My, I wasn't aware that you were such an accomplished amazinhunk. You ignore everything which addresses most of the roadkill you posted earlier. Instead, you get downright nasty over the Easy Eight (also ignoring the armor details of the M4A3E2, which clearly shows it to be better protected in the turret and rear superstructure than the big boogieman Tiger II).
Now, I admit I was more than vague in defining what Shermans had the heavy armor, which I have already corrected after I re-read the post.
So let's discuss the Easy Eights.
Records reportedly exist in the archives of the U.S. Army Ordnance Museum at the Aberdeen Proving Ground, and technical (maintenance and part catalog) manuals were issued for an unspecified number of M4A3E8 tanks manufactured to M4A3E2 armor standards, including the 152mm thick T23A2 turret. All were manufactured at the Fisher Tank Arsenal. All were HVSS models, which could better handle the increased weight. Unlike the Jumbo, these did not have a lower final drive ratio. Only one source gives a number of 438 built. I can find that nowhere else.
you will be able to be verify this by checking the following:
Sherman - A History of the American Medium Tank, by R.P. Hunnicutt.
Could Hunnicutt be wrong? Maybe, but I know of one former tanker who swears that he saw up-armored Easy Eights in Korea and there are mentions of them in maintenance reports dating back to July of 1945. The only thing that I am dissatisfied with is getting verifiable data as to the number made. Fisher Tank Arsenal records are hopeless according to the folks at the Army Ordnance Museum. Which bothers me becuase so many historians have used the records and taken them at face value. It may interest you to know that the museum believes that one of their E8s has upgraded armor, but the guy I spoke with couldn't tell me much more. The tank is parked along a road on the base. As of September 11, the museum is closed to non-military visitors.
Why was I inquiring? I was, and still am involved in researching some material for an author.
In March of 1945, the supply of 76mm HVAP ammo was such that it was being issued to units operating the M4A3 tanks with the M1A1, M1A1C and M1A2 76mm guns. Likewise, at least 235 of the M4A3E2 Jumbos were upgraded to the M1A1 gun, which by the way was not "a piece of garbage", and is still in service today in the Serbian and Croatian armies on their remaining M18s.
Gun Test data was taken directly from published sources.
In the future you would do well to keep the rude behavior and nasty comments to yourself. Unless, of course, you prefer to generate heat rather than light.
My regards,
Widewing
Originally posted by GRUNHERZ:
114mm for the sherman M4A3 front armor??????
Your data is ridiculous.
Every M4A3 had only a 2.5 inch frontal plate. Where you get 114mm is beyond me?
Are you confusing it with the 46ton Jumbo? You are saying that the limited production unreliable 46ton heavier than M26 Jumbo assault tank had standard armor of M4A3. Thats damn desperate.
The M4A3E8 had no armor improvement over standard M4A3.
Most Shermans DID NOT have duckbills, in fact it was exceedingly rare and actually a bit ineffective because they tended to fall off. HVSS were rare anyway.
You are saying that M4A3 has better armor in many areas than TigerII, listen to yourself.
The 76mm was garbage and in no way compared to either 17lbr or Kwk42L70, it was inferior to the 75mm L48 of the PanzerIV.
Your idea that Sherman could withstand frontal fire from the Panther is beyond me. Its really interesting that your wild examples read exactly reverse of every recorded combat of Sherman vs Panther. You are saying that it was Sherman that could withstand fire, but that the Panthers had to go for side shots. Are you drunk?
And Again M4A3E8 was just an M4A3 with HVSS it had no thicker armor.
Yes they did weld on extra 1 inch plates on the glacis in the field, sometimes even two, why would they do that if Shermans were frontally invulnerable to everything but an 88L71?
Widewing your last post has so many innacuracies Im just gonna give up, I dont have the nerve to deal with it.
I am done with this thread as it has clearly degenerated beyond logic with your delusions about the Sherman impregnable super armor battleship. You are beyond help, I feel sorry for you.
Bye Bye.
