all citizens...Hand over your guns on demand

[wrag]

Thats what Law Enforcement in seems to think is correct!

Or at least that's what this article claims is the case.....

http://www.lakelandtimes.com/main.asp?SectionID=9&SubSectionID=9&ArticleID=8907&TM=37236.69

[Roundeye]

Interesting, but the reality is this:  If a LEO tells you to hand over your weapon and you refuse (right or wrong), it won't end well.

[Serenity]

Interesting, but the reality is this:  If a LEO tells you to hand over your weapon and you refuse (right or wrong), it won't end well.

The question is, will you get it back?

It used to be that things confiscated at Airport Security Checkpoints would be mailed back to you (Though it took about 6 months to a year). I had a leatherman confiscated when I had forgot I still had it in my bag. TSAs took it, took down my address, and said they would mail it to me. By the time I got it, I had forgotten about it, but what matters is, I DID get it back. Nowadays they won't return anything. Will that apply to these confiscated firearms too?

[Roundeye]

The question is, will you get it back?

It used to be that things confiscated at Airport Security Checkpoints would be mailed back to you (Though it took about 6 months to a year). I had a leatherman confiscated when I had forgot I still had it in my bag. TSAs took it, took down my address, and said they would mail it to me. By the time I got it, I had forgotten about it, but what matters is, I DID get it back. Nowadays they won't return anything. Will that apply to these confiscated firearms too?

Who knows, but it's better than being shot to death.  It would be the cop's word against a dead guy with a gun laying next to him.

[trax1]

What they need to do is clearly define the law better, hopefully with this Krause case it will aid in defining this law.  This man was completely in the right to have his weapon on him in plain sight.

[Mustaine]

yes my state sucks...

it doesn't help the last few years with people shooting hunters, what 2 different times 5+ people killed in an odd incident out in the woods...

either way though our governor Doyle is a complete liberal ultra melon, and even spoke pubically he will veto any measure to allow regular citizens to carry firearms. we're one of what 4 states that don't allow weapons for self defense?

sometimes I really hate Wisconsin.

[wrongwayric]

Everytime a DNR agent goes into the woods during hunting season he's pretty much guaranteed to encounter an armed person. The stress there during any type of encounter has to be huge and to think he probably has multiple encounters a day has to be hugely stressfull.

I think having some type of clear cut way to handle the situation from both the DNR and the hunters side that is fair and impartial to both sides needs to be put in writing and the training courses.

The way it looks to me is the DNR is taught to consider the hunter guilty and disarm him before checking his credentials. This to me is just wrong.

[sluggish]

These men aren't drafted or otherwise forced into their line of work; they pursue it.

[Buzzard7]

Eh,we have open carry here in Colorado. Not many people do it. I think there are around 6000 concealed carry permits in my county alone and thats how most carry.

[Curlew]

I think that if it pertains to anything that can make a officer or agent feel threatened you do WHATEVER he tells you to do, it like in a car, your lil consumer car is not going to win against a semi even if the semi is in the wrong

[wrag]

The question is, will you get it back?

It used to be that things confiscated at Airport Security Checkpoints would be mailed back to you (Though it took about 6 months to a year). I had a leatherman confiscated when I had forgot I still had it in my bag. TSAs took it, took down my address, and said they would mail it to me. By the time I got it, I had forgotten about it, but what matters is, I DID get it back. Nowadays they won't return anything. Will that apply to these confiscated firearms too?

If it's a firearm probably NOT.

Although IIRC you are within your rights to REQUIRE a receipt?

Legally whenever ANYTHING gets confiscated/taken by Law Enforcement/Gubmint Agent they are SUPPOSED to give you a receipt for that item or any items taken, part of the now gutted 4th Amendment IIRC.

BUT YOU MUST SAY YOU WANT A RECEIPT!  You have to ask for one.

[trax1]

If it's a firearm probably NOT.

Although IIRC you are within your rights to REQUIRE a receipt?

Legally whenever ANYTHING gets confiscated/taken by Law Enforcement/Gubmint Agent they are SUPPOSED to give you a receipt for that item or any items taken, part of the now gutted 4th Amendment IIRC.

BUT YOU MUST SAY YOU WANT A RECEIPT!  You have to ask for one.

Yeah I can vouch for that, a few months ago my girlfriend was over at my house sleeping, about 11 P.M someone rings my bell, I knew right away it was her ex(Josh), so we didn't answer it, he rang it a few more times, eventually she went and looked out the window from behind the curtain, she said she saw a bunch of cars & people out there, she thought it was his friends, so a few min's later I get a call from DuComm, which is the police, so I go out front and open my door and it's the police, I ask them whats going on, they just ask if they can come in so I say ok, next thing I know 2 cops pop out from the sides with M16's drawn on me, they tell me to keep my hands where they can see them, now bear in mind that I'm in a wheelchair and have no use of my right arm, now they go to the back of my house and let in another cop with an M16, I keep asking whats going on, but they just keep saying we'll explain in a minute.  So after they clear the house they tell me that her ex called the police and told them that when he knocked on the door that I pointed a gun at him through the window, which of course was complete BS, for one all the guns in the house are on the second floor under my dads bed, and one 38 in his night stand, kinda hard to get to them being in a wheelchair and all.  So they find all the weapons and ask if I or my father have a valid F.O.I.D(Firearms Owners Identification) card, unfortunately are cards had both expired, so they had to take all the weapons until we renewed are cards, but they did have to give us a receipt for them. 

[smkelly13]

These men aren't drafted or otherwise forced into their line of work; they pursue it.

Quoted for the absolute truth.

I used to live by a DNR post, they were all robocop wannabes.  Even the women officers. 

I'd refuse to turn over my firearm, and wouldn't do so until I had a lawyer present.  You never know what kind of officer you're dealing with, he could have just shot and killed someone down the road in a fit of rage, and try to roll it off on you.  Kind of like a Michigan DNR officer's son who killed a buck before season and then laid the blame on a co-worker of mine.  His weapon was confiscated, torn apart, and his fines reached over $3000.

[REP0MAN]

The way it looks to me is the DNR is taught to consider the hunter guilty and disarm him before checking his credentials. This to me is just wrong.

Im not DNR nor am I LE in Wisconsin but I will explain this the best way I can from my point of view. Purposely withholding a firearm from an officer who is aware you have it is NOT a good idea. It is in your best judgment to cooperate with an officer should you be in a situation where said officer is asking for your weapon (or it's location on your person/vehicle). Disobeying a lawful order is a crime. There is no possible way that an officer can be sure of your intentions when you withhold a weapon from him. Cooperation is key.

As an officer in a smaller city, I do encounter hunters from time to time. I also encounter MANY CCW holders who are armed. I am told about the weapon 99% of the time and I will secure it while I carry out my contact with the individual. When I am done, I will give back the weapon, as long as the situation warrants (not going to jail, ability to carry (legally and physically/mentally) is certain). Should the weapon be stolen or on a hit list, I keep it. Should you be intoxicated, in a mixed mental state or going to jail for other reasons, I will be hanging on to it.

Do I want to deprive anyone of their Constitutional Rights? Absolutely not.

Do I want to make sure I do everything in my power to go home to my family at the end of the shift? You bet your axx I do.

[smkelly13]

Im not DNR nor am I LE in Wisconsin but I will explain this the best way I can from my point of view. Purposely withholding a firearm from an officer who is aware you have it is NOT a good idea. It is in your best judgment to cooperate with an officer should you be in a situation where said officer is asking for your weapon (or it's location on your person/vehicle). Disobeying a lawful order is a crime. There is no possible way that an officer can be sure of your intentions when you withhold a weapon from him. Cooperation is key.

As an officer in a smaller city, I do encounter hunters from time to time. I also encounter MANY CCW holders who are armed. I am told about the weapon 99% of the time and I will secure it while I carry out my contact with the individual. When I am done, I will give back the weapon, as long as the situation warrants (not going to jail, ability to carry (legally and physically/mentally) is certain). Should the weapon be stolen or on a hit list, I keep it. Should you be intoxicated, in a mixed mental state or going to jail for other reasons, I will be hanging on to it.

Do I want to deprive anyone of their Constitutional Rights? Absolutely not.

Do I want to make sure I do everything in my power to go home to my family at the end of the shift? You bet your axx I do.

Would you allow someone to remove the firing pin before handing the weapon over?