A question for the GVers

[humble]

I've never really gotten into the GVing aspect because I feel its to undeveloped and has a tremendous number of exploitable inconsistencies. That being said a few folks have put out excellent primers. Here is a short clip that highlights one of my "issues". I hopped in a tank to help defend one of our TT bases. The fight had been going back and forth and we'd been on offense and defense. I came back after a break and we we're penned in. I was taking fire coming out of the hanger and zig zagged out to one of the defensive positions and knocked out an attacker while others were doing the same. I spent about 20-30 seconds scoping out the tree lines in preparation for pushing forward a bit. All of a sudden a shot comes arching over the trees and bounces of my turret? I zoom in and cant see a thing. A second shot comes in and then a third. Clearly arching over the trees from long range....so I roll the film. Turns out that the guy who kills me is sitting on his base tucked behind the fuel tanks. Now I can't even see there base under any view...at best you'll see the top of the radar tower or a hanger as you approach...yet he can see and range me well enough to hit me hull down at that range?
http://www.az-dsl.com/snaphook/longe range tank.ahf   

[Belial]

Ok for some reason I can't open the video but I'm guessing he was shooting from 6 or 7k which is possible.  The part of this that amazing to me is he could find an open path between two fields with no tree cover, but this is also possible.  As far as the arching rounds, the panzers round has a nice lob to it at long distances.


To accomplish that kind of shot try hitting the F8 key...after hitting F8 use your Up Down arrows keys to move your sights...you can also move your sights with 8 and 2 on your number keypad.  When used together you should be able to stay zoomed in all the way but still have visual on far away targets with the sights still displayed.  Now once you have your sights setup for far away targets place your cursor on the 3200 mark for your first shot.

line up the 3200 mark with the enemy tank, you will most likely fall short, so the next step is to put your sights back in that exact position again, except place your cursor where your round actually hit.  You now can repeat until your have a pinpoint bead on the enemy tank.  This only works if you have someone that is willing to trade shots with you OR if they don't know whats happening and sit still.

Moral of this story is if you don't know where the round is coming from....MOVE a sitting target is much easier to hit.

I hope this helps, and hopefully you will be able to start sniping people as well in the future.

[humble]

I've got no issue with the range per se, its the line of sight. I've gotten kills at 6k or more (very rare for me) but can hit guys at 5k+ from time to time even with the normal site settings.

[Belial]

What you see and what he sees are generally completely different, just have to take it in stride.

[Hoffman]

^  What they said... but also remember, when you're looking around in your main gun sights you're looking from a very small part of the tank... the rest of your tank is still visible and hittable even if you don't have los.  It could be that he merely only saw part of your tank and knew you were in one of the fighting positions, and thus was able to howitzer the rounds in.  6 or 7 Km means that the round is going to be coming in almost directly on top of your tank and therefore hitting the weakest armor and having the easiest penetration.

I've managed to get it to where I've been able to barely hit the front armor of a sherman from 1-2Km, but because he was behind a tree he couldn't see or hit me, it took alot of ordnance because of the off-angle, but I was able to kill him.

And for the most part, I've found the fighting positions scattered around the VBases to be really poor positions to use.  For one thing, there's 0 concealment and barely effective cover, you're better off scampering into the woods and playing hide 'n go seek.
And everyone is always looking there.  The secret to being a successful GV'er is not to be seen.  If you are seen you can be hit, if you are hit you can be killed.  The trick isn't so much as having a position with absolute command of the ground, and gunning down everything in sight while you laugh at your position soaking up all the incomming rounds instead of your armor... that only happens in the movies.
Treat your tank like a sniper.  Find a position, find a target, learn to use your stadia lines properly and 1-3 shots for a kill and then get out of there and find a new position.


Or if you want a real fun challenge, up an M8 with AP rounds and just speed around knocking out the turrets of every tank you see that's trying to sneak their way onto your base.

That's a good way to practice your gunnery, and nobody really expects to see an M8 doing a drive-by of their hiding spot.
But that's only really doable in an M8 where you have enough speed to outrun the turret traverse of a parked tank.

[Spikes]

Normally I could double click the guy's name and it'd show me his view...is this not same with GV's?  I agree the patch of trees was pretty huge, no open space really.

[stroker71]

The guy that got the kill was 4.7k away..long shot but not that long in AH.  He was also in an M4 which has the super duper greens camo...very hard to see.  Welcome to the gamey world of gving!

DuHasst

[Lusche]

The guy that got the kill was 4.7k away..long shot but not that long in AH. 

Have you checked his line of sight?

[stroker71]

No I didn't really look that deep into it.  I guess I was looking at the OP's question.  Didn't get into the cheating aspect...should I?  Is that what this is really about?  Is this papy guy cheating? 

[Lusche]

Didn't get into the cheating aspect...should I?

No, you should not.

But the problem what the OP is facing when he analyzed the situation gets clear when you actually examine the film. It's not only the distance (that is indeed doable) but that the LOS is completely blocked by not a few trees but many patches of woods and other objects. While there are many ways someone can see another tank while the enemy can't see him, none of them is applicable here.

But that does NOT imply any kind of "cheating". People are way too quick with the C word anyway.

Howver, the film is more a topic for the bugs than the training forum.

[humble]

I'm in no way accusing anyone of cheating. I was simply confronted with something beyond my capabilities and am curious. I completely understand the realities of relative view. I've had circumstances where literally the only I could see was the turret MG but the other guy could see and kill me. Other times I've popped a tread or tail where his turret was obscured or been wher he could fire under a tree but my incoming rounds would hit the tree canopy. Here is a circumstance where I need to use the map to orient on the enemy V base when rolling from ours but he could obviously see me clearly enough to hit me. This is on relatively flat ground with multiple terrain features and I'm curious how this type of sighting is done. I may load the terrain up offline so I can examine it further but from playing on it online I do know that I was unable to view the enemy base at ground level (any part) from that range. Now it might very well be that topography allows a view from one very specific spot...but if he can see me I should be able to see him thru the trees & hills as well.

To me this is no different then an ACM question for planes. I've got no reason to assume this is anything other then a lack of knowledge on my part....so I'm looking to address that lack.

[Belial]

Theres nothing you can do but chalk it up as a glitch, it happens to all of us.

[JunkyII]

I remembered when I first started playing some people could change their graphic settings to see tanks that were behind stuff. I dont do it but I have horrible graphics and have shot at a tank that looked like nothing was in my way only to be hitting an "invisble" house. GVing is very gamey but in this case I would almost consider some type of glitch in his graphics that wasnt showing those trees I mean he either already had that spot ranged from there somehow or he couldnt see the trees in front of him


 

[RSLQK186]

I'd say he couldn't see the trees. The film viewer depends on the game settings for its grafic settings and I can adjust mine so that I can see the M4 and fuel tanks through the Panzer's gun.
I can't get the right angle from the M4 to do the reverse. I doesn't help that it displays the turrent 180Deg away from where it is aimed.
And I can't duplicate offline. I think it may be because I have no one else in my game, so it draws trees instead.
Can duplicat online and filmed it. Went to the edge of an enemy V base and lobed shells at things. Changed my settings back and viewed film. Trees blocked my view of some of what I saw before.
I guess this is as gamey as turning down the sound of your own engine so you can hear a plane 3K behind you. Not realistic, but effective and open to all.
The alteritives would be for HTC to drop the accounts of anyone that has a low end system and force a higher grafics standard. Or make it so that high end systems can't pork there own settings?
Think I'll keep my setting to where I can pick out GVs from the air AND see the trees I have to avoid while killing them. That's the way I prefer to handle armor
 

[stran]

i agree with that guy ^^

He couldn't see the trees. if the trees were invisible then he would have had a clean spot on you to lob his rounds.

and to reiterate what rslqk186 said, the m4 in the vid isn't facing where he was truely looking so he wasn't "tucked behind the fuel tanks" he was actually in front of them.