A question about the pony

[Clone155]

We all know the Pony is a great plane, but what makes it so great? It has great guns, and great speed, but what happens when you get some one on your tail that can match your speed? Do you call for help? Do you run the the field ack? Or do you actually try and out manuver them? It seems every time I try, it doesn't work very well. Any tips?

[Anaxogoras]

From last night's FSO:

http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?jfw1onwm1hn

We were bloated with fuel and had the parasitic drop tank racks, so you had ample opportunity to escape.  As soon as I broke off the first chase you can tell that I anticipated your reversing back.  It would have been better to keep on going and not push your luck.

[BnZs]

We all know the Pony is a great plane....

No, we do NOT all know that.

In the ETO, it was a long-ranged mediocre maneuvering airplane that could perform with its typical opposition at typical altitudes and in any case run down or out-run 99% of what it ran across.

In AHII MA, it is a very poor turning aircraft that is outperformed by much of it's opposition at typical altitudes and can be out-turned, out-climbed, and out-run by a good number of likely opponents.

[CJ nitro]

In RL you didn't have pony vs spit, pony, hurri, etc. In the game you do. This means the way you use the plane needs to be changed from historic to whatever gets you the kill and let's you get away with it. Pony is a great plane here in this game. Just not that suited at taking on every other type of foe it comes across. Wish more players went to ava to have a more realistic fight but most enjoy the game as a game not a sim. This is why my pony is back in the hanger and I'm starting to relearn the spitfire. Tired of getting ran down when outnumbered and out turned by the la crowd. Will be making people angry as soon as I figure out the right one to use. all!
>

[Karnak]

To quote/paraphrase an American fighter pilot who flew Spitfires in the USAAF before switching to P-51s.

"The P-51 can't do what the Spitfire can do, but it can do it over Berlin."

[Steel]

     The P-51 can turn VERY well when flown properly at the altitude and speed it was designed for. It can out turn anything it cant out run given a realistic matchup (Allied vs Axis). The 109-K4 might be the true exeption to this tho. Its fully capable of turning with the 51 and has a speed advantage over it at most alts. With altitude the P-51 can simply nose over and enter a high speed dive to get away for a short time however. The 190 D-9 cant out turn the P-51 but will out roll it handly. Pop some flaps out and you can turn with Spitfires if you practice a little. Its like any other plane....takes practice to make it work.

Steel

[Karnak]

It won't climb with or accelerate with Spitfires though, and WWII pilots did not use flaps nearly as aggressively as we do in AH.  None WWII era of the WWII era tests I've seen put the P-51D as matching even the Spitfire Mk XIV in turning.

[BnZs]

It won't climb with or accelerate with Spitfires though, and WWII pilots did not use flaps nearly as aggressively as we do in AH.  None WWII era of the WWII era tests I've seen put the P-51D as matching even the Spitfire Mk XIV in turning.

Correct.

They do put it matching or exceeding the Tempest and Typhoon though, which the AHII P-51D does not.

[RAM]

All I know is that a well flown P51D vs my Fw190D9 in a 1 on 1 fight is one of the best experiences I can get in this simulator. Have had the luck to find a couple of such fights last week, and enjoyed them immensely (one was a draw as I had to dive away because another enemy was getting dangerously close, the other I won with a very very complicated high deflection shot I was lucky to hit with as I'm a terribly lousy shot).

That the P51D is a very good matchup for the D9 is a big hint of how good the Pony is in the MA. As for how to defend against a faster plane on your six, it just requires a skilled pilot who knows how to get the best out from it.

Usually that means that for starters the pilot doesn't let his SA slip so low as for finding himself in such a situation, BTW. If someone faster than you is stuck like glue on your six, you did something wrong. And the plane has nothing to do with it.

just my 0.02$

     The P-51 can turn VERY well when flown properly at the altitude and speed it was designed for. It can out turn anything it cant out run given a realistic matchup (Allied vs Axis). The 109-K4 might be the true exeption to this tho. Its fully capable of turning with the 51 and has a speed advantage over it at most alts.

In a K4 vs a P51D 1-on-1 co-E fight the Pony is as good as dead. Any other result means that either the K4 pilot is clueless or the P51D a real god of Aces High. It's not that the 109 can turn with the pony (in fact it can't on the short run), it's the ability to build E that makes the 109 so superior, and the speed that allows it to deny the P-51 the chance to run away it's good just to make that advantage count.
As the fight draws longer ,the bigger the advantage the 109 wins over the Pony. Any maneouver the 51 pulls means burning an energy he can't easily rebuild, while the K4's acceleration can turn a fight's energy tables in a heartbeat. If the fight is fought in the vertical (and any decent K4 would drag such a fight to the vertical plane) the 51 has only one option: dive away hoping for the 109 compressing for enough time for some friends to clear his six...

[Angus]

P51 would be able to crazy-dive away from the K though...I think.
It will also roll better at high speeds.
And a slow turn with some flaps, pony wins....

[SectorNine50]

I have a real hard time with 109's in AH, particularly when they are in a higher "E" state or I'm alone.

Another reason the Pony's worked so well IRL is the fact that the Americans flew with wingmen.  If you get 2 Pony's going that are working together, they can really take on 4 cons if done right.  This really goes for almost any American aircraft, and to steal from SOCOM commercials... Alone they can be lethal, as a team they dominate.

[moot]

All I know is that a well flown P51D vs my Fw190D9 in a 1 on 1 fight is one of the best experiences I can get in this simulator.

Ditto.

[BnZs]

I have a real hard time with 109's in AH, particularly when they are in a higher "E" state or I'm alone.

Another reason the Pony's worked so well IRL is the fact that the Americans flew with wingmen.  If you get 2 Pony's going that are working together, they can really take on 4 cons if done right.  This really goes for almost any American aircraft, and to steal from SOCOM commercials... Alone they can be lethal, as a team they dominate.

That would imply that conversely, the Germans always flew as individuals, disdained teamwork? 

No, the reason the Pony seems worse than it's reputation in AHII is because it is being asked to fight some of it's historical allies in the weeds, instead of doing high-altitude escort, and because some of it's historical opponent's are rather "optimistically" modeled, and the Pony is modeled rather...bleh.

[Steve]

     The P-51 can turn VERY well when flown properly at the altitude and speed it was designed for.
Steel

This has NOTHING to do with 99.9% of the fights in the MA.

[Steve]

And a slow turn with some flaps, pony wins....

Nope.