-152. I'd say out of 10 "intercepts" I'd win all 10. Let me know if you want to try it.
