Ack at City

[OOZ662]

Well, there ya go. I ignore Strip and I missed ded.

[Lusche]

my 2 eurocents:

Yes, you can be hit and killed by friendly puffy ack. Happened to most of us.

But it's still not as dangerous to you as to the enemy, because the ack doesn't aim at you. Currently, being hit by friendly ack is still a kind of freak accident.
Until now I was fine with that. But what I do now see it indeed as a problem:  When we are fighting 30+k over the new strat targets (thats 2-3x higher than most top level action over CVs), the ack as still an uncanny ability to identify targets at that extreme ranges. One sortie I was trying to drag away the enemy escorts from their bombers. When entering the ack zone; I suddenly saw puffs all around them, while myself being totally safe from it because I was 1.5k in front of them.

[OOZ662]

The problem I see is that the solution is worse. The city uses the same code as the guns of every type at any other field, with the puffy having a hard deck. So, without another gunnery system, puffy ack would have to shoot at everyone everywhere. O lawdy.

With instating a new gunnery system just for the cities, the result would be a cloud of AAA over the entire area...great for history, bad for playability and framerate.

[dedalos]

my 2 eurocents:

Yes, you can be hit and killed by friendly puffy ack. Happened to most of us.

But it's still not as dangerous to you as to the enemy, because the ack doesn't aim at you. Currently, being hit by friendly ack is still a kind of freak accident.
Until now I was fine with that. But what I do now see it indeed as a problem:  When we are fighting 30+k over the new strat targets (thats 2-3x higher than most top level action over CVs), the ack as still an uncanny ability to identify targets at that extreme ranges. One sortie I was trying to drag away the enemy escorts from their bombers. When entering the ack zone; I suddenly saw puffs all around them, while myself being totally safe from it because I was 1.5k in front of them.

I thought it fires randomly in a box around the bad guy.  If you are in the box, you have the same probability to get hit as he does. 

The probability increases to 100% if you are in a 262 

[OOZ662]

I thought it fires randomly in a box around the bad guy.  If you are in the box, you have the same probability to get hit as he does.

That's correct. His point being that you can just leave that box and the gunners never make mistakes, as a real ack box wouldn't be able to tell friend from foe at high altitude.

[SunBat]

OOZ, the solution is to take it out all together. Stop thinking and just listen to me.

[Strip]

The way flak is modeled it will never truly act like the real thing......

[BnZs]

Gup, is almost exactly what I *just said*. Enemy as well as friendly fighters had to amscray from the flak. But, *in the game* even though you can occasionally be killed if you are on an enemy a/c when a flak burst goes off near it, it is a rare thing. Effectively you can attack enemy fighter over your own puffy while they have to dodge you AND puffy with little risk. We're not going to turn off the puffy completely over cities I don't think, so just having it target the buffs (which after all, are the primary targets) is the best of imperfect compromises I think.

Historically accurate?  LOL  Generally both sides fighters got out of the way at the targets because of the flak.  The bombers had to go through it, the fighters didn't.

That this is happening over a city in AH would seem to me more historically accurate.  Fighters were there to do the job before the bombers got to the target and to nail the remnants on the way home.  

Feel free to argue to have the flak toned down, but leave the history out of it

[OOZ662]

Stop thinking and just listen to me.

Not worth it.

Personally, I don't want to see it go away.

[Spikes]

Squad night will be a lot more interesting. 

Thndr, your night is Saturday right?

[Simba]

"Historically accurate?  LOL  Generally both sides fighters got out of the way at the targets because of the flak.  The bombers had to go through it, the fighters didn't.

That this is happening over a city in AH would seem to me more historically accurate.  Fighters were there to do the job before the bombers got to the target and to nail the remnants on the way home."

Spot-on. If you're a fighter defending a strat target against enemy bombers and you follow them into the flak barrage and go BOOOOM, tough. That nicely-timed attack-the-bomber-just-as-he's-about-to-drop tactic may cost you dear now. Attack bombers on the way in to the IP or after they clear the target area.

 

[FiLtH]

  I cant remember the last time friendly puffy hurt me. Tonight I think Ill spend time defending the city and see if it does.

  Again I love to SEE the ack, I just want to see it so any plane that enters the flak belt when enemies are present be at the same risk. Have the defending fighters attack before the flak area, then break off, and the ack starts firing. Thats how I always thought it happened in ww2.

[dedalos]

 I cant remember the last time friendly puffy hurt me. Tonight I think Ill spend time defending the city and see if it does.

  Again I love to SEE the ack, I just want to see it so any plane that enters the flak belt when enemies are present be at the same risk. Have the defending fighters attack before the flak area, then break off, and the ack starts firing. Thats how I always thought it happened in ww2.

Be man!!! Do it in a 262

[kvuo75]

 I respectfully submit, why not take the puffy ack out of the game altogether?  

I agree.. make the guns mannable, if they must exist at all.. 

[BnZs]

Ahem...
How many times must the point be made that puffy ack is NOT very deadly to fighters from the same country? Or to enemy buffs for that matter.

"Historically accurate?  LOL  Generally both sides fighters got out of the way at the targets because of the flak.  The bombers had to go through it, the fighters didn't.

That this is happening over a city in AH would seem to me more historically accurate.  Fighters were there to do the job before the bombers got to the target and to nail the remnants on the way home."

Spot-on. If you're a fighter defending a strat target against enemy bombers and you follow them into the flak barrage and go BOOOOM, tough. That nicely-timed attack-the-bomber-just-as-he's-about-to-drop tactic may cost you dear now. Attack bombers on the way in to the IP or after they clear the target area.