Author Topic: FW190-A8  (Read 9580 times)

Offline save

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Re: FW190-A8
« Reply #60 on: November 10, 2010, 02:10:24 PM »
Baumer showed in another 190a8-thread  it to be overweight with the 2 gun-package, with historic documents.

Hitech told us they would look into it.

190a8 was a fighter, sometimes it carried more guns for buff interception, and sometimes in the Sturmbock version with extra armor, and 30mms.
My ammo last for 6 Lancasters, or one Yak3.
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Offline AWwrgwy

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Re: FW190-A8
« Reply #61 on: November 10, 2010, 02:38:41 PM »
Really?  Ask waystin about the day we dogfought A8 vs F6F-5.  Ask XBrit about the day we fought 2 on 1 Spit and F4U against my A8.  Ask JB11 about our A8 vs K4 fight (to be honest he ran out of fuel after 3-5 minutes).  There's really too many to count but those immediately spring to mind.  None involved HOs.  Not saying I won't take a HO shot in the A8 because I'm always carrying the big gun package and always have convergence set at 650 yards.  If you're stupid enough to let me do it with that combo I will.

While I admit the A8 is largely outclassed in most dogfights it's much more capable than you give it credit for which is ultimately a reflection on your piloting ability.  Dogfighting Spits in a 110G-2 with the big gun package is much more challenging than doing it in an A8.  The A8 is excellent at the flat scissors overshoot once the "advantage" is lost.  Nothing can roll with it and keeping wings in-plane is impossible for anything other than another FW.  Even then human reaction time gives the "defender" the advantage and when you fly by and lose your tail it's definately not a HO.


You wouldn't perchance have any films would you?


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Offline BaldEagl

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Re: FW190-A8
« Reply #62 on: November 10, 2010, 11:43:14 PM »

You wouldn't perchance have any films would you?


wrongway

No.  I never film anything.
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Offline pervert

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Re: FW190-A8
« Reply #63 on: November 11, 2010, 01:31:29 AM »
Wrong.

Simply... WRONG.


The P-47 weighs a lot more than the 190A8. The Typhie is an even worse pig, and yet both of these aircraft are quite capable air to air.

I've dogfought the 190A8 before, light, heavy, and in between. I don't just go for HOs, I don't just look for 1v1s or picks. Throughout numerous engagements it is quite a capable plane. It's outclassed for sure, but to pretend it can only HO and run is sad and reflective more on the pilot than the plane.

Why are you using a p-47 as an example??? its a completely different airplane, you've just made a comparison based on 2 completely different aircraft with the reasoning being one weighs more yet it is still capable?? like weight is the only factor in how well an aircraft performs???

Tell you what Krusty leave the anecotes to one side post a film of you fighting say a spit or other popular MA ride with a competant pilot in a resonably co E scenario and winning it without HOing.

Oh and I don't think I mentioned it running (its too far to slow)

Offline pervert

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Re: FW190-A8
« Reply #64 on: November 11, 2010, 01:54:17 AM »
Really?  Ask waystin about the day we dogfought A8 vs F6F-5.  Ask Brit about the day we fought 2 on 1 Spit and F4U against my A8.  Ask JB11 about our A8 vs K4 fight (to be honest he ran out of fuel after 3-5 minutes).  There's really too many to count but those immediately spring to mind.  None involved Hos.  Not saying I won't take a HO shot in the A8 because I'm always carrying the big gun package and always have convergence set at 650 yards.  If you're stupid enough to let me do it with that combo I will.

While I admit the A8 is largely outclassed in most dogfights it's much more capable than you give it credit for which is ultimately a reflection on your piloting ability.  Dogfighting Spits in a 110G-2 with the big gun package is much more challenging than doing it in an A8.  The A8 is excellent at the flat scissors overshoot once the "advantage" is lost.  Nothing can roll with it and keeping wings enplane is impossible for anything other than another FW.  Even then human reaction time gives the "defender" the advantage and when you fly by and lose your tail it's definitely not a HO.

waffle waffle waffle sorry bro but a lot of this is a load of rubbish, for instance the flat scissors FW myth please! all anyone has to do is pull up into the vertical and let you finish spacing around on the deck then drop down and kill you. You burn all your E doing it in a plane that requires a lot of E to be able to retain what limited maneuverability it has, if this has worked for you its because your opponent wasn't very good.

I'm going to call you out on this because it seems newer guys are looking at the fact you've been here a long time, reading your deluded anecdotes on flying the A8 (I beat a decent stick because he ran out of fuel?? please  :Lil) and then jumping into an A8 and wondering why it doesn't work for them!

Next time you up get a film of these magical encounters for us all to share! film never lies, if you've won in an A8 its because your opponent is poor, you picked them, lack of SA, or Energy/alt advantage, you Hoed them (front deflection bull included) or some other bull like running out of fuel.

If you win a fight like this do not add it to the hall of memorable anecdotes, recognise it for what it is and stop deluding yourself and others.




Offline pervert

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Re: FW190-A8
« Reply #65 on: November 11, 2010, 07:48:33 AM »
I was also wondering if you still played this game? I haven't seen you around in a long time, checking back on your stats it seems you spend more time GVing manning field guns and flying various spitfires, and even when you go back to when you did fly the A8 a lot the majority of your kills are of buffs! (an original concept there).

Sorry bald your starting to remind me of nemesis here  :D

I want some shiny new films of you tearing it up in the MA in the 190A8 so you can shut my big yap, and prove me wrong!  :devil .......

Offline Ruah

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Re: FW190-A8
« Reply #66 on: November 11, 2010, 08:08:01 AM »
and thr glove goes down. . .

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Offline BaldEagl

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Re: FW190-A8
« Reply #67 on: November 11, 2010, 10:52:13 PM »
I was also wondering if you still played this game? I haven't seen you around in a long time, checking back on your stats it seems you spend more time GVing manning field guns and flying various spitfires, and even when you go back to when you did fly the A8 a lot the majority of your kills are of buffs! (an original concept there).

Sorry bald your starting to remind me of nemesis here  :D

I want some shiny new films of you tearing it up in the MA in the 190A8 so you can shut my big yap, and prove me wrong!  :devil .......

I'll see what I can do.  I hardly ever get to play anymore working 13 hour days and the Spit's always been my favorite plane, even before I started plaing AW, so I gravitate to it with the little time I have.  I also spend a lot of time in GV's and field guns repelling hoards on my own.  I just want to find quick action and kill someone and I don't really care how that happens.

Yes, I always did have a lot of buff kills in the A8 but I did in every other aircraft too (even Spits).  Even though I may have been out hunting buffs it never stopped me from mixing it up if the opportunity presented itself.

As to opponents not being that good, in the day I was always in that top 10% Lusche posted about the other day.  That means 9 out of 10 people I ran into weren't as good as me.  Sorry but that's not my fault.  I did admit the A8 is largely outclassed, however if I could exploit my opponent's weaknesses I could begin to level the aircraft's disadvantages.

BTW, that fight with JB11 went at least three-five minutes.  It wasn't like he ran out of fuel at the onset.
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Offline R 105

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Re: FW190-A8
« Reply #68 on: November 12, 2010, 10:05:07 AM »
I use a 190A-8 for ground attack if I am pretty sure I will not run into other fighters. I like the A-8s guns but I always get killed in it in a dog fight. It does strange high speed stalls in some turns and seems to be unstable to me. I also seem to get pilot wounds just as easy in the A-8 even with all the extra armor it has. I like the 190-A5 better over all of the 190s. I can't find a use for the 190-F8.

Offline LLogann

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Re: FW190-A8
« Reply #69 on: November 12, 2010, 10:19:30 AM »
You don't honestly believe that?  (stick not the plane)

Next time you up get a film of these magical encounters for us all to share! film never lies, if you've won in an A8 its because your opponent is poor, you picked them, lack of SA, or Energy/alt advantage, you Hoed them (front deflection bull included) or some other bull like running out of fuel.
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Offline pervert

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Re: FW190-A8
« Reply #70 on: November 12, 2010, 11:18:29 AM »
You don't honestly believe that?  (stick not the plane)


I always look for the reason why I won or lost a fight, and look to cut out any bad habits. If I've beaten even a good stick and I started with an advantage I can't really say I beat him, I am simply benefiting from a random series of circumstances.

In one of the earlier war arenas the A8 would have a better chance of competing, there is a way of fighting without having to turn in a traditional manner but you need a powerful engine something the A8 and A5 don't have. When you put that up against the late war planes in the MA you are fighting a losing battle in every aspect, you can't turn, your plane has poor low speed handling, you have a underpowered engine etc.

Thats not to say an A8 can't cut it by flying smart, but in a co E alt 1v1 with equal ability of pilots you will lose. I guess what I'm trying to put across is that there are reasons why you for example out turned a zero in your A8, its not because you were flying super duper that night film it watch it back and you'll find the zero had zero (no pun) airspeed to make the turn. This then stops you wondering why you lose the next 99 turnfights with a zero.

Reading through the boards over the years I see plenty of accounts of people destroying their foe with a sub par dogfighting aircraft, the inclination is that it is because they are very skilled rather than the benefactor of circumstance. It can be very misleading for newer people reading this and then trying the same.

Offline LLogann

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Re: FW190-A8
« Reply #71 on: November 12, 2010, 11:22:26 AM »
Well Said Sir! 

Agreed!   :salute
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Offline DEECONX

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Re: FW190-A8
« Reply #72 on: November 12, 2010, 01:07:25 PM »
I can't find a use for the 190-F8.

Tank Buster.  :aok

Offline IrishOne

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Re: FW190-A8
« Reply #73 on: November 13, 2010, 11:59:04 AM »
the weight difference between 2x20mm's/2x30mm's isnt that much different than a 4x20mm loadout.  the 2 extra 20mm carry far more ammo than the 2 extra 30mm.  in a scenario or anywhere else the 190A8 kills fighters with ease.  It is much easier to run up a big kill streak in an A8 than it is in an A5, simply because the A8 has the ability to bash anything from the sky with just a short burst.  That being said, the A5 has plenty of gun.  2 MG151's just about on the centerline of the aircraft is more than enough punch to kill anything.  The extra FF's are junk, and anyone who thinks 2 20mm's with 250rpg isn't enough firepower is nuts or has mud between the ears. 
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Offline Muzzy

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Re: FW190-A8
« Reply #74 on: November 13, 2010, 04:31:58 PM »
The A8 is certainly not a 1v1 dogfight aircraft.  It's handling characteristics don't allow for the kind of vertical or turning maneuvers which (I believe) you need in order to succeed in dueling. Nor would it be the type of aircraft I would use in a close base defense (i.e. when the cons are practically on top of you and there is no time to build altitude).

I would also not say the A8 is a ride for newbie pilots.  It's characteristics are tricky and unless you get a feel for it's '"sweet spot" you will quickly get into trouble.

The way I use the A8 is as follows: I will up from a field that is a reasonable distance from the fight and gain at least 10k of alt, or more depending on what the fight is looking like. Once over the combat area I will look for targets of opportunity, either bombers or low cons in the furball.  The A8 is a great bomber killer and the tactics needed for that are explained in other threads.  I will keep my speed in the 300-350ish range as I dive on targets and climb out when possible.  I will continue fighting like this until the fight gets low on the deck, and then I will use slashing attacks, using roll rate and high-yo-yo's to stay with turning aircraft.  I will keep my speed in the "sweet spot" (250-350) as long as I can.  I will then take an opportunity to exit the fight to regain alt. The important thing here is to take *every* opportunity to exit and regain some alt in order to keep from getting slow on the deck. 

The things you need to learn to be successful in the A8 are proper speed management, 'feel' for the plane itself, and exit strategy.  I found that the A8, being less forgiving than other rides, *forced* me to learn these tactics and made me a better pilot in the process of learning, to the point that when I tried the A5 I was a lot better at flying it than I expected.  I think that the A8's slower overall speed when compared to other bnz'ers was a plus in my case, because I have a hard time getting shots in at 375-450mph (my reflexes generally aren't good enough to get the shot in as I go by).

The trick with the A8 is that you absolutely have to fly it to its strengths in order to be successful.  There are better planes in the game for sure, and definitely better planes to learn how to duel with, but I like flying the A8 on attack missions because with the restrictions there are also certain freedoms.  In the A8 I know I can get into a furball with a decent chance of survival, and I can also drop any bombers I run into.  I can also de-ack and knock out town buildings more efficiently.  The medium gun package provides enough firepower to kill any target you care to name and has a generous supply of ammo, and it doesn't have the tricky ballistics of the K4 or the La's. Other than the N1K1 or the perked rides with 4xHispanos, it's probably the best mix of hitting power and range available.

That said, I will say that I will not fly the A8 into a 1v1 situation (which I stink at anyways) nor will I fight uphill if I can help it.  It's just not that kind of plane.  It's a boom and zoom aircraft for someone who prefers to be opportunistic (okay, a picker) and who is careful enough to gain an alt advantage before going into a fight.

Again, this is only my personal experience with this ride, and I am far from an expert pilot. The A8 is not to everyone's liking, but I like to fly it, and I think it's made me a better pilot in the process.



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