P-38 turnfight

[oboe]

I believe you are correct - the ill fated loss (ship?) had kits for service Centers at 8th AF designated for -10 and above and the -25 was first production block change with the flaps.

IIRC it was a transport aircraft bringing the refit kits to England; the plane was shot down by an RAF Spitfire.   At least I think I read that somewhere.   

[Becinhu]

Corky is the most dangerous 38 pilot in the game............to trees, shrubs, fences, barns, airfield structures, and himself.
 

[drgondog]

IIRC it was a transport aircraft bringing the refit kits to England; the plane was shot down by an RAF Spitfire.   At least I think I read that somewhere.   

good enough for me..

[Widewing]

C-54 carrying cargo, including 200 Dive Recovery Flap kits was shot down by a Spitfire, mistaking it for a FW 200. You can't fix stupid.

[Max6]

If you need to learn how to turn in a P38, there are a few pilots that might learn you.
All you need is to ask.
Ask Silat or Twintail. I hate the P38 when Silat or Twintail are flying them.    
They are good P38 pilots. <S> 

The pilot are the brain in the plane. <S>

[save]

Ok ok, early Luft planes all te way to the g14 38's are very outclassed. Late war 109's and 190's will have a helluva time turning with a deascent 38j/L.


190a5 and turn with a p47, a 38 outturns a jug at slow speeds. Therfore a 190 can't out turn a 38, even the a5 (the best turning 190)

At 400mph+ a 190 can pretty much do everything better than a 38.
I cant remember how many 38's planted it, trying to get out of a dive coming after me.

[Ack-Ack]

At 400mph+ a 190 can pretty much do everything better than a 38.
I cant remember how many 38's planted it, trying to get out of a dive coming after me.

It only has a slightly faster roll rate at that speed and cannot turn as well at that speed with a P-38, especially a P-38L which can deploy its dive flaps to aid in a high speed turn. 

As for a P-38 augering in trying to follow you in a dive, well, that just points to the a mistake or inexperience on the part of the P-38 driver.  Those that are experienced flying the P-38 can safely dive the Lightning up to 500mph IAS and still retain the ability to maneuver, albeit sluggishly but still able to control the plane.

ack-ack

[Widewing]

It only has a slightly faster roll rate at that speed and cannot turn as well at that speed with a P-38, especially a P-38L which can deploy its dive flaps to aid in a high speed turn. 

As for a P-38 augering in trying to follow you in a dive, well, that just points to the a mistake or inexperience on the part of the P-38 driver.  Those that are experienced flying the P-38 can safely dive the Lightning up to 500mph IAS and still retain the ability to maneuver, albeit sluggishly but still able to control the plane.

ack-ack

If you look at the NACA roll data for the FW 190A, The P-38L should easily out-roll any 190 at high speed. The NACA data shows that the 190's roll rate degrades quickly above 300 mph.

[Delirium]

If you look at the NACA roll data for the FW 190A, The P-38L should easily out-roll any 190 at high speed. The NACA data shows that the 190's roll rate degrades quickly above 300 mph.

It does within Aces High as well, at high speed the P38L can roll faster than any 190 or P47. That roll rate, in my opinion, makes stall fighting in the L much more difficult, particularly when snap-rolling at low speed. Historically, P38 drivers transitioning to the L from the G/H/J had the same complaints.

Suffice to say, I'd rather 1v1 in a J but against a large number of bandits the L is much better at higher speeds, particularly when BnZing.

[BnZs]

cannot turn as well at that speed with a P-38, especially a P-38L which can deploy its dive flaps to aid in a high speed turn. 

People in this game have a habit of claiming that "x" plane turns better at high speed. And in every case it is nonsense, and a pet peeve of mine.

An aircraft's turn performance above corner speed is limited by G tolerance. The only other limitation that may come into play is if heavy controls disallow the pilot from pulling as many Gs as he can stand. And every "pilot" in the AHII skies is limited to the exact same 6 Gs. 400mph IAS is well above corner speed for both the 38 and 190.

Aircraft types DO NOT MATTER. If two planes are going the same speed and pulling the same number of Gs (let us say the 6 Gs that we are limited to in AHII), then their turn rates and radii are EXACTLY the same, not better or worse. This is an immutable law of physics. Furthermore, any speed in excess of corner velocity decreases turn rate and increases turn radius, so the initial advantage in any turning starting out at 400mph or so IAS would go to the pilot who decelerates his plane more quickly to corner velocity.

[Debrody]

^^^ that
plus those rides top speed is well under 400mph (IAS). How long can you fly over 400, how many moves can you do before you burn your speed?
400+mph hadling only comes to play in a BnZ situation. In an even 1v1 or many vs many, those charachteristics play a minor role.

[drgondog]

Aircraft types DO NOT MATTER. If two planes are going the same speed and pulling the same number of Gs (let us say the 6 Gs that we are limited to in AHII), then their turn rates and radii are EXACTLY the same, not better or worse. This is an immutable law of physics. Furthermore, any speed in excess of corner velocity decreases turn rate and increases turn radius, so the initial advantage in any turning starting out at 400mph or so IAS would go to the pilot who decelerates his plane more quickly to corner velocity.

But the Vn will not be the same if the CLmax and W/S are different.. having said that most of the a/c you model here would have a reasonably close Vn to each other as the CLmax and W/S are not hugely different as long as you stipulate the same 6 G allowable..

But if you take say a P-51H and a P-51D at same mission loading, the 51H should have a higher Vn - because the limit load for the p-51H, while at 7.3 Gs (IIRC) for the design load out internal fuel versus the 51D (at 8G for 8,000 GW) was 6.4 at 10000 GW for same profile..

[FLS]

BnZ the turn rates are only the same for that instant when they have the same speed and G load. Realistically that parity is going to change pretty quickly and one of two dissimilar aircraft will likely show better overall high speed turn performance.