Author Topic: P-61 Widowmaker  (Read 4333 times)

Offline 5PointOh

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2842
Re: P-61 Widowmaker
« Reply #30 on: December 21, 2010, 10:30:18 PM »
And a lot of fighters were built for long range escort but were switched to air to ground attack roles.
Coprhead
Wings of Terror
Mossie Student Driver

Offline fbWldcat

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2970
Re: P-61 Widowmaker
« Reply #31 on: December 21, 2010, 11:30:47 PM »
Which ones? As I recall (don't count on this) the P-51, P-47, P-38, P-39 (to name a few) were all conceived as F/A aircraft. No?
Landing is overrated.
"Two roads diverged in a wood, and I: I took the one less traveled by." - Robert Frost
"Uncommon valor was a common virtue." <S>

Offline lyric1

  • Skinner Team
  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 10633
Re: P-61 Widowmaker
« Reply #32 on: December 22, 2010, 01:36:42 PM »

But as it stands, the Widowmaker was originally built for night fighting purposes.
This is very true. :aok How ever in AHII every aircraft has a clip board with a radar system built in to it that the P61 would have never come close to back in it's day.

So I guess do we disable the radar/clipboard arrangement because we use nothing but day fighters? No that would not make sense.

So if we can get beyond the night fighter designation there really is not that much difference to all the other aircraft in game if it was to be included.

« Last Edit: December 22, 2010, 01:38:15 PM by lyric1 »

Offline Rino

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8495
Re: P-61 Widowmaker
« Reply #33 on: December 22, 2010, 02:36:24 PM »
I stand corrected, you killed my argument (happens quite a bit on the board these days).

But as it stands, the Widowmaker was originally built for night fighting purposes.

     I'm pretty sure you were originally built for something a whole lot different than playing AH, doesn't mean
you shouldn't be in the game  :D
80th FS Headhunters
PHAN
Proud veteran of the Cola Wars

Offline fbWldcat

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2970
Re: P-61 Widowmaker
« Reply #34 on: December 22, 2010, 08:07:51 PM »
Rino, I challenge thee to a duel. Pistols at dawn... EST?


Lyric, you bring up a good point... This is why I lose chess matches... The other guy looks further ahead than I do... blasphemy...  :D
Landing is overrated.
"Two roads diverged in a wood, and I: I took the one less traveled by." - Robert Frost
"Uncommon valor was a common virtue." <S>

Offline Saxman

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 9155
Re: P-61 Widowmaker
« Reply #35 on: December 22, 2010, 11:00:51 PM »
Alright, I've gotta say it, because you guys are driving me fricken' NUTS with it.

It's P-61 Black Widow. NOT Widowmaker.
Ron White says you can't fix stupid. I beg to differ. Stupid will usually sort itself out, it's just a matter of making sure you're not close enough to become collateral damage.

Offline Volron

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 5805
Re: P-61 Widowmaker
« Reply #36 on: December 23, 2010, 07:49:45 AM »
Alright, I've gotta say it, because you guys are driving me fricken' NUTS with it.

It's P-61 Black Widow. NOT Widowmaker.

 :rofl
Quote from: hitech
Wow I find it hard to believe it has been almost 38 days since our last path. We should have release another 38 versions by now  :bhead
HiTech
Quote from: Pyro
Quote from: Jolly
What on Earth makes you think that i said that sir?!
My guess would be scotch.

Offline fbWldcat

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2970
Re: P-61 Widowmaker
« Reply #37 on: December 23, 2010, 08:38:41 PM »
You know I just try to tick you off.  :D

I'm playing Fallout 3 right now and I got the Widowmaker perk... It stuck. Sorry bout that  :rofl
Landing is overrated.
"Two roads diverged in a wood, and I: I took the one less traveled by." - Robert Frost
"Uncommon valor was a common virtue." <S>

Offline Dichotomy

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 12386
Re: P-61 Widowmaker
« Reply #38 on: December 23, 2010, 08:40:25 PM »
Alright, I've gotta say it, because you guys are driving me fricken' NUTS with it.

It's P-61 Black Widow. NOT Widowmaker.

psh details... :D
JG11 - Dicho37Only The Proud Only The Strong AH Players who've passed on :salute

Offline DREDIOCK

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 17773
Re: P-61 Widowmaker
« Reply #39 on: December 24, 2010, 03:12:24 AM »
So? The widowmaker was a nightfighter through and through. If you wanted to make a weak case for it, you could say "we already have two night bombers." The widowmaker was a nightfighter and was used solely as such. And two planes out of 100+ isn't a very good defense. If you can tell me any more (specifically for night fighting, not just with the skins to do so), then you can do so.

The arguement for not having night fighters is because we no longer have night time and the reason for them being used as night fightes is because of their radar.
Well neither argument holds water when it comes to this game.
As I mentioned in another post. It is not the fault of the planes why we dont have night. But rather the ignorance of some of the players.
Still We do have bombers that were like the P61 were almost exclusively used at night.
As for the radar. For them to equip any addition of the P61 with the radar it had. It would actually be a dumbed down version of the radar we have now in every plane and vehicle in the game.
As the radar that all of our planes not so historically have I might add. is far superior to anything the P61's had.
One use the 61's could have however. Is they could be made immune to local radar going down but perhaps at a  reduced range. This would and should automatically make it a perk ride

And yes you can point to a couple of planes out of 100. The entire arguement about night is based on how they were historically flown. Yes only few flew missions in the day. But it shows it could have been done much like our dive bombing B-17's and Lancasters and thats been the entire arguement for allowing that.
And how many planes here are consistently flown in their "historical" manner? Come to think of it. How much of anything here is consistently done in a historical manner?

So you see. Not having night. and the P61s radar and historical use as a "night fighter" are not  valid  or significant enough arguments to keep it out of the game (in laymans terms. they are BS arguments)

There isnt a single argument yet I've seen that holds water in keeping the 61 or any night fighter out of the game


Death is no easy answer
For those who wish to know
Ask those who have been before you
What fate the future holds
It ain't pretty

Offline DREDIOCK

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 17773
Re: P-61 Widowmaker
« Reply #40 on: December 24, 2010, 03:26:53 AM »
If AH survives this current generation of noxious ignorant console bred gamers I would expect the P61 in game eventually, at some point in time.

Iit should. It was many of those same type of "noxious ignorant console bred gamers" that saw that night leave the game
Death is no easy answer
For those who wish to know
Ask those who have been before you
What fate the future holds
It ain't pretty

Offline fbWldcat

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2970
Re: P-61 Widowmaker
« Reply #41 on: December 24, 2010, 11:09:26 AM »
I never said I was against the Black Widow being added. I love the thing and would love it in-game. I was just building up a list of reasons it shouldn't be added so you guys could shoot them down  :aok :noid

Would you believe me if I said I've done 3 different P-61 models? I really do love the bird.
Landing is overrated.
"Two roads diverged in a wood, and I: I took the one less traveled by." - Robert Frost
"Uncommon valor was a common virtue." <S>

Offline DREDIOCK

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 17773
Re: P-61 Widowmaker
« Reply #42 on: December 24, 2010, 01:01:25 PM »
I never said I was against the Black Widow being added. I love the thing and would love it in-game. I was just building up a list of reasons it shouldn't be added so you guys could shoot them down  :aok :noid

Would you believe me if I said I've done 3 different P-61 models? I really do love the bird.

LOL ok.

Just that I've heard the same tired arguments for years now why we shouldn't have it. Not one holds water
Death is no easy answer
For those who wish to know
Ask those who have been before you
What fate the future holds
It ain't pretty

Offline Karnak

  • Radioactive Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 23047
Re: P-61 Widowmaker
« Reply #43 on: December 24, 2010, 01:17:28 PM »
Add the P-61A, Mosquito NF.Mk 30, Ju88G-7, and J1N1-S, give all of them a local personal radar, maybe a 10 mile radius or so.  Could be fun flavor aircraft.
Petals floating by,
      Drift through my woman's hand,
             As she remembers me-

Offline 1Boner

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2285
Re: P-61 Widowmaker
« Reply #44 on: December 24, 2010, 01:18:43 PM »
This is very true. :aok How ever in AHII every aircraft has a clip board with a radar system built in to it that the P61 would have never come close to back in it's day.

So I guess do we disable the radar/clipboard arrangement because we use nothing but day fighters? No that would not make sense.

So if we can get beyond the night fighter designation there really is not that much difference to all the other aircraft in game if it was to be included.


:aok
"Life is just as deadly as it looks"  Richard Thompson

"So umm.... just to make sure I have this right.  What you are asking is for the bombers carrying bombs, to stop dropping bombs on the bombs, so the bombers can carry bombs to bomb things with?"  AKP