Author Topic: What to get: 2006 Z06 or 2006 911 S?  (Read 44500 times)

Offline Reaper90

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Re: What to get: 2006 Z06 or 2006 911 S?
« Reply #255 on: September 04, 2009, 04:06:40 PM »
And the quality.

Having owned 3 Vettes ('68 427 convertible, '90 6-spd Z51 coupe, and now '99 Coupe) and having numerous friends and a few family members with many different varieties of Porsches, street cars as well as race cars......

I'll file that one away as "urban legend."

Just never have seen anything to make me feel like (other than perhaps a little nicer grade of leather on the interior than GM is willing to provide) that there is a significantly higher level of quality anywhere in the Porsche than there is in the Vette.

Not reliability, ease of maintenance (the Vette CLEARLY wins in that department), build quality, durability, etc.

The problem with the average non-Vette enthusiast is they are somehow unable to realize that the Vette is like nothing else that GM makes...... it really and truly should be it's own brand and get the Chevy name off of it. It's no more like anything else Chevy makes than a BMW M5 is like a SmartCar.

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Offline Reaper90

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Re: What to get: 2006 Z06 or 2006 911 S?
« Reply #256 on: September 04, 2009, 04:08:08 PM »
I bet this crappy eurobox beats it on the school run... Or at the shops.

(Image removed from quote.)

I would hang my head in shame if I had paid money for that ugly monstrosity.....

 :rofl
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Offline Die Hard

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Re: What to get: 2006 Z06 or 2006 911 S?
« Reply #257 on: September 04, 2009, 04:08:40 PM »
Indeed!
It is better to be violent, if there is violence in our hearts, than to put on the cloak of nonviolence to cover impotence.

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Offline Die Hard

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Re: What to get: 2006 Z06 or 2006 911 S?
« Reply #258 on: September 04, 2009, 04:10:02 PM »
Having owned 3 Vettes ('68 427 convertible, '90 6-spd Z51 coupe, and now '99 Coupe) and having numerous friends and a few family members with many different varieties of Porsches, street cars as well as race cars......

I'll file that one away as "urban legend."

Just never have seen anything to make me feel like (other than perhaps a little nicer grade of leather on the interior than GM is willing to provide) that there is a significantly higher level of quality anywhere in the Porsche than there is in the Vette.

Not reliability, ease of maintenance (the Vette CLEARLY wins in that department), build quality, durability, etc.

The problem with the average non-Vette enthusiast is they are somehow unable to realize that the Vette is like nothing else that GM makes...... it really and truly should be it's own brand and get the Chevy name off of it. It's no more like anything else Chevy makes than a BMW M5 is like a SmartCar.



The leather is good, but the plastics are atrocious.
It is better to be violent, if there is violence in our hearts, than to put on the cloak of nonviolence to cover impotence.

-Gandhi

Offline CAP1

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Re: What to get: 2006 Z06 or 2006 911 S?
« Reply #259 on: September 04, 2009, 04:11:39 PM »

Cappy and I use to be squaddies, I just like busting his stones from time to time that's all, he's a good guy.

 I just don't like Dodge products. Many like Chevy, many Ford many ,Toyota. Being a contractor I have subcontractors and friends that have all types of trucks. The generally consciences with the crowd that I run with is that the Dodge trucks seem to be at the bottom of the line as far as overall considerations went. Most that had diesel powered trucks liked the Ford's and Chevy especially the new Chevy's . The Allison tranny seemed to be the main reason for the Chevy's popularity. That being said it seemed that the Ford was the most popular and the most praise. With standard trucks it seemed to go to Chevy more then Ford for the big trucks go although the new Tundra has some liking it better then their old standard Ford or Chevy trucks. It's just  a matter of opinion and like I said I do not like Dodge products.

for heavy duty work trucks....like contractors......around here, fords. e and f series 250 and 350's. the only common problem they have is bvalljoints. if they have over 60k on em than the balljoints are bad. period. it's a poor design. ford simply kept things close to when they used kingpins, and stuck balljoints in there.......this overstresses em, and they go bad.
 no problems with the ford deisels, although the turbo-deisels are over complicated.

 the gm 6.5 deisel tends to have injector pump problems.
 not very many people around here use dodge trucks for any contractor type of work. that all seems to be ford and gm.
 most dodges around here seem to be the dakotas and durangos......almost always modified in some way.

for towtrucks(i worked for a company with 7 of em) based on personal experience, and that of other local companies.......

 my old boss had 7. 3 fords, and 4 gm's. they had cat(i think) engines in the fords, and duramax engines(i dunno who makes them) in the gm's. they ALL had allison trannies.
 the gm's never gave any engine problems, although the 07 ford, and the 05 ford had injector problems. the fords never had any other issues. the gm's used to eat up rear brakes a LOT. they all averaged 8 to 12 miles a gallon.
 the fords were f650's, and the gm's were 6500's. all gvwr'd at 26,500.
 most companies locally with this size truck use fords.

 a lot of companies that choose to use smaller trucks, mostly use ford f-450 superdutys. they're usually powered by the 7.3 powerstroke turbo-deisel. haven't seen any major problems with them.
 
i've not seen too many toyotas used for contractor type work yet.(newer ones that is.) the older ones that i do see in use as work trucks, are lookin like old fords and chevys.......mostly rusted away.
 the tacomas and titans i see, look like they're just there to be "pretty". there's a guy that gases up out front, and feels the need to rev his engine, like he thinks it impresses people. kinda funny in a sad way.


 like i've said before, i base my opinions on real world experience. i work on em all. idler arms on the gm's, balljoints on the fords.......not much on the dodges. usually water pumps, or the like. they just don't get heavy duty use around here.

 i still favor fords for performance. i had a 12 second mustang(passed nj state insp with flying colors too). that got totaled. now it's drivetrain is in a 78 futura.
 i have a 68 camaro. it used to run 9.9's. with the new engine, once i can afford to run it, she should dip into the high 8's.
 i've never had my dakota on the strip, but i think specs were somewhere in the mid 14's....and that's about what she feels like on the street.

 
 
ingame 1LTCAP
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Offline Masherbrum

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Re: What to get: 2006 Z06 or 2006 911 S?
« Reply #260 on: September 04, 2009, 04:25:39 PM »
Reason why the F-350 is the best?   Dana 60 front + 10.25" Sterling in the rear = Simplicity and true "Heavy-Duty".   Yes, aside from the ball joints, you have no issues other than maintaining the fluid in the Diff.  

Dodge Ram "solid front axles" are weaker than a Dana 44 (which is mid-duty, but a reliable axle).  

Understand I am looking at this from my perspective of someone with quite a bit of Four Wheeling experience throughout the Great Lakes region.   I took my 96 F-150 to Moab and didn't get to crazy, but scraped the frame at times.   I don't buy "Mallcrawlers".    I don't tow my Grand Cherokee with a 3.5" lift and 31" tires to events.   When I had my 83 CJ-7 with a 304, 4.27 gearing, Detroit Locked f/r, 33" BFG muds, I drove it 250 miles to the event.   Nothing better than a 304 at around 2500rpm @ 60mph with the true dual exhaust I had on it.    If I break on the trail, I fix it and drive it 250 miles home. 

Personally, if you're buying a truck and find yourself "lowering it" or "adding 20's", buy a car.   I laugh at "20" laden "trucks" spin out on the freeway because the dolts think that a "street tire in 4wd Hi" will actually do something.   This isn't a beach state, but most want a car for a different environment.   Michigan isn't Miami, Cali, etc.
« Last Edit: September 04, 2009, 04:27:19 PM by Masherbrum »
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Offline CAP1

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Re: What to get: 2006 Z06 or 2006 911 S?
« Reply #261 on: September 04, 2009, 04:32:07 PM »
Reason why the F-350 is the best?   Dana 60 front + 10.25" Sterling in the rear = Simplicity and true "Heavy-Duty".   Yes, aside from the ball joints, you have no issues other than maintaining the fluid in the Diff.  

Dodge Ram "solid front axles" are weaker than a Dana 44 (which is mid-duty, but a reliable axle).  

Understand I am looking at this from my perspective of someone with quite a bit of Four Wheeling experience throughout the Great Lakes region.   I took my 96 F-150 to Moab and didn't get to crazy, but scraped the frame at times.   I don't buy "Mallcrawlers".    I don't tow my Grand Cherokee with a 3.5" lift and 31" tires to events.   When I had my 83 CJ-7 with a 304, 4.27 gearing, Detroit Locked f/r, 33" BFG muds, I drove it 250 miles to the event.   Nothing better than a 304 at around 2500rpm @ 60mph with the true dual exhaust I had on it.    If I break on the trail, I fix it and drive it 250 miles home. 

Personally, if you're buying a truck and find yourself "lowering it" or "adding 20's", buy a car.   I laugh at "20" laden "trucks" spin out on the freeway because the dolts think that a "street tire in 4wd Hi" will actually do something.   This isn't a beach state, but most want a car for a different environment.   Michigan isn't Miami, Cali, etc.

shop i used to work at.......kid brought us his jeep cj(that's what the wrangler used to be called, right?) and a 340, with a 4 speed.
 we advised him against it(he was way young) but he had us install it anyway. we test drove it......many many times. it was fun. it would lift the left front wheel. we warned the kid.
 he had it for 3 days, then came back asking if he could put it out front for sale. he scared the poop outta himself in it.  :rofl

 my dakota's no trailer queen.....nor is it modified...with the excption of a decent sounding muffler. not even duals for now.
 i just like the looks, the growl, and the 5 speed. i can fit 3 disassembled r/c models in the bed too.
 i do tend to beat on it like i did my mustang....it's just not as fast, and is different as there's not many of the older dakotas around here.
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Offline BigPlay

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Re: What to get: 2006 Z06 or 2006 911 S?
« Reply #262 on: September 04, 2009, 04:48:15 PM »
aahh......i actually thought the 3 would've been higher perf..........still cheaper priced car outperforming higher priced car.  :D



own the Vette and drive it everyday for 5 years and then the true difference  between the two will come into play as will the difference in price. 70K is alot to spend on a car that has a  200,000 mile shelf life. Now maybe, maybe not the engine will still be fine but the surrounding components wont .Try as you might the MADE IN THE USA means nothing in today's world with exception of military hardware. Longevity isn't a US automakers desire if it were then all would be outta business by now. I still think that the longer you own a Porsche vs a Corvette the more the cost difference gap will close. Long term resale alone is worth the difference in price . That's my opinion

Offline Skuzzy

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Re: What to get: 2006 Z06 or 2006 911 S?
« Reply #263 on: September 04, 2009, 05:08:23 PM »
That is just way wrong.  I have too many friends who own both Porsche and Corvette and the one thing they will all agree on is the long term cost of ownership is significantly higher for the Porsche.

You do not have to believe anyone on this.  Call the Porsche dealer and ask what a brake job costs.  Then call a GM dealer and ask what it costs for a Corvette.  Both have to be done at pretty much the same intervals.  Except the ceramic rotors have to be replaced more often than the cast iron rotors.  Ask about those too.

That is just normal wear and tear maintenance.
« Last Edit: September 04, 2009, 05:10:07 PM by Skuzzy »
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Offline BigPlay

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Re: What to get: 2006 Z06 or 2006 911 S?
« Reply #264 on: September 04, 2009, 05:14:42 PM »
Ladies and Gentlemen, I present to you, the "Chewer of all things European!"TM

(Image removed from quote.)


No where near the history in racing at least real racing. LeMans is where Porsche poured out it's resources in the 70's, 80's and 90's and have won  LeMans some 15 times from 1970 to present day, nobody is even close. Heck they won it 7 straight years. Chevy has no winners in the big boy class. I believe Ford won it 5 or 6 times in a row with the GT 40. Chevy set out to purposely beat the likes of Ferrari and Porsche regarding performance. I'm sure that if either wanted to focus on surpassing the Corvettes performance envelope they could. How many people can or would drive any of those cars on streets and hwys to their full performance potential? So that much performance from any of the contenders is pointless.

Offline CAP1

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Re: What to get: 2006 Z06 or 2006 911 S?
« Reply #265 on: September 04, 2009, 05:27:02 PM »
own the Vette and drive it everyday for 5 years and then the true difference  between the two will come into play as will the difference in price. 70K is alot to spend on a car that has a  200,000 mile shelf life. Now maybe, maybe not the engine will still be fine but the surrounding components wont .Try as you might the MADE IN THE USA means nothing in today's world with exception of military hardware. Longevity isn't a US automakers desire if it were then all would be outta business by now. I still think that the longer you own a Porsche vs a Corvette the more the cost difference gap will close. Long term resale alone is worth the difference in price . That's my opinion

actually, you're pretty wrong dude. you're falling into the "hype" of american cars being poop. they're not. they had a REALLY bad stint in the 70's, and some into the 80's......but the 90's were the beginning of the comback for american quality.
 buick's, oldsmobiles, fords, chevies, and even some dodges. ALL will easily last over 150k miles with no serious maintenance issues. ESPECAILLY the v-8 fords and chevies.
 my 74 c-10 pickup with a 350. had in the 280k range when i bought it. had just over 300k when i sold it 7 years ago. the dude that bought it, just drove by the shop the other day, realized i had bought this place.....and stopped in. his dad drives it now. it STILL has the original engine in it.

 got customers with 5.0L mustangs, well over 120k miles. a friends 96 vette......just hit 150k.

 seeing as poesche is the same company as volkswagen(i think) i'll remind ya of the constant 40k mile water pumps i replace here. no reason or excuse for a water pump to go bad that early.

 every porsche i've been in has "flexi" seats. they're not comfortable. the corvettes seats "hug" ya when ya get in, and you sink nice and comfortably into em.

as for the surrounding components? i've seen no problems long term in corvettes. none. the rtransmissions seem bulletproof. the rears too. and we all know the smallblock chevie..........it's take a nuclear explosion to kill one.
 the porsche air coold engines.......not so much. the porsche water cooled engines? i've been reading a lot about head gasket problems....which according to what i read, requires engine replacement.

 on non-hotrod.....my caravan......168k miles.....runing strong and quiet. my dodge dakota has 111k.....running strong. my 85 e350 has 143k on it. runs strong.
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Offline CAP1

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Re: What to get: 2006 Z06 or 2006 911 S?
« Reply #266 on: September 04, 2009, 05:32:34 PM »

No where near the history in racing at least real racing. LeMans is where Porsche poured out it's resources in the 70's, 80's and 90's and have won  LeMans some 15 times from 1970 to present day, nobody is even close. Heck they won it 7 straight years. Chevy has no winners in the big boy class. I believe Ford won it 5 or 6 times in a row with the GT 40. Chevy set out to purposely beat the likes of Ferrari and Porsche regarding performance. I'm sure that if either wanted to focus on surpassing the Corvettes performance envelope they could. How many people can or would drive any of those cars on streets and hwys to their full performance potential? So that much performance from any of the contenders is pointless.

dude!!

the corvette's been running road courses since 1956!! c'mon dude.....it's the reason ford jumped onboard with shelby for the cobra......they needed/wanted something to compete with the vette, seeing as the thunderbird couldn't.
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Offline CAP1

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Re: What to get: 2006 Z06 or 2006 911 S?
« Reply #267 on: September 04, 2009, 05:33:57 PM »

I believe Ford won it 5 or 6 times in a row with the GT 40.

and this car is the 60's version of the "chewer of all things euro"
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Offline BigPlay

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Re: What to get: 2006 Z06 or 2006 911 S?
« Reply #268 on: September 04, 2009, 05:54:01 PM »
That is just way wrong.  I have too many friends who own both Porsche and Corvette and the one thing they will all agree on is the long term cost of ownership is significantly higher for the Porsche.

You do not have to believe anyone on this.  Call the Porsche dealer and ask what a brake job costs.  Then call a GM dealer and ask what it costs for a Corvette.  Both have to be done at pretty much the same intervals.  Except the ceramic rotors have to be replaced more often than the cast iron rotors.  Ask about those too.

That is just normal wear and tear maintenance.

True but nobody denies that all German and Italian cars are expensive to work on. I owned a  VW 2 liter bus about 10 years ago just for my surf mobile. The starter went out and I bought a new one to replace it, $200 IS WHAT IT COST !!! That was just for the starter, it was a true pain to get it in. I owned a 914/6 that was a very reliable car with very little maintenance needed.

Here is a brief explaination on advantages and disavantages of the ceramic rotors :

Benefits:

There are several benefits to PCCB.  Primarily, this system is said to brake more consistently and remain more resistant to fade than the standard brakes when used for repetitive hard stops, like those called for during track events.

Another major benefit is the fact that the PCCB rotors weigh approximately half as much as conventional cast iron rotors of the same size, significantly reducing the unsprung weight of each wheel which should improve a cars ability to maintain grip over rough pavement.  The rotors are also said to be much more resistant to wear and are expected to last much longer than cast iron rotors (see drawbacks for more on this).

PCCB has been observed to create less brake dust than conventional brakes.
 

Drawbacks:

Price...!  At $8,150, this is the most expensive option available and increases the cost of a Cayman / Cayman S by 16% / 13.5% respectively.  

Because the standard brakes are very good, most experts will tell you that you will only truly benefit from PCCB on a race track.  However, there have been reports of Porsche denying warranty claims pertaining to premature PCCB rotor wear on cars that have been tracked.  There are also reports of rotor destruction in as little as one or two track events.  

Replacement rotors can cost $5,000 - $6,000 per wheel......!  That means that when your rotors do need replacement, as all rotors will, you may be looking at a very costly brake job or forced to convert back to cast iron rotors.  Ceramic rotors are also more fragile and there is a chance of chipping one when changing wheels, which would require replacement.


Offline BigPlay

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Re: What to get: 2006 Z06 or 2006 911 S?
« Reply #269 on: September 04, 2009, 06:02:30 PM »
actually, you're pretty wrong dude. you're falling into the "hype" of american cars being poop. they're not. they had a REALLY bad stint in the 70's, and some into the 80's......but the 90's were the beginning of the comback for american quality.
 buick's, oldsmobiles, fords, chevies, and even some dodges. ALL will easily last over 150k miles with no serious maintenance issues. ESPECAILLY the v-8 fords and chevies.
 my 74 c-10 pickup with a 350. had in the 280k range when i bought it. had just over 300k when i sold it 7 years ago. the dude that bought it, just drove by the shop the other day, realized i had bought this place.....and stopped in. his dad drives it now. it STILL has the original engine in it.

 got customers with 5.0L mustangs, well over 120k miles. a friends 96 vette......just hit 150k.

 seeing as poesche is the same company as volkswagen(i think) i'll remind ya of the constant 40k mile water pumps i replace here. no reason or excuse for a water pump to go bad that early.

 every porsche i've been in has "flexi" seats. they're not comfortable. the corvettes seats "hug" ya when ya get in, and you sink nice and comfortably into em.

as for the surrounding components? i've seen no problems long term in corvettes. none. the rtransmissions seem bulletproof. the rears too. and we all know the smallblock chevie..........it's take a nuclear explosion to kill one.
 the porsche air coold engines.......not so much. the porsche water cooled engines? i've been reading a lot about head gasket problems....which according to what i read, requires engine replacement.

 on non-hotrod.....my caravan......168k miles.....runing strong and quiet. my dodge dakota has 111k.....running strong. my 85 e350 has 143k on it. runs strong.

actually read consumer product reports and most car mags they don't exactly agree with you. I also have had many US made trucks and I have never owned one past 200k. They started becomming maintance hogs after that. US cars have come along way since the 70's which were an all time low for US autos but no amount of convincing on your part will change my mind on that. I warned my daughter not to buy american and she was very sorry she did . She finally bought Japanese .