Finally, something to whine about!

[Phil]

Well said DKFF49 !!

 
Phil/OPP7755

[Shane]

dkff...    right, i watched the film too,  i wouldn't call that e-fighting in the sense.. it was more of a running BnZ as caldera was apparently trying to get to base, and was purely in a defensive mode, refusing to climb too far up the ropes.

this would be a more classic e-fighting, i think.  

http://www.speedyshare.com/619968645.html

temp vs niki starts at 1:47... had to kill a pony-b prior to that...  took me about 3 1/2 mins to finally pop the niki.  thankfully we were away from the main furball.

you'll see me working to gain some alt, while keeping the niki interested. yuo'll see me do a few high speed reverses, merge one turn and out, maintaining my speed.  

the next to last you'll notice i slow down a bit, testing the niki (around 4:50) and then after separating one final time, i re-merge and chop the throttle to get inside the niki (who wasn't expecting it) for the kill.  

the incoming F6F forced me to close the deal cuz i didn't want the sucker coming in and stealing it, lol.

I could easily have extended and alt'd on the niki, being in a temp, but.... i didn't want him to wander off back towards his buddies.

[caldera]

I only turned for base at the end after B.E. did the same. The base seen in the film is actually the bish v-base (i had to change direction so he didn't get a freebie ack kill).  I tried to run so he would come down and chase me. It was quite frustrating as i couldn"t climb up to fight him. I don't have a problem if he wants to fight that way. I only posted the film because it seemed quite like the flying he was complaining about in the start of this thread.

[Shane]

I only turned for base at the end after B.E. did the same. The base seen in the film is actually the bish v-base (i had to change direction so he didn't get a freebie ack kill).  I tried to run so he would come down and chase me. It was quite frustrating as i couldn"t climb up to fight him. I don't have a problem if he wants to fight that way. I only posted the film because it seemed quite like the flying he was complaining about in the start of this thread.

well, 11 mins is a tad.... long... to get a kill from an advantage.

[Steve]

I'm giving 10-1 odds on Shane for the DA.  Any takers?

[BaldEagl]

well, 11 mins is a tad.... long... to get a kill from an advantage.

8 minutes.  The rest is me flying away.

[Shane]

8 minutes.  The rest is me flying away.

oh, right... and nobody died... i didn't watch it to the conclusion - my bad.

[Bronk]

oh, right... and nobody died... i didn't watch it to the conclusion - my bad.

Zing

[BaldEagl]

I tried to run so he would come down and chase me. It was quite frustrating as i couldn"t climb up to fight him.

I blew away an La-7 one night in the K-4 doing the same thing although it didn't take quite so long.

Really, I never knew that using your climb/E advantage to keep an an enemy pinned down and turning was a "lame" way to fly.  I also thought that keeping him out of a guns solution/guns range was the wise thing to do.  I guess in the future I'm supposed to flat turn my A8 with Zekes?

And, as I said before, reversing on average every 40 seconds is nothing like running from 15K to 30K then circling a sector before the first reversal, which was scenario one in my OP.

[BaldEagl]

oh, right... and nobody died... i didn't watch it to the conclusion - my bad.

Watch it from my perspective.  You'll notice that the reason I was there in the first place is that I blew away a B-24 before ever engageing Caldera.  Nobody died because Caldera did a good job evading each of my passes and couldn't get into guns range on his reversals.

In the end I flew away out of ammo, or at least out of cannons.  There was no reason to remain at that point.

[Anaxogoras]

Really, I never knew that using your climb/E advantage to keep an an enemy pinned down and turning was a "lame" way to fly.  I also thought that keeping him out of a guns solution/guns range was the wise thing to do.  I guess in the future I'm supposed to flat turn my A8 with Zekes?

When people complain about how you fly, it's a sign that you're doing something right.  I get complaints from time to time too when I have an energy advantage and don't lose it.

[Shane]

Watch it from my perspective.  You'll notice that the reason I was there in the first place is that I blew away a B-24 before ever engageing Caldera.  Nobody died because Caldera did a good job evading each of my passes and couldn't get into guns range on his reversals.

In the end I flew away out of ammo, or at least out of cannons.  There was no reason to remain at that point.

i did.. u managed ur e extremely well, no one disputes that, but the overall flying was very cautious. did you watch the temp/niki film i posted?  I was setting him up in advance. you were like, "craps i missed, let me try again" ad infinitum when he refused to play the dope at the end of a rope.

also, i've found it fun and challenging at times to fly the other guy into the ground.

[BaldEagl]

i did.. u managed ur e extremely well, no one disputes that, but the overall flying was very cautious. did you watch the temp/niki film i posted?  I was setting him up in advance. you were like, "craps i missed, let me try again" ad infinitum

also, i've found it fun and challenging at times to fly the other guy into the ground.

Nope.  Didn't see the film yet.  At work.  I'll look at it this evening.

And yes, I'll admit I was a bit cautious but I didn't want to let Caldera just latch onto my six either.  That Ki held a significant turn advantage over me which is partially why I wasn't able to get a good shot on him.  IIRC I did score a hit at one point but likely with the 7.9mm's, not the 30mm which would have resulted in an entirely different perspective on the fight.

[Anaxogoras]

Allright, i watched the first 5 minutes of the film.  Here's my initial reaction:

Although baldeagl was flying conservative in so far as he was preserving his energy advantage, caldera was also far more concerned with flying defense than trying to even the fight.  It's not hard to dodge multiple bnz passes when you make no effort to equalize energy states.  In this case, caldera was chopping his throttle and doing neg g barrel rolls to throw off baldeagle's aim (taters are hard enough to hit with as it is).  That's no way to turn the tables.  If baldeagl decided to slow down and start stall fighting, no doubt then caldera would have become more aggressive with his more maneuverable aircraft.

[dkff49]

just to make sure we are all on the same page here.

I don;t believe that film was put up to say that baldeagle's fighting preference is "bad" or to say that caldera is better. or that either one is more agressive than the other. What it was put up for or so it seems to me is to show that the one thing that baldeagle started the thread about is the very same thing he does in his bouts but only to a slightly lesser degree.

Nobody here is trying to berade him just pointing out this one simple point and it sounds as though you have just said that you agree with that statement.