Author Topic: Nothing to see here, move along  (Read 1901 times)

Offline Tec

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Re: Westboro church meets thier match
« Reply #15 on: April 28, 2011, 01:24:07 AM »
Their "right" to do this BS will be overturned.  

Anyone who's willing to chip away at the first amendment to silence a few whack jobs is more of a problem than the whack jobs them selves.
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Offline AAJagerX

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Re: Westboro church meets thier match
« Reply #16 on: April 28, 2011, 03:44:28 AM »
Anyone who's willing to chip away at the first amendment to silence a few whack jobs is more of a problem than the whack jobs them selves.

Apparently you have no concept of personal rights, or law as it pertains to those rights for that matter.  You may want to re-read freedom of speech, as you have it wrong.  
Here's a little for ya...

The free communication of ideas and opinions is one of the most precious of the rights of man. Every citizen may, accordingly, speak, write, and print with freedom, but shall be responsible for such abuses of this freedom.

Now, let's talk about the harm principle for a minute.

If in fact the offense is profound enough to allow for prohibition...
 
"If pornographers engaged in the same behavior, parading through neighborhoods where they were likely to meet great resistance and cause profound offense, they too should be prevented from doing so. It is clear, therefore, that the crucial component of the offense principle is the avoidability of the offensive material. For the argument to be consistent, it must follow that many forms of hate speech should still be allowed if the offense is easily avoidable."

Have you ever wondered why porn can't be sold within 1000 yds of a school, or why nudity can't be shown on basic cable???  It's called avoidability.

In layman's terms.  If you want to spew that crap....  Do it at home...  NOT at a soldier's funeral.





« Last Edit: April 28, 2011, 04:38:17 AM by AAJagerX »
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Offline Tec

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Re: Westboro church meets thier match
« Reply #17 on: April 28, 2011, 06:40:00 AM »
Apparently you have no concept of personal rights, or law as it pertains to those rights for that matter.  

Well, I am far from a lawyer, if I wanted to be a potato I'd just go stand on the corner and save my self from the mind numbing hell that must be reading encyclopedic amounts of case law.

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Here's a little for ya...

The free communication of ideas and opinions is one of the most precious of the rights of man. Every citizen may, accordingly, speak, write, and print with freedom, but shall be responsible for such abuses of this freedom as shall be defined by law.

That's a nice quote, but being unfamiliar with it I decided to see where it came from.  Quite a surprise to find out that it comes not from an American work but from a French document "Declaration of the Rights of Man and of the Citizen".  We're discussing the Constitution of the United States of America here and how it pertains to Americans on American soil, not the finer points of the French revolution so I will respond with a quote I find appropriate.

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

Quote
Now, let's go into Mill's Harm Principle for a minute.

"If in fact the offense is profound enough to allow for prohibition...
If pornographers engaged in the same behavior, parading through neighborhoods where they were likely to meet great resistance and cause profound offense, they too should be prevented from doing so. It is clear, therefore, that the crucial component of the offense principle is the avoidability of the offensive material. For the argument to be consistent, it must follow that many forms of hate speech should still be allowed if the offense is easily avoidable."

That's actually some pretty good stuff, I enjoyed the bit of reading up on it I did.  But has it ever been used in the context we are talking here?

Lets look at freedom of assembly for a moment. "The government may place restrictions on the right to assemble that will maintain law and order, facilitate traffic, protect private property and reduce noise congestion.  The courts allow these restrictions, as long as the restrictions are not aimed at squelching a particular group's free speech because it is unpopular or not liked."

The bold part is the important part.  Any restrictions that you would put in place to try and silence one group has to be applied to others.  Maybe a sly way around it would be to call an emergency city council meeting and ram an ordinance through that restores full property rights over sidewalks to the owners of said property, and then revert the law back once the storm has passed.  In the end though I think the best way to shut these people up is with counter protest.

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NOT at a soldier's funeral.

Couldn't agree with you more, what these people do is the pinnacle of tastelessness and disrespect.  That said I am proud to live in a country where people are free to protest openly and express their views no matter how unpopular, and others are free to show up 200 deep on their Harleys and drown them out with a thunderous roar.  The people of WBC are nothing more than the worlds greatest IRL trolls looking for reactions and headlines.  Don't give them the satisfaction, just give them the finger and keep on trucking.

P.S.  When old man Phelps kicks the bucket anyone wanna make some "Thank god for dead Fred" signs and take a roadtrip with me?
To each their pwn.
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Offline Nefarious

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Re: Westboro church meets thier match
« Reply #18 on: April 28, 2011, 07:07:26 AM »
I'm curious if Mr Phelps Intention is not to harass the poor families but to destroy the 1st amendment itself. What better way for the people to accept the curtailment of rights than to do it for the protection of others. Compile this with the media and government's new obsession with bullying and you might see what I am getting at.
There must also be a flyable computer available for Nefarious to do FSO. So he doesn't keep talking about it for eight and a half hours on Friday night!

Offline Reschke

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Re: Westboro church meets thier match
« Reply #19 on: April 28, 2011, 07:19:00 AM »
Yep and the citizens of Rankin county Mississippi had every right to do just what the did to prevent these ding dongs from creating a problem.
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Offline ozrocker

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Re: Westboro church meets thier match
« Reply #20 on: April 28, 2011, 08:12:20 AM »
Yeah, locked soon. Similar post by someone earier. Watch out for the ban hammer.
IN


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Offline Yeager

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Re: Westboro church meets thier match
« Reply #21 on: April 28, 2011, 08:21:43 AM »
OUT  :banana:
"If someone flips you the bird and you don't know it, does it still count?" - SLIMpkns