Author Topic: This seems obvious to me  (Read 5268 times)

Offline Helm

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Re: This seems obvious to me
« Reply #30 on: March 08, 2009, 03:22:27 PM »
Nice try.  I can log into hyperlobby right now and see more than 700 people playing IL-2 FB.  Not all of them are playing with complex engine management...maybe around 50%.

  I dont find Il-2's overall flight model believable.  Most of the planes fly the same except for the  speeds they achieve  Certainly Il-2's engine management is more complex then Aces high, but the overall "feel" of the planes is very very similar.  Now if we could combine ace's flight models with Il-2's engine management we might have something.


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Offline Motherland

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Re: This seems obvious to me
« Reply #31 on: March 08, 2009, 03:24:41 PM »
  I dont find Il-2's overall flight model believable.  Most of the planes fly the same except for the  speeds they achieve  Certainly Il-2's engine management is more complex then Aces high, but the overall "feel" of the planes is very very similar.  Now if we could combine ace's flight models with Il-2's engine management we might have something.


Helm ...out
Indeed. If HTC implemented more realistic engine controls, they would compete better with games such as Il-2, potentially drawing away from some of their more realism-oriented player base with AH's more realistic flight model and MMO community.
I think that with a stall-limiter like crutch, more realistic engine controls would probably be a good business decision for HTC.

Offline hitech

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Re: This seems obvious to me
« Reply #32 on: March 08, 2009, 03:40:41 PM »
Quote
I'm sure all of you could expand on the list.  The thing is, AH would have been a flight sim if it had been introduced 20 years ago.  In fact, when I first tried Warbirds offline in 1996 it wasn't just an air-combat game; compared to the standard of the day it was a high fidelity air-combat flight simulation.  But AH is pretty much the same thing in a different sand-box, and 13 years have gone by...

I have not heard such and utter load of BS in a long time.

It never ceases to amaze me how people wish to pick and choose the items they wish to see, but them try use the argument of realism to justify there arguments. The simple fact is , there are many things about flying a plane that are not fun. Such is the fact of life. Simple things like flying for 250 hours and never seeing an enemy plane is very close to realistic. But I do not hear you saying it should be modeled.

Spending 2 hours planing before each flight is realistic, I do not hear you wanting it.

The simple fact of the mater is, You play a game, the game is Air combat. The terms simulation vs game are not in any way in conflict with each other, you wish to try separate the 2 terms, but you really can not.

Some simulators are made for real life training. These simulators are designed for a specific purpose in mind. AH is no different , it is a simulator with a specific purpose in mind, and one of those purposes is fun.

Some here wish to say IL2 is more realistic because it has you push a button to open cowl flaps? I say BS again. They just makes different choices at what it wishes to accomplish. They want you to believe it is realistic, but start looking into real details of how things work and you will see , they just are making you push a button.

Ah is designed to learn air combat. It strives to model planes perfectly in their flight envelopes so that the air combat is real. Please do a side by side of AH against any game on the market when it comes to flight dynamics.

HiTech





Offline USRanger

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Re: This seems obvious to me
« Reply #33 on: March 08, 2009, 03:47:01 PM »
Word.
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Offline Bronk

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Re: This seems obvious to me
« Reply #34 on: March 08, 2009, 03:47:54 PM »
I have not heard such and utter load of BS in a long time.


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Offline Easyscor

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Re: This seems obvious to me
« Reply #35 on: March 08, 2009, 03:49:51 PM »
I love that reply Hitech.  :aok
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Offline Motherland

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Re: This seems obvious to me
« Reply #36 on: March 08, 2009, 03:50:31 PM »

Ah is designed to learn air combat. It strives to model planes perfectly in their flight envelopes so that the air combat is real. Please do a side by side of AH against any game on the market when it comes to flight dynamics.

HiTech
Engine performance plays a large part in the flight envelope, does it not? It would seem to me that in aerial combat milking everything you can to get the performance out of your engine should be important, just as milking everything out of the rest of your airframe is, instead of having a non-penalizing 'stall limiter' of sorts.

Offline Kazaa

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Re: This seems obvious to me
« Reply #37 on: March 08, 2009, 03:55:54 PM »
You got told off, haha! :lol



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Offline Wingnutt

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Re: This seems obvious to me
« Reply #38 on: March 08, 2009, 03:56:31 PM »
Simple things like flying for 250 hours and never seeing an enemy plane is very close to realistic. But I do not hear you saying it should be modeled.

Spending 2 hours planing before each flight is realistic, I do not hear you wanting it.
HiTech



correct, nobody wants either of those things, just a little extra fiddlability such as having the option of manual fuel management, and some minor engine management requirements.. again, both of these being optional.. the automatic settings could still be there for new players or those who just dont want to fiddle with it, but there would be potential rewards in performance for those who take the time and learn how to use them effectively.   It wouldn't be a "game ender" for anyone, just an extra layer of immersion and enjoyment for those who choose to make use of it.

Offline Bronk

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Re: This seems obvious to me
« Reply #39 on: March 08, 2009, 03:59:10 PM »
I'm smelling IL-2 almost infinite wep 109 wishing..... I could be wrong. :noid
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Offline Anaxogoras

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Re: This seems obvious to me
« Reply #40 on: March 08, 2009, 04:07:36 PM »
Engine performance plays a large part in the flight envelope, does it not? It would seem to me that in aerial combat milking everything you can to get the performance out of your engine should be important, just as milking everything out of the rest of your airframe is, instead of having a non-penalizing 'stall limiter' of sorts.

I can't improve on this reply, except to say that the cooling systems that AH lacks have an impact on the flight envelope as well.

Il-2 engine management combined with AH's flight model would be fantastic. :)

Some here wish to say IL2 is more realistic because it has you push a button to open cowl flaps? I say BS again. They just makes different choices at what it wishes to accomplish. They want you to believe it is realistic, but start looking into real details of how things work and you will see , they just are making you push a button.

Would you be happy if there were a lever to pull instead of a button to push? :devil  Also, they're not making anyone do anything.  You don't have to fly Il-2 with complex engine management; they give you a choice. :aok
« Last Edit: March 08, 2009, 04:16:59 PM by Anaxogoras »
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Offline Delirium

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Re: This seems obvious to me
« Reply #41 on: March 08, 2009, 04:22:27 PM »
Shouldn't you be in the other thread asking for the P38J to be perked?
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Offline Anaxogoras

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Re: This seems obvious to me
« Reply #42 on: March 08, 2009, 04:26:41 PM »
Who asked for the 38J to be perked? :huh :lol
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Offline Delirium

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Re: This seems obvious to me
« Reply #43 on: March 08, 2009, 04:27:02 PM »
I have not heard such and utter load of BS in a long time.

85 Krusties? :D

Naw, he is in the other thread claiming that buffs are over modeled since he can't BnZ them at 35k.
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Offline bj229r

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Re: This seems obvious to me
« Reply #44 on: March 08, 2009, 04:34:06 PM »
If I could learn all of the controls for Falcon 3.0 at age 14 with only a two button joystick, it can be done here.
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