Did the Navy win the Battle of Britain?

[oakranger]

and all of the above would've been useless, and not possible without the convoys from America.

 i know you guys were waiting for someone to say it.....so it's said.

Let's keep it as we know it. The battle was fought and won in the air by RAF and the battle of the Alantic was fought and won by RN, with some assistant of RN.

I don't think that it would have been utterly useless, but suffice it to say that the British would have been in a difficult position without those convoys.  The amount of teamwork that the Allied Powers displayed was astonishing, Russia and Britain were a great help in holding off Germany and providing a launching point for the second part of the pincer movement.  With any foresight, this war won't be fought again.

-Penguin

It has been talked about before.  Even if the Germans launch the invasion, it would have been difficult for them to gain a foothold on British land. As Eisnhowar said, amphibious invasion is nearly impossible. Few have done it, but many have not.

[CAP1]

Let's keep it as we know it. The battle was fought and won in the air by RAF and the battle of the Alantic was fought and won by RN, with some assistant of RN.


It has been talked about before.  Even if the Germans launch the invasion, it would have been difficult for them to gain a foothold on British land. As Eisnhowar said, amphibious invasion is nearly impossible. Few have done it, but many have not.

 i only say that, as without convoys, and ships escorting those convoys to protect against the uboats, there would've been massive food and fuel shortages.

 then in the raf, there were the canadian pilots, the american pilots, polish pilots..........this all combined is how england stayed on her feet.....teamwork.

[oakranger]

i only say that, as without convoys, and ships escorting those convoys to protect against the uboats, there would've been massive food and fuel shortages.

 then in the raf, there were the canadian pilots, the american pilots, polish pilots..........this all combined is how england stayed on her feet.....teamwork.

Yes, you are correct about that. 

[sluggish]

Everyone knows that the Americans just lent the brits some gas that they didn't need and then showed up late.

[GFShill]

Sounds like bollocks to me. If the RAF went down the LW would've bombed the snot out of the british ports, fuel supplies etc. It would've been a domino effect.

I concur.

[MiloMorai]

now that i think of it.....look up operation cerberus. it was in 41, but if the royal navey were home, it would've been them attacking the fleet int he channel.

The big ships were at Home > big naval base in northern Scotland.  A bit to far away to participate in Cerberus.

Up until the end of May 1940 convoys past the southern tip of Ireland with ports of destination being along the south and west coasts of GB. Just about all the sinkings of merchant ships, and U-boat occurred in Home Waters. After May 1940, the convoys were routed further out into the Atlantic and used the northern route around Ireland. Convoys from American waters did not start til June 1940.

The KM started the war with just over 40 boats at sea. There was ~20 or less boats at sea until April 1941 when the number increased above the 40. see graph

http://www.uboat.net/ops/combat_strength.html

The RN started the war with 184 destroyers.

[smoe]

I would have to say looking at the loss ratio. I would conclude that Britain lost BoB as they had radar for advanced warning, could choose when and where to fight, could glide back to a friendly airfield, and could be home for tea in minutes.

Total losses of aircraft in the Battle of Britain

Month              RAF       Luftwaffe
July(from10th)    90         165
August             399         612
September        416         554
October           182         321
Total               1087      1652

[MiloMorai]

1940 radar did not give an exact location and altitude like todays modern radar.

[CAP1]

1940 radar did not give an exact location and altitude like todays modern radar.

but the spotters that they used when the towers were mostly non-op did give a pretty good approximation from what i've read.

[smoe]

but the spotters that they used when the towers were mostly non-op did give a pretty good approximation from what i've read.

Did the RN help spot them?

[CAP1]

Did the RN help spot them?

civilians

[oakranger]

Did the RN help spot them?

Little if at all. Brits had civilians as spotters to help the RAF on what is coming (alts, numbers ect.). It was primitive, but effective at best.

[MiloMorai]

but the spotters that they used when the towers were mostly non-op did give a pretty good approximation from what i've read.

Only one radar station was knocked out for a very short time.

Doesn't help the interceptors much when the enemy a/c are about to 'walk through the door'.

[CAP1]

Only one radar station was knocked out for a very short time.

Doesn't help the interceptors much when the enemy a/c are about to 'walk through the door'.

really? i thought i had read in the past, that pretty much all of them were down, thus the need for the spotters.....and i'm not trying to be a wise arse......i really didn't know that...

[oakranger]

Only one radar station was knocked out for a very short time.

Doesn't help the interceptors much when the enemy a/c are about to 'walk through the door'.

really? i thought i had read in the past, that pretty much all of them were down, thus the need for the spotters.....and i'm not trying to be a wise arse......i really didn't know that...

MiloMorai, where are you getting your info?  Most of Brits radar station where put out of action and lettle was done to bring them back to operation.  So, Brits formed the British Observer corps.  Germans really had no idea of the B.O.C. was the "eye's" for RAF.