Defining bad game-play

[The Fugitive]

  You guys take bases with half that amount,...6/110's 3 niks,and 2 goons???Well congrats ,and good thing you did not have any resistance..

  I put 15 slots for 110's in my missions,I put 10 slots for fighters,and 4 goons,I do not see where that is horrible..I want the town down as FAST as possible,I dont want to sit there and "FONDLE" it..I want it DOWN,and so do the  people who are with me,..

  You want to see A 50 man mission???? that would be the one with 190a8's,when eny has gone through the roof,literally,,and is over 25..

 ANd tral I never said that 12 110's missions were a challenge to me,you put words in my mouth..but I want to be sure when I launch a mission for a particular target,that it goes down the way it is supposed too..and that is that it gets captured..

                                                                         

       

See Falcon, thats the point we are trying to make and you refuse to see. 6 110's and a goon. NOE, all planes fly with the goons max speed. When you hit the dar circle 110s go full throttle and wep. 3 110 hit the town, 3 the field ack. In 3 passes most of the town is down, and ALL of the ack is down and the goon is in sight. 2 110s cover field, rest finish town, goon drops troops, base capture. The group lands a half dozen kills.

With 7 "skilled" players its VERY easy to capture a base with an NOE. Most fields can be deacked in two passes by two guys as long as you have good approach vectors. Your so worried about over killing your target your creating a horde. You give me 50 guys and I win the map each night we are on.

Do you like WWF Falcon? The whole point of WWF is the show. They have a show leading up to the fight, then two fighters climb into the ring, and "fight it out" for the show. If you were a WWF wrestler you'd be the guy that would drive his car into the ring running over the other fighter. Then you'd jump out saying "I WIN! I WIN!" Well ya, you won, but you had to run the guy over with a car!

The same thing in the game. Ya you took a base with 25 guys, it doesn't impress anyone because you HAD TO USE 25 GUYS!. Learn some skills, learn the best angles to dive into a town and NOT miss with a single round, make each pass count. Learn to do the same mission with less guys.

I ran into the Mighty Rolling Thunder last night. They ran an NOE from A9 to A59. As I flew through the masses shooting up the troops, there was over 20 guys at the field and town. B25s tiffys, and spittys. There was no high cap so I had plenty of time to circle looking for the goon. I'm sure it made him nervous, because instead of landing his goon, he dropped them from the air, which gave me a chance to kill enough that they had to wait for their back up goon. Ya they took the base, but it took 20 guys AND an NOE 

[kvuo75]

See Falcon, thats the point we are trying to make and you refuse to see. 6 110's and a goon. NOE, all planes fly with the goons max speed. When you hit the dar circle 110s go full throttle and wep. 3 110 hit the town, 3 the field ack. In 3 passes most of the town is down, and ALL of the ack is down and the goon is in sight. 2 110s cover field, rest finish town, goon drops troops, base capture. The group lands a half dozen kills.

exactly.. (i doubt the half dozen kills though -- maybe 1 or 2)

could probably do it even easier than that... all 6 110's kill town in 1 pass, and then kill anything that comes out of the field ack while the troops are running...

whatever the case, don't need a dozen 110's... thats gettin into the range where at the end of the fearsome basetake mission you didn't even get to shooot at a stinkin BUILDING because they were all dead already ..

what is the deal with overkill?? Just yesterday bish came to take back a vbase.. I saw at least 5 sets of heavy bombers.. FOR 3 HANGARS?? wtf!?

[oTRALFZo]

  You guys take bases with half that amount,...6/110's 3 niks,and 2 goons???Well congrats ,and good thing you did not have any resistance..

  I put 15 slots for 110's in my missions,I put 10 slots for fighters,and 4 goons,I do not see where that is horrible..I want the town down as FAST as possible,I dont want to sit there and "FONDLE" it..I want it DOWN,and so do the  people who are with me,..

  You want to see A 50 man mission???? that would be the one with 190a8's,when eny has gone through the roof,literally,,and is over 25..

 ANd tral I never said that 12 110's missions were a challenge to me,you put words in my mouth..but I want to be sure when I launch a mission for a particular target,that it goes down the way it is supposed too..and that is that it gets captured..

                                                                         

       

Your not seeing the point here Falcon. Your taking things as a direct attack towards you which in fact it is several people saying the same thing in order to open your eyes and try to teach you something.
You will never get better if you choose quantity over quality. Going into battle with 50 no skilled warriors and loosing to a group of 8 is much more damaging than not even attacking at all.

Point of your thread was "defining bad game play"  and my definition is when you get players that want to get to to point A--->B with no resistence ( They HO, Ram, Kamakazi, Lancstuka, spawncamp etc..etc) Its very obvious also when this is what they use as a crutch to get any sort of gratification.
Take the harder road, be humble and dont get frustrated. I suck yes, but I learn from my suckage and the result is that guy that gets the easy kill on me is gonna be surprised later.

[falcon23]

fugitive for your info,that was supposed to be a fun cv killing mission.where you saw all the b-25's..theyw ere for the cv,although a backup plan was hatched after the cv was dwon to hit a base for capture..

 What u guys dont see,is that I dont run missions to FAIL..It is evidnelty fun enough for people to join and take bases,or whatever needs to be done..

 I dont run missions to take 3 HOURS to take a base...I dont have the time to spend that amount of time taking a base,when it could of happened quicker..I dont WANT to spend 3 hours taking a base,I spend enough time in-game without making it last any longer.<--read WIFE ACK...

 And while I run majority NOE's,,There are some that are run at ALT,and they capture bases as well..

 Evidently missions of ALL KINDS are fun for many people..

  What I see,are you guys trying to tell me how to run missions and take bases the "FUN" way..The way I do them,that you guys are not getting is that they are FUN from my standpoint,and all who join..Do I think it makes for bad game-play? no I do not..Maybe from your perspective,but then you just cant "see" what I am saying either..

[Shifty]

Well if that doesn't come of sounding a bit like a "Holy than thou" attitude I don't what does!

Dawger, you come in here and push your attitude, and agenda everytime you post something. You came from WB..or where ever.. and yes you were the best trainer/fighter/team player/whatever there, but your in our world now. What applied in your world doesn't necessarily apply in ours. Here we try to train the a HO is a bad thing, yes many people still take it, but most feels that it is a cheap shot and will call you out on it.

I don't know about from where you come from, but here the idea is to fight, or have combat. Turning down a 1 vs 1 means you should go fly Flightsim X because you don't want to fight, so go fly a flight sim where there is no fighting.

Honor is dictated by the community. In the US we have a certain honor, if your a gang banger, you may have a certain honor, but to the rest of society/community your unlawful scum that needs to be locked up. Same goes for the game. you may be honorable with in your squad, but the rest of the game community decide whether that is acceptable.

You came from a different neighborhood, ours works just a bit different.  It doesn't matter how long you have been in flight sim communities, what matters is how long you have been in THIS flight sim community. Anything you earned in other sims is thrown out the window when you switched, just like everyone else. Here you have to start all over, like everyone else. Nobody gets respect just because.... they have to earn it just like everyone else.

You're calling Dawger holier than thou? Dawger is pushing his agenda? 
I've been in this sim since 2001 and wouldn't dream of posting somthing like this...

your in our world now

I wouldn't dream of posting it if I'd been here since day one. I got news for you as long as Dawger pays his monthly
AH bill it's as much his world as it is yours. In fact we're all just renters living in HTCs house.
Lighten up, you're really not near as important as you seem to think you are. Besides you're in Hetech's world now.  

[caldera]

That's good that you enjoy the NOE smash and grab missions, Falcon. Not that much fun to be the smashee, though. My definition of a fight is that both opponents have a chance. An NOE horde that is not discovered in time is akin to a pair of 51s BnZ-ing a single turny plane. The defender cannot go on the attack without being overwhelmed.

[falcon23]

Been on both sides of the coin also caldera..SO I know what you mean,but it is the price we pay I suppose..

[The Fugitive]

fugitive for your info,that was supposed to be a fun cv killing mission.where you saw all the b-25's..theyw ere for the cv,although a backup plan was hatched after the cv was dwon to hit a base for capture..

 What u guys dont see,is that I dont run missions to FAIL..It is evidnelty fun enough for people to join and take bases,or whatever needs to be done..

 I dont run missions to take 3 HOURS to take a base...I dont have the time to spend that amount of time taking a base,when it could of happened quicker..I dont WANT to spend 3 hours taking a base,I spend enough time in-game without making it last any longer.<--read WIFE ACK...

 And while I run majority NOE's,,There are some that are run at ALT,and they capture bases as well..

 Evidently missions of ALL KINDS are fun for many people..

  What I see,are you guys trying to tell me how to run missions and take bases the "FUN" way..The way I do them,that you guys are not getting is that they are FUN from my standpoint,and all who join..Do I think it makes for bad game-play? no I do not..Maybe from your perspective,but then you just cant "see" what I am saying either..

Whats wrong with "fighting" for one base for 3 hours as apposed to sneaking 6 or 7 bases in the same 3 hours?

All those B25s to kill one CV? Whats your hit % on bombing -20 ?? Yes its "fun for you and 20 of your closest friends, but your killing the fun on the other side. Trust me I can see what your saying, I've been there. I thought taking base after base showed how good we were too, but I learned that we were only go enough to do it that way, and ONLY that way. That when we changed and started working complex missions, to draw out the fight. Like someone else posted, if you don't want to fight against anyone you might as will play off line, or move your squad to the EW, I don't think you'll find too much resistance there.

You're calling Dawger holier than thou? Dawger is pushing his agenda? 
I've been in this sim since 2001 and wouldn't dream of posting somthing like this...

your in our world now

I wouldn't dream of posting it if I'd been here since day one. I got news for you as long as Dawger pays his monthly
AH bill it's as much his world as it is yours. In fact we're all just renters living in HTCs house.
Lighten up, you're really not near as important as you seem to think you are. Besides you're in Hetech's world now.  

OK lets put it this way for those who have a hard time keeping up...

Over "here" we play football, but over "there" they play football, but they pass the ball all the time with their feet, they don't wear pads, it looks like way too much work with all that running back and forth, and a good game is scored 1 - 0

What I'm saying about Dawger is he want to pass the ball with his feet! While in his world he's very good at it, it just isn't how its done in "this world". Yes its Hitechs' world, but the community shapes it with in his frame work.

That's good that you enjoy the NOE smash and grab missions, Falcon. Not that much fun to be the smashee, though. My definition of a fight is that both opponents have a chance. An NOE horde that is not discovered in time is akin to a pair of 51s BnZ-ing a single turny plane. The defender cannot go on the attack without being overwhelmed.

Been on both sides of the coin also caldera..SO I know what you mean,but it is the price we pay I suppose..

Why does it have to be the price paid? Teach your squad how to drop a CV with only 2 B25s, you could have used some more to hit 59 AND 61 starting fights in 3 places. Would the Rooks have defended, maybe, but if your guys can fight in a fighter wouldn't that be fun too?  Remember, dieing doesn't mean you died, just get another plane and get back into the fight. We had a "rule" in my old squad. Went/if you get shot down, wait in the tower for someone else. This way the guys upped in pairs/wings and made it a bit easier to fight, and they NEVER got back to the fight to see everyone was dead, because they had a wingman.

Again, you make excuses why you horde and NOE... its the price you pay.... don't have time for a 3 hour fight... wife ack. Do you get a discounted price for your subscription if you take a certain number of bases? Does your squad pay you per "capture"?

[Shifty]

What I'm saying about Dawger is he want to pass the ball with his feet! While in his world he's very good at it, it just isn't how its done in "this world". Yes its Hitechs' world, but the community shapes it with in his frame work.

Who appointed you spokesman for the entire community? How do you get to decide how things are done in this world as you put it?
I have never seen an official community rule on any type of game play. I have seen self appointed cartoon politicians complaining about how the other people
play the game in an effort to feel superior. Just fly and fight, quit worrying about what everybody else is doing.

[The Fugitive]

Who appointed you spokesman for the entire community? How do you get to decide how things are done in this world as you put it?
I have never seen an official community rule on any type of game play. I have seen self appointed cartoon politicians complaining about how the other people
play the game in an effort to feel superior. Just fly and fight, quit worrying about what everybody else is doing.

I don't decide, the community decides.  I'm not telling any how to play, I'm just trying to remind people, and explain to the newer players how it use to be. It use to much more fun, and the only real frustration anyone had was getting shot down, and THEY KNEW they could have done better, frustration with yourself. I wasn't because the 5 guys got you before you could finish off your kill.

[oTRALFZo]

fugitive for your info,that was supposed to be a fun cv killing mission.where you saw all the b-25's..theyw ere for the cv,although a backup plan was hatched after the cv was dwon to hit a base for capture..

 What u guys dont see,is that I dont run missions to FAIL..It is evidnelty fun enough for people to join and take bases,or whatever needs to be done..

 I dont run missions to take 3 HOURS to take a base...I dont have the time to spend that amount of time taking a base,when it could of happened quicker..I dont WANT to spend 3 hours taking a base,I spend enough time in-game without making it last any longer.<--read WIFE ACK...

 And while I run majority NOE's,,There are some that are run at ALT,and they capture bases as well..

 Evidently missions of ALL KINDS are fun for many people..

  What I see,are you guys trying to tell me how to run missions and take bases the "FUN" way..The way I do them,that you guys are not getting is that they are FUN from my standpoint,and all who join..Do I think it makes for bad game-play? no I do not..Maybe from your perspective,but then you just cant "see" what I am saying either..

Why be the OP of this thread then if you dont want to care about what others think.  Its not about telling you to play a certain way or that people whine that you take bases with overwhelming force. The object here is to open your mind and try things you havent tried before, or at least think about it.
Ive been on that side of the fence...its BORING and keep in mind..thats my own opinion. Give it time and these roster on mega squads that focus on base taking are going to be in and out as soon as they get half the skills they need to survive to be half decent.

[Yeager]

but your killing the fun on the other side. Trust me I can see what your saying, I've been there.

There is NO WAY everyone can have "fun" (to each his/her own definition) all the time in a game as dynamic as this one is.

I have discovered that there are times online in AH when I have an absolute blast, and other times when NOTHING goes my way and I just log off and go do something more worthwhile........

If these guys doing these missions are having fun then good for them.  If you are NOT having fun trying to support or defeat their mission then do something else.  The game is large enough to support tens of dozens of other things.  If there is nothing else that interests you then go mow the lawn, or change the oil in your car......are take you partner out to eat...or do something. 

But to try and manage other people in pursuit of what they want to do for their fun in order for YOU to have fun is imo, a waste of time and thought.

As far as the way AH used to be, forget it.  different game.

[Shifty]

There is NO WAY everyone can have "fun" (to each his/her own definition) all the time in a game as dynamic as this one is.

I have discovered that there are times online in AH when I have an absolute blast, and other times when NOTHING goes my way and I just log off and go do something more worthwhile........

If these guys doing these missions are having fun then good for them.  If you are NOT having fun trying to support or defeat their mission then do something else.  The game is large enough to support tens of dozens of other things.  If there is nothing else that interests you then go mow the lawn, or change the oil in your car......are take you partner out to eat...or do something. 

But to try and manage other people in pursuit of what they want to do for their fun in order for YOU to have fun is imo, a waste of time and thought.

As far as the way AH used to be, forget it.  different game.

Well said.

[falcon23]

 I opened this thread and have come to the conclusion that good or bad gameplay is relative to the one playing and paying...I did care,until everyone started trying to ram down my throat how my missions are bad for gameplay..I did not define what the posters were saying was bad gameplay or good gameplay..

 Fugitive,why so many?? that was a CV which was HIDDEN from our port,rooks hid it,and yes all sides do it,but I wanted to make sure it got back..It was good gameplay,as many got involved in it.

 Up 2 b-25h's and take back a cv??? give me a break,really?? is that your SOP when it comes to killing a cv,do you get on country and tell everyone NO MORE THAN 2 B-25's are to KILL THAT CV??? NO,you dont...we were looking to get our cv back.By any means..

                                          

[BnZs]

I don't decide, the community decides. 

Fugi, I said it once and I'll say it again. The "community" HAS decided. Majoritarianism sucks.