Author Topic: Il-2 and Il-10 capabilities and performance (Read 1890 times)

Karnak · « **on:** February 28, 2001, 12:33:00 PM »

Leonid, Vermillion,

Could one of the guys that is knowledgeable about VVS aircraft tell me what the capability and performance differences were between the Il-2 and the Il-10?

Thanks.

------------------
We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother

Sisu
-Karnak

funked · « **Reply #1 on:** February 28, 2001, 02:43:00 PM »

Il-10 has a similar appearance and layout to the Il-2, but it is a smaller, more powerful, more aerodynamic aircraft, based on the Il-1 fighter. Despite more compact size and increased performance, the Il-10 gave up nothing in durability to the Il-2. The only real decline was in wingloading, which shows up in the takeoff distance and probably in turn radius.

Both aircraft could carry 600 kg of bombs.

Il-2 could carry eight 82mm or 132mm rockets, while the Il-10 only carried four.

Il-2 (depending on version) had a pair of cannon, in 20 mm, 23 mm, or 37 mm caliber. Il-10 had two or four 23 mm cannon.

Both planes had two forward-firing 7.62 mm guns. Two seater versions had a 12.7 mm tail gun. There were some single-seat Il-2 that did not have the tail gun.

Here are some stats from Gordon & Khazanov

Il-2/Il-10
Takeoff Power (hp) 1750 / 2000
Gross Weight (lb) 13580 / 13888
Wing Area (ft^2) 414.4 / 322.9
Speed at Sea Level (mph) 233 / 315
Speed at altitude (mph@ft) 242@4000 / 342@7500
Climb to 1000 m (min) 2.2/1.6
Service Ceiling (ft) 19700 / 23800
Operational Range (mi) 685 / 800
Takeoff Run (ft) 1213 / 1558

Free of ordnance, the Il-10 had fabulous performance for an attack aircraft. In mock combat with La-5FN, the Il-10 could give the Lavockin a tough time. Compared to contemporary German attack aircraft (Fw 190F/G), the Il-10 had superior performance when both aircraft were carrying bombs, and was only barely inferior in horizontal performance once the bombs were gone.

The Il-10 is truly deserving of its nickname "Beast" and would be a great addition to the planeset of Aces High. It would give the dedicated ground-pounders a something to go up against all the low-production late-war fighters.

Tony Williams · « **Reply #2 on:** February 28, 2001, 02:49:00 PM »

Agreed. It's worth noting, though, that the Il-2's 23mm cannon were the powerful VYa, whereas the Il-10's were the low-velocity NS-23. The Il-10 never had a "tank-busting" gun, it relied on bombs and rockets.

Tony Williams
Author: Rapid Fire - The Development of Automatic Cannon, Heavy Machine Guns and their Ammunition for Armies, Navies and Air Forces.
Details on my military gun and ammunition website: http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~autogun/

vfGHOSTY · « **Reply #3 on:** February 28, 2001, 03:21:00 PM »

allmost there, but...

IL-10 could carry either 4 or 8 rockets:RS-82 or RS-132. basic IL-10 could be equiped with UB-20 mm cannon instead 12.7 mm UBT.
It had an option of 2 x NS-23 23 mm cannons or it could be equiped with 2 X VY-23 mm. So as you can see Tony those armament were basic for IL-10 and it did had as option VY-23 mm. There was also IL-10M that was heavier due to increase of weight of protection. IL-10M was a little slower and didnt had fantastic turning abilities of original IL-10, but it had better handling abilities and also it carried heavier punch of weapons.

VVS has received first IL-10 by october 1944. IL-10 however was build duiring 1953 through 1954.

I havent heard of 4 X 23 mm or 4 X 34 mm cannons in IL-10 (may it be that you refering to IL-10M?).

P.S. one more thing - I see a lot of reference made to Khazanov. He is a big expert in Russia, also he has a lot of publications, but ... With the time I seen a lot of times when he was wrong and was posting a lot of incorrect data, therefor his status in Russia for Soviet planes is not at top 1, if you know what I mean

[This message has been edited by vfGHOSTY (edited 02-28-2001).]

juzz · « **Reply #4 on:** February 28, 2001, 05:41:00 PM »

Here's a couple of 3-views, Il-10 and Il-2

[This message has been edited by juzz (edited 02-28-2001).]

funked · « **Reply #5 on:** February 28, 2001, 05:51:00 PM »

Ghosty if you got better sources... post'em. Most English-language books on Soviet aircraft are toejam. Gordon & Khazanov is the best we've got.

vfGHOSTY · « **Reply #6 on:** February 28, 2001, 06:09:00 PM »

Since it takes some time for translation I can do 1 plane at a time. Tell me the name of the plane and I will try to find as much info on it as I can. Depending on your pick it can take quite a while.

Regards

leonid · « **Reply #7 on:** February 28, 2001, 06:49:00 PM »

Only thing I would add is that the gunner in an Il-10 was finally in an 8mm thick armoured compartment.

------------------
leonid, Kompol
5 GIAP VVS-KA, Knights

"Our cause is just. The enemy will be crushed. Victory will be ours."

Tony Williams · « **Reply #8 on:** March 01, 2001, 02:03:00 AM »

The Il-10 pictured above appears to have the 4 x NS-23 fit.

Tony Williams
Author: "Rapid Fire: The development of automatic cannon, heavy machine guns and their ammunition for armies, navies and air forces"
Details on my military gun and ammunition website: http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~autogun/index.htm

vfGHOSTY · « **Reply #9 on:** March 01, 2001, 02:39:00 AM »

Quote

VVS has received first IL-10 by october 1944. IL-10 however was build duiring 1953 through 1954.

ha stupid mistake i found in my own post: should be:
VVS has received first IL-10 by october 1944. IL-10M however was build duiring 1953 through 1954.

------------------

[This message has been edited by vfGHOSTY (edited 03-01-2001).]

leonid · « **Reply #10 on:** March 01, 2001, 02:56:00 AM »

Man, it'd be nice if we got one of these in 1.06

------------------
leonid, Kompol
5 GIAP VVS-KA, Knights

"Our cause is just. The enemy will be crushed. Victory will be ours."

Jochen · « **Reply #11 on:** March 01, 2001, 03:07:00 AM »

Wow, over 300 mph in deck... It would be quite difficult to kill, you are undergunned and underarmored in head on attack and you cannot evade rear firing heavy MG because this plane will surely fly as low as possible!

I would think top and side attacks could be effective and once it has bleed energy and got slow, it wouldnt accelerate as good as dedicated fighter. Also must remember drag from external store like bombs and rockets, they can easily take some 20-30 mph from top speed.

Quite a plane!

------------------
jochen Gefechtsverband Kowalewski

Units: I. and II./KG 51, II. and III./KG 76, NSGr 1, NSGr 2, NSGr 20.
Planes: Do 17Z, Ju 87, Ju 88A, He 111H, Ar 234A, Me 410A, Me 262A, Fw 190F, Fw 190G.

Sieg oder bolsevismus!

-lynx- · « **Reply #12 on:** March 01, 2001, 04:11:00 AM »

Quote

Both planes had two forward-firing 7.62 mm guns.

Before disregarding those as "peashooters" keep in mind that ShKAS was the fastest firing MG of WW2 spitting out some 1,800RPM

.

vfGHOSTY · « **Reply #13 on:** March 01, 2001, 04:54:00 AM »

I am going crazy here. I dont have any written info for IL-10 to have 4 cannons. All sources point for 2 cannons VY or NS, 2 ShKAS + 1 rear 12.7 mm or 20 mm.

I have like a dozen of blue prints for IL-10 and most of them do have something like 20 mm with total quantity of 4.

something is really wrong...

------------------

[This message has been edited by vfGHOSTY (edited 03-01-2001).]

Tony Williams · « **Reply #14 on:** March 01, 2001, 03:23:00 PM »

My source is the Squadron/Signal "Il-2 Stormovik in Action". On checking, I have discovered you are right, the original Il-10 had two VYa, although a few of the last production run had NS-23 (the book says two in one place, four in another - I would guess four). The Il-10M had four NR-23, which used the same ammo but was faster-firing.

Tony Williams
Author: Rapid Fire - The Development of Automatic Cannon, Heavy Machine Guns and their Ammunition for Armies, Navies and Air Forces.
Details on my military gun and ammunition website: http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~autogun/

Author Topic: Il-2 and Il-10 capabilities and performance (Read 1890 times)

funked

vfGHOSTY

funked

vfGHOSTY

vfGHOSTY

vfGHOSTY