Rudder Trim and Turns

[TequilaChaser]

I will quote it one more time, for those who might have READ TOO FAST thru his answer 

I concur , on what mtnman and WMLute have posted.......

I want to add that trimming to Max trim setting will also increase a players "bouncy nose" syndrome worse than a player who uses Combat Trim all the time.....which also causes bouncy/bouncing nose tendency's.....

hope this helps  ~S~

Yes it does help.

also notice he typed that he used to use........wait I'll hi lite it for ya'll 

I used to use max pitch up trim with full flaps on the La5/7 with WEP to pull inside of poor spit pilots for a guns solution. Platano taught me to use it with the K4 in turns with flaps and WEP or for an instantanious nose pitched up manuver. I've since found these tricks work on poor pilots about as well as just applying proper tactics with combat trim on for the aircraft I'm flying without having to remember all the buttons or wheels I've mapped for trim during a fight.

anyhows.... his reply of Yes it does help, I took as he thought my post or our posts helped him.........

not exactly sure how the rest of you are viewing or interpreting his response.......

again ... hope this helps 

[mtnman]

anyhows.... his reply of Yes it does help, I took as he thought my post or our posts helped him.........

not exactly sure how the rest of you are viewing or interpreting his response.......

again ... hope this helps 

Where you took it as "Yes it (the information) does help".  I think the rest of us are taking it as "Yes it (trimming to max deflection) does help".  I think it could be taken either way, even though he uses the past tense.

I also based that on his original post, which to me looks like the apparent effect of max trim deflection is a foregone conclusion, and he's just looking to add to that by trying it with rudder too...

I've used full up pitch trim to enhance manuvering. How usefull is full rudder trim?

I guess his statement could be taken either way...  Kind of like when my wife asks "Would you like spaghetti or lasagna for supper tonight?" and I respond with "Yes, I would!"

[bustr]

January is such a slow AH period. Kinda like slow News cycles.

When I was using a Siatek X52 Pro, trim helped, but was a lot of gymnastics with dial pots on the throttel and buttons in the heat of combat. Since I've had a CH Fighter stick for about 6 months now I havent needed to touch trim other than pulling a K4 nose up while compressed in a dive. It could be me or the CH potentiometers are superior to saitek's but, I seem to get more deflection when I push x or y with the CH stick than with my X52 stick. I've found the CH stick has contributed to improving my execution of manuvering.

I asked the question about trim because I didn't want to mention any names while getting feed back. I was curious if rudder trim was the magic bullet my freind recently decided it was. I would rather take the heat for you guys thinking me a fool than upset my freind by using his name in public. He is very happy with using rudder trim and believes it's improving his manuverabilty. State of mind is a valuble ACM tool.

Is it possible that the X52 stick does not produce the same results as the CH stick and the use of manual trim with the saitek stick duplicates the same deflection as the CH stick? Admittedly all the years I used Saitek products I programed the buttons with the SST software rather than through the game's interface. Is it possible the SST active interface was affecting the stick travel the game was seeing? My CH fighterstick is mapped through the game, not the CH key mapping interface.

I had not thought to question useing the SST software until seeing the results of not having it running and using another brand of equipment. I've used Siatek controls and the software in the game since 2002. Does the Saitek active key mapping software have a negative effect on the quality of your control inputs in Aces High?

[Ack-Ack]

January is such a slow AH period. Kinda like slow News cycles.

When I was using a Siatek X52 Pro, trim helped, but was a lot of gymnastics with dial pots on the throttel and buttons in the heat of combat. Since I've had a CH Fighter stick for about 6 months now I havent needed to touch trim other than pulling a K4 nose up while compressed in a dive. It could be me or the CH potentiometers are superior to saitek's but, I seem to get more deflection when I push x or y with the CH stick than with my X52 stick. I've found the CH stick has contributed to improving my execution of manuvering.

I asked the question about trim because I didn't want to mention any names while getting feed back. I was curious if rudder trim was the magic bullet my freind recently decided it was. I would rather take the heat for you guys thinking me a fool than upset my freind by using his name in public. He is very happy with using rudder trim and believes it's improving his manuverabilty. State of mind is a valuble ACM tool.

Is it possible that the X52 stick does not produce the same results as the CH stick and the use of manual trim with the saitek stick duplicates the same deflection as the CH stick? Admittedly all the years I used Saitek products I programed the buttons with the SST software rather than through the game's interface. Is it possible the SST active interface was affecting the stick travel the game was seeing? My CH fighterstick is mapped through the game, not the CH key mapping interface.

I had not thought to question useing the SST software until seeing the results of not having it running and using another brand of equipment. I've used Siatek controls and the software in the game since 2002. Does the Saitek active key mapping software have a negative effect on the quality of your control inputs in Aces High?

The reason why you've noticed a difference between the sticks is that the CH stick is more precise in its movements as opposed to the Saitek stick but usually the level of precision isn't really noticable unless one is using a very basic generic joystick compared to someone using a CH stick.

ack-ack

[bustr]

Perception with hardware can be relative and subjective due to many things from the manufacturing quality of the stick\components, the connection interface processing and the PC board's USB signal processing. Once I started using the CH products my skill level improved overnight. I found no need to use trim inputs as an augment from then on. My freind is using an X52. Manual rudder trim in his opinion is improving his manuverability.

My line of questioning was an attempt to understand the phenominon. It must be January and a slow economy, this thread got a bit strange. Most threads these days seem to devolve into a spanish inquisition while the responders compete with each other to show the OP has an I.Q. lower than a turnip without triggering the Skuzzy responce.

Here's wishing yall's a good 2010. Some of you gents sound like you need a bit more positive happening in your real lives than in 2009.....

[WMLute]

G'Mornin Lute,
so how many cups of coffee did you already have by 6:20 AM this monin?  

yeah, yeah, ok...

I was a bit grouchy, just woke up,  and was w/o coffee.

I took that post like mtnman did.

It does raise an interesting point on the diff. that your hardware might make.  I can only comment on M.S. joysticks, as that is all I have used since the mid 90's.

[Sonicblu]

I swallowed this plecibo pill early on.

Couple of additional points to think about.

1. Even if it works, it gets you to think one dimentionally about your ACM. ILL just out turn ( our rudder ) Your friend will not improve his acm to what I believe is possible.

2. Did I have another point cant remember will post later if i think about it lol.

[BillyD]

Only thing I;ve found useful with CT is shutting it on and off to combat some quirks of certain aircraft. In the 109 K4 or G14 if I am forced to go slow against torque ( i shouldn't have gotten there anyway) CT off tends to help with roll stability at the cost of maximum speed/accel.... Need to go fast CT on....compression recovery works good too. I've heard of guys who program an "elevator slam" to their K4s as a quick nose up evasive too...havent tried it.....

in a typhoon/tempy I've found in a maximum BNZ dive CT off will stop the nose from pointing skyward at just the time you wanna shoot some fool.

in a 110G if you trim elevators all the way w/ CT off the aircraft tends to uh...boat float ( try it, it's silly) not much tactical use except for a quick nose up shot that you'll prolly miss anyway

I know there are some good sticks that swear by this " K key smashing" so the legend will live on despite the academic proof against it.

[JunkyII]

If you choose not to listen to 3 AcesHigh Trainers \

easy there thunder cat only 2 trainers.....and you




Trim does not help in a fight...for only 1 reason... too much eaxtra stuff to worry about.

When Im fighting someone Im not worrried about my aircraft...I know how to fly it...Im worried about his...or hers

The main thing in a fight is to know where your opponents nose is and how much E your enemy has, if your good at knowing that stuff, the rest of it is just a cake walk....unitl you get an opponent which is hoping you fall for a set up

[morfiend]

easy there thunder cat only 2 trainers.....and you ;

 which 1 of these guys isn't a trainer,TC,Mtnman and Murdr,as they've all posted which would make Lute correct.

[CAP1]

 which 1 of these guys isn't a trainer,TC,Mtnman and Murdr,as they've all posted which would make Lute correct.

eeeeasy there snappie!!










how's you sir? 

[JunkyII]

 which 1 of these guys isn't a trainer,TC,Mtnman and Murdr,as they've all posted which would make Lute correct.

Carefully look at the posting order, bustr posted before Murdr did  No disrespect to the trainers here at all, just keeping Lute on his toes