Author Topic: Boy was I wrong. P-38 is suposed to be crappy like it is in AH  (Read 7928 times)

Offline AKDejaVu

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Boy was I wrong. P-38 is suposed to be crappy like it is in AH
« Reply #105 on: January 23, 2001, 09:22:00 AM »
 
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AKDejaVu rambled:

Well.. at least you didn't call me son.  Your condescension in duly noted.

 
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First of all, where have I claimed that my experience makes me more of an expert of the P-38? The answer is nowhere.

Actually, the answer is here:

 
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Voss wrote:
"Your experience has nothing to do with P-38's. Further, you attitude and tone come off as pompous and hypocritical."

You wrote: My experience has a great deal to do with the P-38. I spent most of my career in piston engine, prop driven twins in the 17,000 to 25,000 lb class having power to weight ratios equal to the P-38. Where does your expertise come from? I know, ya saw it on Tee Vee, right?

You site your experience as having a great deal to do with the P-38, then ask where HIS expertise came from.  That directly implies your expertise came from experience?

Let me re-ask what voss was asking: "WHAT DOES YOUR FLIGHT EXPERIENCE HAVE TO DO WITH IDIOSYNCRISIS OF THE P-38'S HANDLING CHARACTERISTICS?"

 
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Do you grasp the meaning of "useful insight"? Don't you think that several hundred hours of actual cockpit experience and flight training in twin-engine aircaft of comparible power and weight, provides some relevant insight into the handling of an aircraft with several significant similarities?

Er.. wait.. are you saying your experience does or doesn't make you more knowledgable on the P-38?  You're going in circles now.  It seems as if you really just want to say whatever makes you look better.

Do I think your flight time matters?  Yes I do.  Do I think your flight time gives you any insight into the stall characteristics of a p-38?  No I don't.  It is the differences that made planes quirky.. not the similarities.  Its difficult to argue that the plane didn't have quirks because you flew a similar thrust/weight aircraft.  Yet.. you do it... repeatedly.

 
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I have spent countless hours discussing the P-38 and its performance with pilots who have flown the aircraft in combat.

Great!  Like I said.. your research is commendable.  Your initial response to Voss was comendable (though it was condescending too) because it was research and report based.  How can you argue with people that have actually flown the plane?  How can you argue with numbers generated by people that actually flew the plane?  You can't.  All you can do is present the numbers and let them speak for themselves.

How can you argue with someone that claims they have enough twin engine experience to feel they are in tune with P-38 handling? Well... that's pretty easy.

Present the facts, present the discussions, present the letters.  All of these things lead me to believe Voss was in the wrong with his argument.  Your mention of your flight time leads me to believe you are an egotistical condescending toejam that inevitably has to go to the flight time card to prove his worth.

The great information provided in this thread was not as a result of your flight time.  The great information was provided to you from others.

AKDejaVu


Offline Voss

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Boy was I wrong. P-38 is suposed to be crappy like it is in AH
« Reply #106 on: January 23, 2001, 12:29:00 PM »
I used to subscribe to "Warbirds Worldwide." In that great magazine I first read about the discovery of "The Lost Squadron" of P-38's and their recent recovery. Then I opened up a few past issues and read about the demise of three P-38's in a single year.
Then I thought back upon the crashes I had seen, personally.

No, I didn't quote any references. It doesn't make me wrong. Perhaps, I didn't state my 'opinion' in a different tone than Widewing (opinionated), but I think I have that right (again, my opinion). However, I have been villified for having an opinion? Is there a commonality here?

Now, I think back to statements I have heard over the years. No one of wisdom said, "Go out and fly a P-38 as your first twin." I don't have to wonder why. I heard plenty of disparaging comments on the P-38. You don't agree, so be it.

This guy is writing a book on the P-38. Well, you don't have to fly one to write about an airplane, or its experience in war. It's not experience in combat, either, that makes a writer a writer. The writing I have seen here has a most decidedly negative tone to it, and I think his voice will come across the same in his book. For that reason, I will avoid it. There won't be any new information in it, anyway.

I'll stick with my statement about the P-38. It is still killing people. There are about a dozen being restored, right now. Regrettably, I expect there are going to be another dozen deaths attributed to this plane. They belong in museums, not on the flight line.

It is also my opinion, that I have forgotten more about flight then he will ever know. You can flame me for this comment, and my opinion will still carry weight with a lot of guys flying this sim. "I think 50,000 hours of R/C carries more weight then 2,400 hours of real flight experience." In that time I have met more Spitfire, Hurricane, B-17, B-26, A-26, B-29, F4U, P-38, P-47, P-51, P-40, F4F, F6F, F8F, FW190, ME109, ME 262, Stuka, and real life FIGHTER PILOTS (not cargo jocks, but those too), then you will ever know (or interview). They are drawn to models like moths to a flame. I have bought many of them lunch, and shared bench time with them all. When you meet these guys you don't have to ask for credentials. They don't hang out on UBB's. I know what I know and won't be beaten down by negative attitude.

You can live on in ignorance. It makes no difference to me. I will still share my opinion and attempt to edify the poorly informed as I see fit.

Voss 13th T.A.S.

Offline Hooligan

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Boy was I wrong. P-38 is suposed to be crappy like it is in AH
« Reply #107 on: January 23, 2001, 12:54:00 PM »
There is a bottom line for AH.

If NEW authoritative flight data (i.e. Air Force, Lockheed or similar quality documents) for the P-38 are presented to HTC that indicate that the 38 FM needs adjustment, then there is a very good chance that the FM will be changed.  If this does not happen then there is no chance.

Either that data is revealed or it is not.  Nothing else matters much.

Hooligan

Offline AKDejaVu

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Boy was I wrong. P-38 is suposed to be crappy like it is in AH
« Reply #108 on: January 23, 2001, 01:38:00 PM »
Sigh.. way to go Voss.. I guess you just refuse to be out-done on any front.

The thing that irritates me about 50% of the people that do hard-core research into a subject is the proceding need to prove that you know more about it than anyone.

Now.. we have to resort to how many hours of R/C vs how many hours as a loadmaster lends more/less credence to someone's evaluation on departure characteristics of the P-38.  You have got to be kidding.

AKDejaVu

Offline Voss

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Boy was I wrong. P-38 is suposed to be crappy like it is in AH
« Reply #109 on: January 23, 2001, 02:58:00 PM »
Well, I didn't really mean that my R/C experience alone gave me clear insight into the problem. I do say that the guys I have spoken with know more than this guy ever will, and I have forgotten more then he's been taught! I've met his like before.

I am sorry you can't see the same page, Deja. However, I am in complete agreement with a lot of what you have written. Just not the anti-Voss stuff.  

One of the guys in my AMT class (aviation maintenance technician and an instructor actually) really put the fear-of-god into us about this sort of design. I believe his comment was something like, "Make sure as hell you don't ever pork a repair on something like this. God knows it'll crash someday and you're gonna take the blame for it, perfect or not!" Back in WWII he was working maintenance for the Army. Early on, and with every batch of fresh recruits, they would get frequent returns to base after a mission started. He took the bellybutton chewing for poor maintenance knowing all the while there was nothing wrong with his work. He didn't work on 38's, though. (like I said, forgotten more...) I have been around planes for a LONG time.

I don't think I know more then everyone. I do scoff at the notion that this guy can pull rank on the basis of 2400 hours in anything other then a P-38. I am sorry that stating F-A-C-T-S about discussions with REAL WWII PILOTS and crewmen gave you this impression. I have seen WAY too many Navy dweebs pop up at the field, wet-behind-the-ears and drooling at every plane he sees. "I'm a fighter pilot. I fly an F-18/A-7/etc. I bet I can fly that!" WRONG! heh
Yeah, and fix transmissions too, right?

I didn't realize that research could ever be hard-core, unless it was a reconnoiter of enemy territory.  

Alas, I tire of this thread. I'm going fishing and then I'm going to visit Missouri. My benefactor has a Spitfire (a real one) up there that is looking at about 12,000 hours of repair and refit (gross estimate). I haven't even seen the thing, yet, but I am looking forward to it. I'm thinking every part and piece will have to be replaced. God, what a joy!

I'm a dot! <---- indicates I ain't returning to this thread. 100 messages just kills a 9600 modem  

Voss 13th T.A.S.

Offline Widewing

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Boy was I wrong. P-38 is suposed to be crappy like it is in AH
« Reply #110 on: January 23, 2001, 03:20:00 PM »
In response to AKDejaVu's disjointed reasoning, I offer the following questions and observations.

I believe that you may suffer from a reading comprehension disorder. Time and time again, you misunderstand simple statements, or worse, you deliberately mis-state and mis-characterize. Debating with you is fruitless, because you imagine issues not yet in evidence. You even take it upon yourself to re-invent specific comments by others in the thread.

What is it in your past that causes you to feel intimidated and belittled if someone should use their experience as a baseline for understanding specific issues? Could it be that your self-image is so low that you can only feel good about yourself if you can drag everyone down into your mire? Or, could it be that your position as a honey-bucket specialist aboard that C-141 has left you with a resentment towards those who had greater opportunities? Do we need an Affirmative Action program for Wannabes?

What we need in this discussion is rational thought, not the confused and poorly reasoned examples offered to date. I should remind you that it was you who puffed out your feathers and strutted about scratching the dirt, announcing that I owed you an explanation. Well, what I owed to you has been delivered in a timely fashion. Ironically, when I mirrored your tone and inflection, you resort to terms such as my being an "egotistical condescending toejam".

Your debate reminds me of that lawyer maxim that says, "If the law is on your side, argue the law. If the facts are on your side, argue the facts. If neither the law or the facts are on your side, holler." In your case, you just call names.

You see, it's not an ego thing at all. It's just a lowering threshold for foolishness.

Re-read my last posting, and this time actually pay attention rather than look for cracks in the armor.

My regards,

Widewing
My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.

Offline AKDejaVu

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Boy was I wrong. P-38 is suposed to be crappy like it is in AH
« Reply #111 on: January 23, 2001, 03:37:00 PM »
Right widewing...

Just call names.. or come up with pithy "quoted by" statements and then feign ignorance when anyone points out your egotistical attitude.

I mean.. what could you possible have done other than over-hype your "flight experience" in order to prove your point?

My flight experience in cargo planes is limited to the passenger capacity.  Amazing how much can be read into things when you just say "flight time" eh?  Of course, I had more flight time than some of the pilots that served in WW2... but that's not really the point.. is it?

I've read your posts.  They do go in circles.  You cite bombers being used to train pilots as justification for noting similarities between a cargo plane and a p-38.  I'm sure they did it only because they had similar handling characteristics.  It couldn't have possibly been because it allowed an instructor to fly with a student in order to teach him twin engine management technics.  You know.. that semi-critical thing that you cite as the cause of an author's death?  I'm sure it couldn't have been to emulate any of the quirky fuel transfer methods mentioned in that letter you posted either.  It MUST have been because they handled so similarly... it almost makes you wonder why they didn't just use that bomber in the first play... why even bother with the P-38.

The truth is, I don't know much about the P-38.  I have to get it from what I read here and in the limited number of books I come across.  The only problem is, whenever I see information or stories presented, it ends up boiling down to an argument between to data laden egomaniacs that will not stop until the world accepts they are the foremost authority on the topic at hand.

So now, I have to wade through someone spewing off about his 2400 hours as a crew-chief.. or his 50,000 hours of R/C time as if any of that really matters in regards to P-38's.

I really love you taking the opportunity to degrade Air Force loadmasters.  I guess that ego needed just a tad bit more boosting.

It all comes down to this:  Were you a navy pilot?  Do you allow people to maintain that perception?

I'll answer that for you:

No you weren't a navy pilot
Yes you allow people to think that

I find it incredibly ironic that you are falling into the same trap that Voss is being constantly ridiculed for.  After a while, you'll start to believe yourself too.

AKDejaVu

Offline Jimdandy

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Boy was I wrong. P-38 is suposed to be crappy like it is in AH
« Reply #112 on: January 23, 2001, 04:10:00 PM »
 
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Originally posted by Citabria:
was a crappy plane that always broke couldnt go fast and couldnt turn any. crappy climber in real life too. all other US planes were way better

Damn Cit I love it! I can see that the way to get some response to your post is to bad mouth a plane. Look at all the info. I love how it starts with this vague sloppy statement with no factual data and grows into a sounding board for the world. LOL! Not that I have a thing wrong with you posting your statement as a mater of opinion. But man you would think that what you posted was some damning FACTS about the P-38. LOL! I love how it ballooned.

Offline Citabria

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Boy was I wrong. P-38 is suposed to be crappy like it is in AH
« Reply #113 on: January 23, 2001, 04:54:00 PM »
my best troll yet for sure
Fester was my in game name until September 2013

Offline Widewing

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Boy was I wrong. P-38 is suposed to be crappy like it is in AH
« Reply #114 on: January 23, 2001, 07:31:00 PM »
AKDejaVu whined:

"I mean.. what could you possible have done other than over-hype your "flight experience" in order to prove your point?"

I must commend you on a remarkable ability to prove my argument for me. Indeed, you do have a reading comprehension disorder. How else could one explain the fact that YOU hyped my flight record beyond anything I could manage to present. YOU challenged me to state what aircraft I had crewed. YOU were the person who, after having the relevance explained in a detailed, yet simple manner, completely misunderstood what was being stated. How do manage to function in day to day life?

AKDejaSnooze continues:

"My flight experience in cargo planes is limited to the passenger capacity.  Amazing how much can be read into things when you just say "flight time" eh?"

It did not take much thought to conclude that you were a member of the honey-bucket brigade. Your speech and manner were a dead giveaway. It was obvious that your visits to the cockpit were along the order of delivering coffee to the flight crew. No shame in that, mind you. Every loadmaster that I knew began with honey-bucket duty, myself included. It's part of the ritual.
Unfortunately, the Air Force is more into specialization, at least we cross trained....

AKDejaPooh drops trousers for a weenie measuring contest:

"Of course, I had more flight time than some of the pilots that served in WW2... but that's not really the point.. is it?"

This leads to the basic question: Did you learn anything?

AKDejaCrank rationalizes:

"I've read your posts.  They do go in circles."  

Is it my fault that you have an attention span shorter than a gnat's donut?

He continues:

"You cite bombers being used to train pilots as justification for noting similarities between a cargo plane and a p-38."  

Hmm.... For your edification, the US-2B was converted from an anti-submarine bomber. The C-1A was a lighter, somewhat higher performing development of that same anti-sub aircraft.

AkKnucklehead blindly forges ahead:

"I'm sure they did it only because they had similar handling characteristics.  It couldn't have possibly been because it allowed an instructor to fly with a student in order to teach him twin engine management technics."  

Do you also suffer from dyslexia? You cannot seem to quote accurately. Here it is again, read slowly and sound out the syllables. "the 20th FG used a B-25 for basic multi-engine training of single-engine pilots who were assigned to fly the P-38. Why, because they had some similar characteristics."

I don't see the word 'handling' anywhere in there, do you? Why do you insist on distorting the facts to suit your argument? Perhaps, because you don't have an argument.

AKDejaFlake proceeds to demonstrate his brilliant reasoning skills:

"You know.. that semi-critical thing that you cite as the cause of an author's death?  I'm sure it couldn't have been to emulate any of the quirky fuel transfer methods mentioned in that letter you posted either.  It MUST have been because they handled so similarly... it almost makes you wonder why they didn't just use that bomber in the first play... why even bother with the P-38."

Perhaps, you should stick to what you know, although I'm at a loss as to what that might be.

Since you have difficulty comprehending what you read, this may be a futile exercise. Nonetheless, I'll educate you on the fuel system of the P-38 that Jeff crashed. It was not fitted with external drop tanks. Therefore, the selector valves were turned to main or reserve. This P-38 was no longer fitted with self-sealing fuel tanks, but with brand new aluminum units. There is nothing difficult about turning the selector handles, unless you have on heavy gloves for high altitude flight. There is nothing one could remotely describe as "quirky". Nor was there on the 1944 aircraft either. Selector valves are aways 'stiff'. Those on the P-38 had relatively short handles, providing little mechanical advantage.

As to your other nonsense; virtually all large, heavy twins have operating characteristics that are similar in several respects. Just as important is the need to learn how to manage a relatively complex cockpit and still manage to fly the aircraft with your head out of the cockpit. Do you understand what that means?

AKDejaDork finally gets something right:

"The truth is, I don't know much about the P-38."

Your kidding, right?

He goes on:

"I have to get it from what I read here and in the limited number of books I come across.  The only problem is, whenever I see information or stories presented, it ends up boiling down to an argument between to data laden egomaniacs that will not stop until the world accepts they are the foremost authority on the topic at hand."

I see now. Everyone who has researched more, who has learned more and therefore knows more is an egomaniac. Is that your point? Well, if it is, I would suggest a hat.

AKBlahBlahBlah laments:

So now, I have to wade through someone spewing off about his 2400 hours as a crew-chief..

STOP HERE! Make note of the term CREWCHIEF, because it's relevant to Ak's final Big Lie
at the end of his diatribe.

AK presses on:

"I really love you taking the opportunity to degrade Air Force loadmasters.  I guess that ego needed just a tad bit more boosting."

Nice try numbnuts. However, you may recall that I qualified as a Loadmaster in two aircraft. Moreover, I did mention that I have a close friend who is a C-130 Loadmaster. I was merely reminding you of your stature within the hierarchy of an aircrew.

AKDejaBullfeathers tries the Big Lie:

"It all comes down to this:  Were you a navy pilot?  Do you allow people to maintain that perception?"

Remember the term CREWCHIEF? It is obvious that I have explicitly defined my position within the flight crew. Poor old DejaPoop has been taking a flogging of his own creation. Now, because he can offer nothing of substance, he goes beyond mis-quotes, mis-characterizations, and fact twisting. Here he goes all out by attempting to smear with a bold faced fabrication. Bad form, very bad form. Listen, if you can't compete within the rules, kindly leave the playing field.

True to form, AKFabricator says:

"I'll answer that for you:"

I'd rather you didn't. I haven't much use for sub-standard immitations.

Rambling on:

"No you weren't a navy pilot"

Gee, after some 2,000 words written, you finally understood something I wrote!

AK's final attempt to save face (Too late,  might add):
 
"Yes you allow people to think that"

Well, you sir, are a liar and a fool.

Tell me one thing. Do you believe that driving a rust-bucket '71 Blazer offers you added insight to the driving characteristics of an equally oxidized '74 Chevy pickup?

Widewing

My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.

Offline Jimdandy

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Boy was I wrong. P-38 is suposed to be crappy like it is in AH
« Reply #115 on: January 23, 2001, 09:12:00 PM »
 
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Originally posted by Citabria:
my best troll yet for sure

Look at it Cit! It's brilliant! It has a life of it's own now. Your insignificant compared to your creation. As Dr. Frankenstein would say "It's alive!" Not only have you got people dredging up the specific gravity of the rivets on a P-38 you got two people about ready to kill each other. I'm in awe of it Cit. WOW! Congratulations. I tried to warn them all early on of the troll factors involved but no one heeded my warning. They all dove for the hook. They not only swallowed it but crapped it out the other side! What a great little experiment in human nature this turned out to be. As I said way back in the beginning I'm glad you didn't call it ugly too. God knows where you would be if you would have done that! LMAO!  



[This message has been edited by Jimdandy (edited 01-23-2001).]

Offline AKDejaVu

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Boy was I wrong. P-38 is suposed to be crappy like it is in AH
« Reply #116 on: January 23, 2001, 10:49:00 PM »
Thankyou for that reply widewing.  You said what an idiot you are far better than I ever could.

Dang.. Its nice to know so much and be so right isn't it.

Learning all those things about P-38's in the navy really pays off at times like this.  You get to utilize that snappy P-38 wit that made you the living legend in your own mind you have become today.

Once again, you are only here to prove how right you are whenever it comes to p-38's.  Everyone must bow to your knowledge... and when that doesn't work out.. people must bow to your flight experience... and when that doesn't work out.. people must bow to your witty play on their ID... and when that doesn't work out.. you just go back to your room and beat off to the thought that "you really showed him".

Simple.. no play on words... EGOMANIAC.

AKDejaVu

Offline AKDejaVu

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Boy was I wrong. P-38 is suposed to be crappy like it is in AH
« Reply #117 on: January 23, 2001, 11:14:00 PM »
In a post by you Widewing...

 
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Originally posted by Voss:

I snipped this badly inform exercise in wind breaking. However, let me clear up one thing that is usually ignored.

Insulting to say the least.  I read and re-read Voss's post.  I fail to see where he insulted you in it.  I do see where he proffessed knowledge in an arena that is clearly your own.  Wether he was wrong or right... well I fail to see how this was merrited.

Something Dune said after this:

 
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Voss, I too am a P-51 fan.
But I have never heard anyone refer to the -38 the way you do. Not in any of the pilot's stories about it, nor any other reports.

I've gone through the history of my grandfather's FG, the 364th, and not a single pilot talks about the "widow-maker" capabilities the way you do. I've read reports from pilots who flew that plane in every theater in the war. None of them feel the same way you do.

I'm not sure where you got this idea, but everything I've seen says it's not true.

Wow.. disagreeing with Voss and not being insulting.  IT CAN BE DONE!

Oooo.. and this is a good one to Voss again from you widewing:

 
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Young man, don't you care that you have managed to demonstrate to everyone here that you are a self-important know-nothing?

And is this drastically worse than a self-important know-something?  The only real difference in this case is that your oppinion seems to be more fact based than Voss's.  I say oppinion, because neither of you have flown the P-38 and everything you do know about it is simply through osmosis.  Sure, you claim closeness to the aircraft, but it is with a degree of separation.  You seem to forget that.

And here's were it starts to get REAL good:

 
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"That spells "disaster waiting to happen" to any unwary pilot and lots of wary ones too! How many war pilots died after their first mistake? Thank your lucky stars you only fly these rigs from the safety of your computer desk!"

Hmmm.... Gee, and I thought my 332 traps (a trap is a full-stop landing on an aircraft carrier, a real carrier) and 2,400 hours (in real military aircraft) would have provided me with some useful insight into the handling of the P-38. Silly me! Who could have known that Voss was such an expert?

Oh yes.. the HANDLING word...  Not the TWIN ENGINE MANAGEMENT phrase.  I'm sure you were more qualified to fly this plane than the person you "had more time on the crapper than" just based on this flight time alone.  Oh wait.. that's right.. you were only citing HIS p-38 time.  Somehow that was important for the people that flew it.. but not really for the people that sit back and criticize how they flew it.

After that, you simply go off on self-righteous bable.  Afterall.. you've already proven how right you are.

Voss looked like a real toejam-heal for hopping into this without anything to really back up what he was saying.  You look like a real toejam-heal for how you handled being right.

AKDejaVu

Offline Andy Bush

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Boy was I wrong. P-38 is suposed to be crappy like it is in AH
« Reply #118 on: January 24, 2001, 07:41:00 AM »
Whew!! This is quite a thread. I just got around to reading it, wondering what could possibly be so interesting as to justify 100+ responses. Now I know!

One quick question for Widewing. In the USN, does a 'crew chief' perform the same duties as a 'flight engineer' does in the USAF? Insofar as you folks are discussing flight matters, the question might be relevant.

I do have to say that I got the same initial impression that someone else mentioned...that you were a pilot. Not that there is anything wrong with other crew positions...but a pilot is a pilot, and everybody else isn't. For example, when I first started out as an airline pilot, I flew as a flight engineer on a B-727. When I upgraded to First Officer and then Captain, I did it on the DC-9/MD-80 aircraft. Today, after 12+ years and 8500 hours of airline time, I think I would be very careful before I started advising folks on how to fly the 727. Not without some serious qualifiers, that is...such as the fact that I never have actually 'flown' the 727, only flown in it. Managing engine performance and fuel expenditure is one thing...flying an engine out procedure is something entirely else.

Andy

Offline Widewing

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Boy was I wrong. P-38 is suposed to be crappy like it is in AH
« Reply #119 on: January 24, 2001, 08:25:00 AM »
AKDejaVu sulks:

"Dang.. Its nice to know so much and be so right isn't it (sic)."

As I've said before, you obviously suffer from some sort of contorted 'noodle' envy towards those who make a concerted effort to study WWII aircraft and operational history. Why can't you simply benefit from the research of these people without offering up a school yard challenge?

AKSoreLoser offers his ongoing mantra:

"Learning all those things about P-38's in the navy really pays off at times like this.  You get to utilize that snappy P-38 wit that made you the living legend in your own mind you have become today."

Since you have had less than nothing to add to the P-38 discussion, and because you have suffered the slings and arrows of your own need to drag everyone down to your level of ignorance, any further discussion with you is pointless.

AKDangerMouse spews forth:

Once again, you are only here to prove how right you are whenever it comes to p-38's.  Everyone must bow to your knowledge... and when that doesn't work out.. people must bow to your flight experience... and when that doesn't work out.. people must bow to your witty play on their ID... and when that doesn't work out.. you just go back to your room and beat off to the thought that "you really showed him".

My knowledge of the P-38. or any other aircraft is not the issue here. Furthermore, I am always open to learning from those who have something to offer, which naturally excludes you.

As to witty plays on one's ID: It's not always easy to create a new description for the same individual, and I could not have accomplished it without your able assistance. Indeed, if nothing has worked out, why are you resorting to base name calling (without a shred of cleverness)?

In line with the rules of the road: "Slow traffic keep right".

AKDejaDweeb expounds further:

"Simple.. no play on words... EGOMANIAC."

Simple is good, wouldn't want to tax your limited vocabulary and language skills.

Get a grip on yourself.

Widewing

My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.