Japan Earthquake News

[Babalonian]

dont they use that half-life crap in carbon-14 dating? also if you did the math it would be some insane number too big to fit on a calculator.

That's why carbon-14 dating is a realtively newer technology, mankind hasn't had instrumentation sophicicated and advanced enough until lately to acuratley get precise enough readings that can then be converted into the age of an object.  You are litteraly detecting such small amounts of radiation and then taking those faint emisions and focusing and ampliphying them enough to tell if something is 2500 years old or 2550 years old.

That is something that should be taken into account with the recent Japan nuclear crisis, is that our means and ability (technology) to simply measure and analize radiation and contamination is 100-fold what it was during the Chernoble or 3-Mile disasters.

That would be almost reasonable if the spent fuel rods in the holding pools were the only concern...at least one containment breach is now admitted by TEPCO.

The radiologicals flowing from that breached core makes the threat from the spent fuel rod pools almost laughably insignificant..wouldn't  you agree?

How about THOSE half-lifes?

Regards,
Sun

So you then agree with those of us who earlier in this situation, before a vessel was compromised, that this disaster was being hilariously overblown and hyped.  I think you'll then also find that while the situation is agreeabley much more dangerous and hazardous now at the plant, it is still contained within a few auxiliary levels of containment (because Chernoble taught the world, better safe with a few feet of solid concrete than sorry).

[Babalonian]

Also, Im also surprised the media hasn't mentioned, or offered for comparison, geiger readings from most of the old granite buildings in Manhatten.            There's a reason buildings built with granite from one of the more infamous quarries that supplied the region are naturaly warmer than the rest in New York.

[Sundowner]

That's why carbon-14 dating is a realtively newer technology, mankind hasn't had instrumentation sophicicated and advanced enough until lately to acuratley get precise enough readings that can then be converted into the age of an object.  You are litteraly detecting such small amounts of radiation and then taking those faint emisions and focusing and ampliphying them enough to tell if something is 2500 years old or 2550 years old.

That is something that should be taken into account with the recent Japan nuclear crisis, is that our means and ability (technology) to simply measure and analize radiation and contamination is 100-fold what it was during the Chernoble or 3-Mile disasters.


So you then agree with those of us who earlier in this situation, before a vessel was compromised, that this disaster was being hilariously overblown and hyped.  I think you'll then also find that while the situation is agreeabley much more dangerous and hazardous now at the plant, it is still contained within a few auxiliary levels of containment (because Chernoble taught the world, better safe with a few feet of solid concrete than sorry).

I'd just like to post this latest act of heroics from these noble workers.

Sun

Japan's Nuclear Rescuers: 'Inevitable Some of Them May Die Within Weeks'

Workers at the disaster-stricken Fukushima nuclear plant in Japan say they expect to die from radiation sickness as a result of their efforts to bring the reactors under control, the mother of one of the men tells Fox News.

The so-called Fukushima 50, the team of brave plant workers struggling to prevent a meltdown to four reactors critically damaged by the March 11 earthquake and tsunami, are being repeatedly exposed to dangerously high radioactive levels as they attempt to bring vital cooling systems back online.

Speaking tearfully through an interpreter by phone, the mother of a 32-year-old worker said: “My son and his colleagues have discussed it at length and they have committed themselves to die if necessary to save the nation.

“He told me they have accepted they will all probably die from radiation sickness in the short term or cancer in the long-term.”

The woman spoke to Fox News on the condition of anonymity because, she said, plant workers had been asked by management not to communicate with the media or share details with family members in order to minimize public panic.

She could not confirm if her son or other workers were already suffering from radiation sickness. But she added: “They have concluded between themselves that it is inevitable some of them may die within weeks or months. They know it is impossible for them not to have been exposed to lethal doses of radiation.”...

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2011/03/31/japans-nuclear-rescuers-inevitable-die-weeks/?test=latestnews

[Penguin]

That's why carbon-14 dating is a realtively newer technology, mankind hasn't had instrumentation sophicicated and advanced enough until lately to acuratley get precise enough readings that can then be converted into the age of an object.  You are litteraly detecting such small amounts of radiation and then taking those faint emisions and focusing and ampliphying them enough to tell if something is 2500 years old or 2550 years old.

That is something that should be taken into account with the recent Japan nuclear crisis, is that our means and ability (technology) to simply measure and analize radiation and contamination is 100-fold what it was during the Chernoble or 3-Mile disasters.


So you then agree with those of us who earlier in this situation, before a vessel was compromised, that this disaster was being hilariously overblown and hyped.  I think you'll then also find that while the situation is agreeabley much more dangerous and hazardous now at the plant, it is still contained within a few auxiliary levels of containment (because Chernoble taught the world, better safe with a few feet of solid concrete than sorry).

Well, that depends upon the age of the object.  Are we talking about 3 years or 3.1 billion years?  I remember learning about potassium dating, and that it can reach out further than Carbon-14.  Isn't potassium dating what allowed us to determine the age of the earth?

The level of precision is also important, when it comes to dinosaurs, having a give or take of 1,000 years is a pretty decent level of accuracy.  However, when viewing something like ancient hominids, 1,000 years is 1/40th of our time on the planet.

-Penguin

[icepac]

Until one of the fukushima reactors ejects burning fuel and graphite moderator into the parking lots and spews a blue light of ionizing radiation skyward like the RBMK reactor did at chernobyl, I'll have to say it's nowhere near the devastation of chernobyl.

[moot]

Do you know of any pics of that - the Chernobyl reactor shining blue?

[Sundowner]

Moot I've got a ---possible----photo of "Ethereal blue flash" from the fukushima site...can't vouch for any authenticity...but still, interesting.

http://enenews.com/ethereal-blue-flash-may-occur-during-localized-criticality-bloomberg

Here are some videos of controlled reactor blue flash "pulses".

All the Control Rods are removed simultaneously allowing the nuclear reaction to proceed un-dampened, bringing the energy output of the reactor to 680 Megawatts in 50 milliseconds.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SMTzjIEIVG4&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgNwtepP-6M&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6I3JKYdGWTE&feature=related

Here is the first report of the neutron beams detected from the Japan site....March 23.

Neutron beam observed 13 times at crippled Fukushima nuke plant

TOKYO, March 23, Kyodo

Tokyo Electric Power Co. said Wednesday it has observed a neutron beam, a kind of radioactive ray, 13 times on the premises of the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant after it was crippled by the massive March 11 quake-tsunami disaster.

TEPCO, the operator of the nuclear plant, said the neutron beam measured about 1.5 kilometers southwest of the plant's No. 1 and 2 reactors over three days from March 13 and is equivalent to 0.01 to 0.02 microsieverts per hour and that this is not a dangerous level.

The utility firm said it will measure uranium and plutonium, which could emit a neutron beam, as well.

In the 1999 criticality accident at a nuclear fuel processing plant run by JCO Co. in Tokaimura, Ibaraki Prefecture, uranium broke apart continually in nuclear fission, causing a massive amount of neutron beams.

In the latest case at the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant, such a criticality accident has yet to happen.

But the measured neutron beam may be evidence that uranium and plutonium leaked from the plant's nuclear reactors and spent nuclear fuels have discharged a small amount of neutron beams through nuclear fission.

==Kyodo

http://english.kyodonews.jp/news/2011/03/80539.html

Regards,
Sun

[Sundowner]

Until one of the fukushima reactors ejects burning fuel and graphite moderator into the parking lots and spews a blue light of ionizing radiation skyward like the RBMK reactor did at chernobyl, I'll have to say it's nowhere near the devastation of chernobyl.

See the links above...

Regards,
Sun

[icepac]

That 1999 criticality accident was because they poured super concentrated uranyl nitrate into high enough amounts to cause criticality.

At chernobyl, some guys were on an apartment roof drinking when it exploded and saw the blue ionization from the exposed core.

It was later obscured by smoke and then the crap they dropped on it hours later.

[moot]

Very cool, thank you.

[Sundowner]

Another mention of "ethereal blue light" in western media as well as "local criticality" at the Fukushima site. (I guess the public at large is getting a primer in the outward manifestations of a meltdown in progress.)

Regards,
Sun

http://video.foxnews.com/v/4621086/officials-question-radiation-data-at-japanese-nuke-plant


Something else occurred to me: doesn't Japan pass through an acute annual monsoon/Hurricane season?
If they leave these radioactive blowtorches open to the atmosphere and storms come ashore pushing westward....?

Great Scott. 

--SD

[skorpion]

Another mention of "ethereal blue light" in western media as well as "local criticality" at the Fukushima site. (I guess the public at large is getting a primer in the outward manifestations of a meltdown in progress.)

Regards,
Sun

http://video.foxnews.com/v/4621086/officials-question-radiation-data-at-japanese-nuke-plant


Something else occurred to me: doesn't Japan pass through an acute annual monsoon/Hurricane season?
If they leave these radioactive blowtorches open to the atmosphere and storms come ashore pushing westward....?

Great Scott. 

--SD

well there somewhat in a monsoon area...they are just barely in it because the monsoons passes right on the western edge of japan and the rest is all the way over to the west side of china and down to mongolia or some place like that, either way they could let it open up and cool it down that way.

[Megalodon]

A 10 megawatt hydrogen plan just isn't going to cut it.  My single reactor plant puts out over 1600, that's for 2 years straight 24\7 before needing a refuel.  Coal can match nuclear output, but it is literally continually refueled.  Once a nuclear plant starts burning it's fuel, it practically runs itself.  They are incredibly reliable and safe, barring a natural disaster of epic proportions.  If countries prefer polluting themselves with the byproducts of coal, then I guess we can live in a nuclear free world, that's an awfully big step backwards in my opinion.  You're talking at the very least 50 years before a power source comes along able to replace coal.

I just don't understand the outrage and fear when it comes to the Japan nuclear situation.  Where is the international outrage when a coal mine explodes, when a fly ash pond decimates miles and miles of land, when mountain tops are literally torn apart to get at coal, when mercury from coal plants is linked to human disease, etc.  Yet even after Three Mile Island and Japan, when nuclear power shows how safe it can be even when the worst possible scenario happens, it's still treated as a nuclear bomb about to go off at anytime.

Well,  picking the smallest of the 6 hydrogen plants I posted to make your statement 

Two of the plants, Abu Dhabi and California, are 400 and 500 MW, respectivly. Abu Dhabi plant gets its hydrogen from natural gas and the California plant will run on the oil company's bottom end byproduct, Raw Petroleum Coke. Neither derive their hydrogen from water allthough new types of water extraction are coming available. I would rather have 500 of these, than 1 more nuke plant. As the technology gets better prices will come down and hydrogen can easily compete with nuclear. I cant make you push the button, but I posted 2 films of the way the technology works maybe... take a min and look it over  It will help the oil company recover more oil and sequester the C02 insted of spewing into the environment.

We need nuclear like a hole in the head... it's safe .. it's safe... till there is an accident. It's safe to ride your bike... till ya get hit by a car!
I doubt we'll see another nuclear plant here in the US in our lifetimes. I know there are about 10, most are AP1000's, waiting for approval and the Tennessee Valley project is on hold. It's byproduct is one of the most toxic things on earth. I would much rather have water/steam as exhaust than toxic fuel rods.

What I really don't care for are the Breeders, just making more and more spent fuel that we have no place for. Its the filthest, the worst of all types of Electric Generation. http://www.3rd1000.com/nuclear/nuke101g.htm

/end Hijack

In the News,

Incredible large cement pumps from Russia are moving in to Fukishima, should they remove the rods or just encapsulate them as well.

Also the delay of restarting many reactors by another electric company in japan for safety reason.
http://english.kyodonews.jp/news/2011/04/82803.html

[icepac]

If the fuel has melted into a pool, then I doubt they will try to encapsulate it but rather dilute it which will spread the fissile product far enough apart that the reaction stops and the corium created will solidify and slowly cool.

I would guess the "mix" of the concrete would be tailored for this purpose.

At that point, they can encapsulate as they deem necessary.

All of this is just assuming that the fuel has indeed pooled into an uncontrollable mass which would make water cooling only effective for the time that the water is being circulated to slough off the heat.

I would use thier actions and process to glean what is really going on more than the statements.

[Megalodon]

If the fuel has melted into a pool, then I doubt they will try to encapsulate it but rather dilute it which will spread the fissile product far enough apart that the reaction stops and the corium created will solidify and slowly cool.

I would guess the "mix" of the concrete would be tailored for this purpose.

At that point, they can encapsulate as they deem necessary.

All of this is just assuming that the fuel has indeed pooled into an uncontrollable mass which would make water cooling only effective for the time that the water is being circulated to slough off the heat.

I would use thier actions and process to glean what is really going on more than the statements.

When the water fails, cause they cant keep the pressure, they will pack the core with sand and concrete well after it melts.

Well 1st, there will have to be another 500 brave soles to remake the containment for 3 reactor buildings to poor cement into as those buildings, the normal cement containment, have been blown to pieces.