Spit 14, a little something more

[Ardy123]

I think the spit 14 shouldn't be perked. I'd almost say, if any spit to be perked, it should be the 16.

[Perrine]

okay then, I shall change my wish too:
either leave the spit 14 as is and drop the perks, of as you sudgested, give it accurate fuel, and run it at proper boost

word

Leave as is and just drop perks

also I think our spit and 109s are evenly matched in competitiveness as of right now (see graphs for these planes)

109e - spit1
109f - spit5
109g2/109g6 - spit9
109g14 - spit8/16
109k - spit14

[Perrine]

So you have proven that a K4 has a speed advantage. I could easily rebutt with the fact that the Spit14 has a solid turn rate advantage.

iirc 109k torques to the left and spit14 torques to the right... so i think 109k can keep up with spit 14 in left turns, and spit 14 can keep up with 109k in right turns

[BrownBaron]

word

Leave as is and just drop perks

also I think our spit and 109s are evenly matched in competitiveness as of right now (see graphs for these planes)

109e - spit1
109f - spit5
109g2/109g6 - spit9
109g14 - spit8/16
109k - spit14

I beg to differ. G14≠XVI. The 16 is slower and has less WEP, but climbs better after 5K, turns tighter, has superior visibility, and superior armament (in terms of rate of fire, number of 20mm cannons, and in said weapons trajectories.).

iirc 109k torques to the left and spit14 torques to the right... so i think 109k can keep up with spit 14 in left turns, and spit 14 can keep up with 109k in right turns

The spitfires turn rate is vastly superior, and its torque is insignificant (from the perspective of a cartoon 109 pilot,at least). Provided that the spitfire does not try to turn to the right with throttle at 100% while the K4 has throttled down with flaps out, the spitfire will out turn the 109.

Compare the turn rate charts of both aircraft. The Spit XVI has a turn rate with flaps up (and I assume at full speed) that is comparable to that of the 109's with full flaps down(again here assuming at a much lower speed).

Performance charts here: http://www.gonzoville.com/ahcharts/index.php

[Ardy123]

iirc 109k torques to the left and spit14 torques to the right... so i think 109k can keep up with spit 14 in left turns, and spit 14 can keep up with 109k in right turns

Man, sometimes I wish this was true, the spit 14 can easily out turn a k4. I'm not that familiar with a spit14s stability at slow speeds, but the k4's is awful when slow, unless your very good with the throttle.

[321BAR]

Ok, quick statement here...

109K4 has a 30mm cannon with a low ammo count at 60 rounds that the majority of pilots in AH dont know how to use properly. Spit14 has 250 rounds of 20mm Hispano (if i recollect, is the most accurate 20mm in the game?) and 2 .50cals at 500 rounds, the 109k4 (has 7.7mm mgs in the wings correct?).

Spit14 has near equivalent speed and climb rate but has anyone thought of acceleration? Whenever i fly a sporkteen at 15-20k, i go from 200mph to 350 very rapidly. It also out turns a 109K4 too.

The 14 dives as well as a 109K and possibly even better (yeah, the roll rate is poor because of its elliptical wings but ive never seen this as a major problem when im diving on enemies).

Sporkteen is perk worthy. Just learn to fly it. I've started flying it lately in the MA and i haven't been opposed evenly by any aircraft at level alts. Even when against 3 P47Ms and a P51D with them 5k above with my sporkteen and 2 P51s below them, i took out 2 of the 47s and then killed a low flying F4U1D with one of my squaddies taking the 51 and the other 47 out. Not bragging, I'm using this as a point. I'm learning the plane and it seems easy to fly (maybe because i fly 51s? the 14 seems to be like a 51 sometimes).


Edit: you also need to remember that alot of noobs or fresh pilots will use the spit14 expecting it to fly as well as the 16 or better due to the perks. i have a feeling that many pilots think, its got perks, so everything about it is better than the other models. This would include turn rate, speed, ammo, climb rate, dive capability, etc.

[Karnak]

The spitfires turn rate is vastly superior, and its torque is insignificant (from the perspective of a cartoon 109 pilot,at least). Provided that the spitfire does not try to turn to the right with throttle at 100% while the K4 has throttled down with flaps out, the spitfire will out turn the 109.

You might want to fly the Spitfire Mk XIV before pontificating about it.  Claiming it has insignificant torque compared to the much less torquey Bf109K-4 invalidates your whole position.

Are you mistakenly thinking of the Spitfire Mk XVI?

[321BAR]

if you guys could read my statement. im trying to put a point in here to settle this...

[Perrine]

So you have proven that a K4 has a speed advantage. I could easily rebutt with the fact that the Spit14 has a solid turn rate advantage.

and also... if your flying in main arena why would you commit in slow, turn fight in spit 14 against 109k.
Maybe if you have lots of perk points to waste you can

[BrownBaron]

Ok, quick statement here...

109K4 has a 30mm cannon with a low ammo count at 60 rounds that the majority of pilots in AH dont know how to use properly. Spit14 has 250 rounds of 20mm Hispano (if i recollect, is the most accurate 20mm in the game?) and 2 .50cals at 500 rounds, the 109k4 (has 7.7mm mgs in the wings correct?).

Spit14 has near equivalent speed and climb rate but has anyone thought of acceleration? Whenever i fly a sporkteen at 15-20k, i go from 200mph to 350 very rapidly. It also out turns a 109K4 too.

The 14 dives as well as a 109K and possibly even better (yeah, the roll rate is poor because of its elliptical wings but ive never seen this as a major problem when im diving on enemies).

Sporkteen is perk worthy. Just learn to fly it. I've started flying it lately in the MA and i haven't been opposed evenly by any aircraft at level alts. Even when against 3 P47Ms and a P51D with them 5k above with my sporkteen and 2 P51s below them, i took out 2 of the 47s and then killed a low flying F4U1D with one of my squaddies taking the 51 and the other 47 out. Not bragging, I'm using this as a point. I'm learning the plane and it seems easy to fly (maybe because i fly 51s? the 14 seems to be like a 51 sometimes).


Edit: you also need to remember that alot of noobs or fresh pilots will use the spit14 expecting it to fly as well as the 16 or better due to the perks. i have a feeling that many pilots think, its got perks, so everything about it is better than the other models. This would include turn rate, speed, ammo, climb rate, dive capability, etc.

No, it has 13.7mm machine guns at 300rpg in the nose.

Yes, we have analyzed acceleration and compressability.

You might want to fly the Spitfire Mk XIV before pontificating about it.  Claiming it has insignificant torque compared to the much less torquey Bf109K-4 invalidates your whole position.

Are you mistakenly thinking of the Spitfire Mk XVI?

Uhm. Have you flown a 109K4? The torque has been the death of many many cartoon pilots, this I can guarantee.

[Lusche]

Edit: you also need to remember that alot of noobs or fresh pilots will use the spit14 expecting it to fly as well as the 16 or better due to the perks.

Neither numbers, nor checking the actual name list support that. The perked 14 is very rarely taken into the sky, which is absolutely the opposite what would happen if it where a preferred n00b ride.

[Perrine]

Uhm. Have you flown a 109K4? The torque has been the death of many many cartoon pilots, this I can guarantee.

I think throttle management is the key.
As for auto trims... I turn it off.  When combat ready i set aileron and elevator trims at neutral and rudder at 350mph IAS

[Karnak]

Uhm. Have you flown a 109K4? The torque has been the death of many many cartoon pilots, this I can guarantee.

Yes, I have.  It has torque.  It is, however, noticeably less torque than the Spitfire Mk XIV.  The Bf109K-4 is not the most maneuverable fighter, but it does not feel like it is actively fighting me at all times.  The Spitfire Mk XIV does.

It also lacks the horrible nose bounciness that the Spitfire Mk XIV has, an effect that completely removes the flatter Hispano trajectory from the equation.

[Imowface]

Karnak is true barron, Spit 14 has way more tourque then the K-4, and it stalls way worse because of it

[321BAR]

It also lacks the horrible nose bounciness that the Spitfire Mk XIV has, an effect that completely removes the flatter Hispano trajectory from the equation.

ive never noticed this bounce