Mossquito Mk. XI

[Baumer]

yeh but inside the mossi doesnt have the right control coloum. The mossi's Control coloum was similar to the P38's I believe.
But that hardly constitute's a Frankinstien Monster.   

It has the correct stick, you are thinking about a different model of the Mosquito than the Mk VI that we have.

[Scherf]

yeh but inside the mossi doesnt have the right control coloum. The mossi's Control coloum was similar to the P38's I believe.
But that hardly constitute's a Frankinstien Monster.    

Heheheh, no, the AH FB.VI has the right control stick - the spectacle handles were in the unarmed variants.

bah, late

Bozon's account sounds like Bob Braham, though he had to ditch in view of an RN vessel.

[BulletVI]

Ah cool i thought every mark had the same coloum my bad cheer's for the update  

[SmokinLoon]

357mph is not slower than 338mph.

What altitude are you referring to?  Referencing both AH Mossi Mk VI speed charts, Im not seeing the new Mossi faster than the old Mossi until it reaches... you tell me?  20K?  At the typical operating altitudes for the variant we have performing the role in which it performed most... it is slower.

   

[Karnak]

What altitude are you referring to?  Referencing both AH Mossi Mk VI speed charts, Im not seeing the new Mossi faster than the old Mossi until it reaches... you tell me?  20K?  At the typical operating altitudes for the variant we have performing the role in which it performed most... it is slower.

  

I was referring to sea level....  I have no idea how you concluded the old Mossie was faster down low.

The new Mosquito is faster at all altitudes as compared to the old Mosquito when on WEP.  At MIL the speeds are very similar, with the old one perhaps edging it a by 1mph at sea level, the old one faster by an odd 13mph at 5,000ft and the new one 4mph faster at 12,000ft and 1mph faster at 13,000ft.

100ft:
MIL: New: 319mph  Old: 320mph
WEP: New: 357mph Old: 338mph

5,000ft:
MIL: New: 334mph  Old: 347mph
WEP: New: 374mph  Old: 363mph

12,000ft:
MIL: New: 361mph  Old: 357mph
WEP: New: 384mph  Old: 376mph

13,000ft:
MIL: New: 363mph  Old: 362mph
WEP: New: 386mph  Old: 380mph

[Ack-Ack]

Well i did here on a tv program i think it was the Top Ten of all time Bomber's they featured the Mossi in 5 th or 6th place. And they said it could out run almost every aircraft at Zero feet till the Me 262 came along but i highly doubt it as any aircraft can gain the necessary speed to catch it from a dive from altitude.

But maybe not when its empty and on the return journey.

Eh who know's only pilot's from WW2 can confirm this one

You must really take what shows on the Military and History Channel with a grain of salt.  In one of those "Showdown" episodes, they said a P-38 had dive brakes and another show on the History Channel referred to the .50 caliber machine guns on a Mustang as 50mm cannons.  Take those shows for what they are, great pieces of entertainment but short on historical accuracy.


ack-ack

[DEECONX]

You must really take what shows on the Military and History Channel with a grain of salt.  In one of those "Showdown" episodes, they said a P-38 had dive brakes and another show on the History Channel referred to the .50 caliber machine guns on a Mustang as 50mm cannons.  Take those shows for what they are, great pieces of entertainment but short on historical accuracy.


ack-ack

What about the 38 shutting off one engine to turn with a zeke? I think I heard that in one of those too. Not sure though...

[BulletVI]

You must really take what shows on the Military and History Channel with a grain of salt.  In one of those "Showdown" episodes, they said a P-38 had dive brakes and another show on the History Channel referred to the .50 caliber machine guns on a Mustang as 50mm cannons.  Take those shows for what they are, great pieces of entertainment but short on historical accuracy.


ack-ack

I know ack-ack that's why i also said that only the pilot's that flew them can tell us overall they are the best source of information on these aircraft.  

[Ack-Ack]

What about the 38 shutting off one engine to turn with a zeke? I think I heard that in one of those too. Not sure though...

You can chalk that up to being as accurate as the P-51D having 6x 50mm cannons.

ack-ack

[DEECONX]

You can chalk that up to being as accurate as the P-51D having 6x 50mm cannons.

ack-ack

Ok 

[SmokinLoon]

I was referring to sea level....  I have no idea how you concluded the old Mossie was faster down low.

The new Mosquito is faster at all altitudes as compared to the old Mosquito when on WEP.  At MIL the speeds are very similar, with the old one perhaps edging it a by 1mph at sea level, the old one faster by an odd 13mph at 5,000ft and the new one 4mph faster at 12,000ft and 1mph faster at 13,000ft.

100ft:
MIL: New: 319mph  Old: 320mph
WEP: New: 357mph Old: 338mph

5,000ft:
MIL: New: 334mph  Old: 347mph
WEP: New: 374mph  Old: 363mph

12,000ft:
MIL: New: 361mph  Old: 357mph
WEP: New: 384mph  Old: 376mph

13,000ft:
MIL: New: 363mph  Old: 362mph
WEP: New: 386mph  Old: 380mph

I printed off a Mossi speed chart from the AH Trainers website, that still has the old Mossi stats (old Mossi weight is 2000lbs heavier as well!!!).  I then placed over top the new Mossi speed chart and I'm seeing a bit bigger of a spread than the stats you posted, my hunch was correct.  For instance;

100ft:
New: 318mph, Old: 322mph [difference of 4, yours had a difference of 1]

5000ft:
New: 335mph, Old: 348mph [a difference of 13, same for both]

10,000ft:
New:352mph, Old: 364mph [a difference of 12, yours had a difference of 4 in favor of the new Mossi???]

13,000:
New: 363mph, Old: 362mph [difference of 1, same for both]

15,000:
New: 355mph, Old: 372mph [18mph faster for old!)

At 19k, the new Mossi finally and clearly over takes the old Mossi for a higher top speed and they don't become real closely similar again until about 30k when they both move at 340mph or so.

Aside from 12k to 13k or so, and above 19k, the old Mossi was clearly faster.  Map out a chart and see for yourself.  Obviously, I'm not even debating WEP, there is no confusion on that.

[RTHolmes]

the FB VI used merlin 21 or 25, if you look at the critical alts at WEP (~6k,~12k) the new one is modelled on the merlin 25 and matches the charts at http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/mosquito/mosquito.html.

the old mossie had different critical alts at MIL so it was modelled on a different engine, I'm not sure which one, but it doesnt look like either the 21 or 25 to me (21 was higher alt iirc.) pretty sure karnak or scherf can tell us which one it was modelled on

[Scherf]

My own view is that the new one is modelled on 25s, but I' can't recall ever having seen a published MIL cruise chart for the VI with ejectors. It was tough enough finding one for WEP...

[Boozeman]

I printed off a Mossi speed chart from the AH Trainers website, that still has the old Mossi stats (old Mossi weight is 2000lbs heavier as well!!!).  I then placed over top the new Mossi speed chart and I'm seeing a bit bigger of a spread than the stats you posted, my hunch was correct.  For instance;

100ft:
New: 318mph, Old: 322mph [difference of 4, yours had a difference of 1]

5000ft:
New: 335mph, Old: 348mph [a difference of 13, same for both]

10,000ft:
New:352mph, Old: 364mph [a difference of 12, yours had a difference of 4 in favor of the new Mossi???]

13,000:
New: 363mph, Old: 362mph [difference of 1, same for both]

15,000:
New: 355mph, Old: 372mph [18mph faster for old!)

At 19k, the new Mossi finally and clearly over takes the old Mossi for a higher top speed and they don't become real closely similar again until about 30k when they both move at 340mph or so.

Aside from 12k to 13k or so, and above 19k, the old Mossi was clearly faster.  Map out a chart and see for yourself.  Obviously, I'm not even debating WEP, there is no confusion on that.

Well, the new Mossie might be a little bit slower on MIL than the old one, but is much faster on WEP. Thats all that matters.

[SmokinLoon]

Well, the new Mossie might be a little bit slower on MIL than the old one, but is much faster on WEP. Thats all that matters.

Considering that WEP last not quite 5 minutes and that a Mossi flights are much longer than 5 minutes, I'm sure many will debate that WEP is all that matters.

Dont get me wrong, I love shallow diving into the target area at 450+ mph and dropping my 2 wing bombs then extending while out running most aircraft (on WEP).  Once clear and able to gain a wee bit of altitude back, then turning back in and doing the rinse-repeat thing dropping the 2 internal bombs and getting out of there, that is what the Mossi is all about.  But 5 min of WEP is hardly enough to proclaim the Mossi is where it should be.   

All in all I like the new Mossi, I'm just having a hard time grasping the fact that it is slower at typical altitudes than the previous incarnation.