Author Topic: How would you like to be in this position in Real Life?  (Read 3333 times)

Offline hblair

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How would you like to be in this position in Real Life?
« Reply #30 on: August 29, 2001, 02:53:00 PM »
Cool, thanks for the links funked. I've always been interested in airliners, just never had the oppurtunity to learn much about them.

Offline Hooligan

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« Reply #31 on: August 29, 2001, 02:59:00 PM »
Funked:

Years ago I worked at Boeing for the 737 division.  I am certain that this makes you feel better.

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Offline funkedup

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« Reply #32 on: August 29, 2001, 03:03:00 PM »
Let me guess, you designed rudder PCU valve spools?   :D

Offline Dago

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« Reply #33 on: August 29, 2001, 04:17:00 PM »
I think you will find on the Airbus that the RAT powers the hydraulic system, which in turn can power a motor/generator. Basically a hydraulically driven A/C generator.

dago
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Offline Russian

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« Reply #34 on: August 29, 2001, 05:01:00 PM »
LAJES FIELD, Azores (ACCNS) -- The pilot of a civilian Airbus A330 declared an in-flight emergency due to diminished fuel levels and engine problems and diverted here at 6:35 a.m. today, landing on the runway without power.

The unlit aircraft approached Lajes Field at high speeds and at a higher-than-normal altitude, but the pilot was able to safely land the plane, which had approximately 290 passengers on board.

The plane, part of the Air Transat fleet operating from Canada, departed from Toronto and was en route to Lisbon, but experienced system problems over the Atlantic ocean and diverted toward Lajes Field.

“He hit the pavement and bounced along until coming to a stop with about 2,500 feet of runway remaining.”

"plane’s wheels hit the ground and then the entire landing gear burst into flames."
“It was obvious the plane didn’t have any power, because it was completely dark, and it seemed like the pilot glided in and then slammed on the brakes,” he said. Shortly after landing the fire enveloping the wheels and landing gear was extinguished, and the passengers and crew left the aircraft using inflatable chutes."

“Everyone exited the plane quickly and safely,”

Most of the passengers were taken to the civilian airport terminal, but nine were transported to a local medical clinic for minor injuries and symptoms related to shock.


ps I have picture to go with this, just ask and I'll send it. Picture shows damage to runway and on background airplane with deplayed "slides"

Offline Toad

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« Reply #35 on: August 29, 2001, 05:25:00 PM »
If they were out of gas, odds are the APU wasn't running either. Draws gas from the same tanks the engines do but a weird valve problem might starve the engines while allowing the APU to get gas. Not familiar with Airbus systems.

The RAT probably dropped out (well, they're usually spring loaded) when both engine N2's dropped below a certain RPM. It will drop out even if the APU is running when certain conditions are met. Airbus may use a different system but it's probably similar to this; there's got to be an automatic trigger.

The RAT will usually power a hydraulic system indefinitely if you keep the airspeed above a certain value. Generally, that A/S is above normal landing speed, sometimes quite a bit above.

A RAT hydraulic system will run a HMG (Hydraulic Motor/Generator) indefinitely as long as the hydraulic pressure stays up (airspeed).

Rip, I kind of doubt if it was the Engineers. I'm thinking it was the Boeing lawyers. "Pilot Error" looks so much better than "manufacturer error" in court, don't you think?

Tell me, did they prescribe better training for all the poor b*stards they killed in the -135? (Talking about the hard over rudder problem here, not the incredible stupidity of putting the water injection pumps for the engines (augmented takeoff thrust) on Generator 1 & 2 assymetrically so that when they hit a bump on the runway that tripped either Gen 1 or Gen 2 only (.2 negative G trip.. that's POINT 2, 2/10ths of a G) all the water went out on one side and took them off the runway at high speed.

Yeah, engineers never screw up. Sorry, I forgot. (See Dr. Weiner quote above.)


OK, big crowd just came into the Airport Denny's... gotta go take their order.
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!

Offline Cobra

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« Reply #36 on: August 29, 2001, 05:34:00 PM »
I'll have the lumberjack special, please.....


Cobra

Offline Hobodog

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« Reply #37 on: August 29, 2001, 05:41:00 PM »
Quote
Lastly, although I love Boeings, the best heavy transport I ever flew was the L-1011.  

Nuff' Said this is the last word. Yes and
<!S!> to Ship 728 the final delta L-1011, retired on Aug. 1. There are almost 30 L-1011s lined up side by side wing to wing out in the middle of the desert at VCV in California. There are also almost 20 more lined up in the same fashion at MHV Mojave in the desert. Check those to 3-letters at  airliners.net  they are some great interesting pictures Laurinburg-Maxton is even better but i forgot the 3-letter.

Offline funkedup

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« Reply #38 on: August 29, 2001, 07:11:00 PM »
Here's a good "user friendly" article on the 737 rudder problems:  http://www.pulitzer.org/year/1997/beat-reporting/works/737-3/

Toad:

DOH.  Good point about the APU and fuel.

I know the 727 has two rudder panels with their own actuators, so the pilot has some hope if there is a hardover.  Any other airliners have a setup like that?

Offline Dinger

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« Reply #39 on: August 29, 2001, 09:40:00 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Vruth:

All passengers were evacuated from the plane within 90 seconds.

 
Over 300 people got out in just 90 seconds?!?!?!  WOW. That is insane.


Heh. Certification regulations (correct me if I'm wrong guys) require that an airliner full of pax be able to be completely evacuated in 45 seconds with half the doors malfunctioning.
It helps when those simulated pax are friends and family, and when they're coached to look for the doors with the cameras over them -- they're the ones that open.

Hey, doors are expensive!

[ 08-29-2001: Message edited by: Dinger ]

Offline Dinger

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« Reply #40 on: August 30, 2001, 09:45:00 AM »
OK, Karnak, what was #1 for you?

Offline grizz

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« Reply #41 on: August 30, 2001, 10:28:00 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Dinger:
OK, Karnak, what was #1 for you?


Had to be the Aloha Airlines convertible. Amazing only one flight attendant lost her life considering half the fuselage disappeared.

 

[ 08-30-2001: Message edited by: grizz ]

Offline Dinger

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« Reply #42 on: August 30, 2001, 03:13:00 PM »
There was also that UAL 747 out of Honolulu that suffered explosive decompression after one of the doors blew on climbout.  One guy was sucked outside through the gaping hole in the fuselage; #3 and #4 engines ingested debris and failed.  They did pretty well to bring that one in.

For me, best landing as captured on a transcript, has gotta be the one associated with this picture:
 
namely,
 http://aviation-safety.net/cvr/cvr_ja46e.shtml

highflyer

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« Reply #43 on: August 30, 2001, 03:32:00 PM »
Im surprised noone has mentioned any type of Accumulator...

Do not the heavies have some form up Emergency blow down via 4000/3000 psi Accumulator?

possibly for limited flight control movments either?

hmm...

Offline funkedup

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« Reply #44 on: August 30, 2001, 06:05:00 PM »
Highflyer I'm sure there's accumulators, but that's going to take up space and add weight.  Both are no-nos on aircraft.  Otherwise they'd have some big batteries or a backup diesel generator.   So there's probably some small accumulators in the hydro systems.

[ 08-30-2001: Message edited by: funkedup ]