The F2B has a tail gun

[Enker]

If you turn a few circles with the F2 without realizing it or taking action you should be toast if the F2 is a good shot. However, if you catch it right away you can just make a hard turn out of it if you're on the deck. Lets say you get into a counter clockwise turn, if you make a sharp turn to the right early enough(before you go even one circle around) you shouldn't have much of a problem. If you wait after a full circle and then turn sharp right the F2(or whatever you're fighting really) will get a quick snap shot, it just depends on whether or not he can hit it. As far as the D7 getting guns on the F2, that varies with every fight, there's really no one magical move after you get out of the flat turn. One thing to remember though is that the F2, from my experiences flying it, has a terrible roll rate.

Also, the D7 flips down hill from the top of a zoom very quickly, which is very helpful if you have started with more E than the F2

[1701E]

"One thing to remember though is that the F2, from my experiences flying it, has a terrible roll rate."


That is the one downfall to the F2.  The problem is most people don't realize that if the F2 has anymore then 80mph of speed it can nose up and slightly stall it over very quickly to the direction of the new turn and thus getting back on the enemies tail.  That also works if the F2 keeps enough E and needs to out-turn a Dr1, go vertical and stall it over o get a very short window to shoot but it also allows you to gain enough E to turn with the Dr1 for a short time (F2 will win vs a Dr1 in a turn with E).

[onerka]

And....the F2B has only a single gun facing forward.  Not nearly as lethal as the two guns on every other plane facing you or on your 6.  Unless you have a very good connect (ammo), the accumulated damage of that one gun in a relatively even fight is real easy to calculate...one half.

It is hard to quickly bring the plane out of a severe turn to bring the gun to bear on a con.   

But, all things said, it is fun to fly the plane.  It can do well in a turn fight or a fur ball.  It does absorb a lot of damage.  Etc.

For that matter each of the fm's is fun to fly.

One

[mechanic]

I will never understand how someone can complain about being shot down by a fixed gun or a tail gun. You can FLY anywhere you like......but a fixed gun is a threat?

It's called 'combat' because the idea is to take out the enemy. By what ever means available. That tail gun is available so you better not get in the gunsite.
Never did anyone say; "You know what Hans, flying in a huge circus and bouncing lone recon planes is a bit unfair, Ya? Lets fly alone and only engage when it is a fair fight."

Another point, if I may. A two seater caught alone by enemy fighters in WWI would have run for it's life. This may not always be true with a plane as good as the bristol, but in general a two seater would have run home spraying it's tail gun all the way. WWI air combat was a game of cat and mouse, not gladiator and gladiator, for the most part.

Final point. If the guy flying a bristol thinks the tail gun and flying level is the best move the F2 can do, you're lucky. Because with someone like 1701E on your tail you would be wish they were using the tail gun and running.

[Mano]

Several months ago.........probably more like six months ago.........that evil Meandog was killing everyone...
the nerve of that guy. So I sat on the runway and asked everyone in my country if they wanted to
do a sortie in the F2b. Before long there were six of us rolling in F2b's. Once all of us were up we circled around the
field until we could form up into a lose formation.

I would have liked to have seen Meandog's face when the icons came
into view and all of 'em were F2b's. We were not successful at bringing him down, but we had allot of fun in the process
and shot down allot of the other pilots.

The F2b can be force to deal with when the pilots flying them are organized and allot of fun. I have noticed that the front
gun seems more like a pea shooter than a machine gun. It might be my connection, but I rarely have rubber bullets when I fly
one of the planes with duel vickers or spandaus.

<S>
Mano

 

[meandog]

lol mano...the whole time i was reading this post i was thinking of that very moment. Yeah...the look on my face  was priceless!! Great fun

[F6Fraven]

To answer mechanic's question, you're right, I can fly anywhere I want but the rear gunner on an F2B is still a huge threat. The F2 can shoot head on, from its tail, straight up, left, right, pretty much anywhere except down. The F2 is also faster than any other plane in there so even if you run it can still catch up and get a shot. If you try to turn away from an F2 going the opposite direction it has a shot and you don't. I can fully understand using the rear gunner when you're in a furball, I find that perfectly acceptable.
 But my question to you mechanic is: lets say you're flying in a D7. You get into a turn fight with a good dogfighting pilot in an F2B. You're having a tough fight because the F2 actually out turns your D7 easily but you're flying good angles so you can make up for it. Then after about 5 mins. of on the deck stall fighting the F2 makes a slight mistake in geometry and you get the shot. Right before you can get the F2 down though he switches over to the the rear gun and kills you. Does that sound fair that the F2 pilot who makes a huge mistake actually beats the guy who flies a perfect fight?

[mechanic]

You didnt fly a perfect flight, you got yourself into the fire ark of an aircraft that has a rear gunner. If you flew a perfect fight you would not do this. This must be taken into account when you ID your enemy as a two seater. Consider that almost every two seater flown in combat would have been equiped with crew for the gun possitions.

Fly a 'perfect fight', and they can't get you however their defence systems are setup. If that answers your question.

[F6Fraven]

Then what is a perfect fight against an F2? attacking from underneath? You can't always do that lol. If flying a perfect fight against an F2B means not allowing them a shot at all then you might as well stay in the tower. If you create an arena that were to take out the variable of people shooting differently by making each gun computer aimed/100% accurate then the only time the D7,F1 or DR1 should win in a dogfight is if they are able to attack from underneath, and a good F2 pilot should never let this happen.

[mechanic]

Right then, so untill you can get the 'perfect fight' don't expect to engage F2s without taking hits?

[onerka]

The prefect fight against an F2B is pretty simple...stay over them and drop down right into their cockpit while they are flying straight using the rear gun.  The rear gun will not point straight up.  They die very quickly.  If you miss fly away at a 95 degree angle, no one is that good a shot from the rear gun that they can often hit a plane flying away perpendicular to their line of flight.  Raven...you know it is not that hard to avoid an F2B's guns...and that, war by definition, even WWI, was never fair.

Check the plane stats.  I think you will find the greatest ratio of kills over deaths is in the DR.  Nothing wrong with that at all.  But if the F2B was so deadly...then they are being flown exclusively by Curly and Mo.  The plane stats for the F2B are not that good.

Mean I was with Mano that night...fun for all it was.  Mano and I used to do that in another sim too...called the plane "Kung Pao Raider".  If a bunch of them fly together they are deadly, but that does not happen a lot. 

One

[F6Fraven]

Well seeing that I almost never enter a fight with the energy advantage needed to get above an F2 and drop down onto them, that's sort of out of the question. The F2 is deadly though, at this time in tour 6 the F2B has a kill to death of 1.19/1 and the D7 has a K/d of .71/1. In the months before this the F2's numbers have been lower. At this time though, on paper the F2B is far more deadly than the D7, which is odd because the D7 is flown by a lot of great pilots in here. My point is though, the F2 is already a very deadly aircraft in WW1 even though it hasn't been flown to its full potential yet. If pilots flew it to its full potential I think it could easily be on par with the DR1, if not deadlier. And I couldn't disagree more with the way F2 pilots get their kills because to me a good kill is one you have to work for, one that requires expert skill, good hand-eye coordination, great angles and geometry and discipline.

[Furball]

After the disaster of its first outing, and they sorted out the tactics, the Brisfit was actually very successful in the air to air role when attacked by more nimble single seat fighters.  The top scoring British observer managed 39 kills, all in the F2B.  Later versions had two tail guns, which made even more potent.

http://www.theaerodrome.com/aces/england/gass.php

[mechanic]

Those stats are meaningless to the topic, the % of D7 pilots compared to few F2 pilots makes a k/d ratio alone very inacurate. Try looking at the top ranked WWI players and see what they have been flying. We do understand your point but realise that you have the option to change your tactics yet would prefer to change the game instead. I think maybe you're in the wrong place for what you describe, our WWI arena currently is very much a point and shoot 'em up. If you can find the individual fights that are worthy of your expectations that is good, but the gameplay is most likely to be fast paced and hectic in the WWI arena. Try Rise of Flight if you want a really challenging WWI flight sim, it's much less noob friendly. Cos lets face it right, this is a noob problem for you. It annoys you that someone with no cartoon flying skills can escape and then kill you without effort. That is the base fact of this situation and I tell ya, the quickest solution is to change your gameplay.
S!

Well seeing that I almost never enter a fight with the energy advantage needed to get above an F2 and drop down onto them, that's sort of out of the question. The F2 is deadly though, at this time in tour 6 the F2B has a kill to death of 1.19/1 and the D7 has a K/d of .71/1. In the months before this the F2's numbers have been lower. At this time though, on paper the F2B is far more deadly than the D7, which is odd because the D7 is flown by a lot of great pilots in here. My point is though, the F2 is already a very deadly aircraft in WW1 even though it hasn't been flown to its full potential yet. If pilots flew it to its full potential I think it could easily be on par with the DR1, if not deadlier. And I couldn't disagree more with the way F2 pilots get their kills because to me a good kill is one you have to work for, one that requires expert skill, good hand-eye coordination, great angles and geometry and discipline.

[F6Fraven]

Rgr mechanic, you bring up a few good points there.