Author Topic: Dewoitine D.520  (Read 110070 times)

Offline Noir

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Re: Dewoitine D.520
« Reply #135 on: April 13, 2012, 11:02:08 AM »
don't underestimate french engineering :P
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Offline nrshida

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Re: Dewoitine D.520
« Reply #136 on: April 13, 2012, 11:15:57 AM »
I wouldn't dare! I like the Citroen C6  :banana:
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Offline Letalis

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Re: Dewoitine D.520
« Reply #137 on: April 14, 2012, 12:28:05 AM »
Poor French ace, switched to the P-39 and American engineering killed him  :angel:

+1 for the De.520 and as an aside, with all the pretty pictures and graphs this should be the new standard for an aircraft request threads :rock
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Offline TwinBoom

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Re: Dewoitine D.520
« Reply #138 on: June 09, 2012, 09:29:47 AM »







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Offline TwinBoom

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Re: Dewoitine D.520
« Reply #139 on: June 12, 2012, 04:45:37 PM »
Specific Matchup Comments:



D520 vs Bf109E:  This is the most common matchup, because once the Bf109F comes out, the H81 is usually available as well.  You have several disadvantages vs the Bf109E, and two advantages.  The disadvantages are speed and climb, while your advantages are high speed rolling capability and turning ability.  It is best to engage 109s with an altitude advantage, and failing that, get into a turnfight with them. If the 109 turns with you, smile, as you'll soon get on his six.  Keep in mind that your rolling advantage applies to high-speed flight only, once slow, the 109E can roll just as good as you.

D520 vs Bf109F:  The F model made the 109 much more dangerous.  Now the plane has plenty of cannon ammo, climbs faster, flies a whopping 70kph faster on the deck, and turns better than the 109E.  Use anti-109 tactics mentioned above, but be more careful, as the 109F can easily stick his nose in the sky and yoyo you to death.

D520 vs Fw190a5: Be very careful with this plane.  It has a 115kph speed advantage over you on the deck, outclimbs you by a large margin under 3km, and can dive like a brick.  Try to keep your fights above 3km, better yet, try not to fight these beasts at all. However, if you find a 190 down low and slow, smile, as the pilot probably doesn't know what he's doing, and will soon end up as a kill sticker on the side of your plane.

The D.520 remained in use after the Armistice. The German armistice commission allowed the Vichy air force to use the D.520 in Africa. The Germans even placed an order for 550 D.520s themselves (349 were produced between August 1941 and December 1942), using them as training aircraft. Some of these aircraft were sent to equip Vichy squadrons in Syria, where they saw action against the Allies in the summer of 1941. In this campaign the D.520 claimed 30 victories for the loss of 32 D.520s.

The D.520 had one last chance to fight the Germans after the Allied invasion of southern France in August 1944. Within days of the Allied landing the French Forces of the Interior formed a fighter group (Premier Groupe de Chasse FFI) which fought alongside the allies in southern France, using D.520s recaptured from the Germans, before being absorbed into the re-formed French Air Force on 1 December 1944. This fighter group used the D.520 from August 1944 to March 1945. By now the D.520 was effectively obsolete, but the Luftwaffe had been swept from the skies of southern France by Allied air power, and so the D.520 was able to play a role in the mopping up operations in south west France.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2012, 04:49:06 PM by TwinBoom »
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Offline Butcher

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Re: Dewoitine D.520
« Reply #140 on: June 12, 2012, 04:49:07 PM »
I'd vote on the D.520 over anything else right now.
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Offline Debrody

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Re: Dewoitine D.520
« Reply #141 on: June 12, 2012, 04:51:14 PM »
There is nothing i can bring up against this aircraft.  :aok
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Offline Butcher

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Re: Dewoitine D.520
« Reply #142 on: June 12, 2012, 04:55:06 PM »
There is nothing i can bring up against this aircraft.  :aok

How can ya? Its such a beautiful looking airplane that simply did not get enough credit - I hear more about "spitfires over france" then I do D.520.

While most of france surrendered, this plane and its pilot continued to fight (bad joke I know).
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Offline TwinBoom

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Re: Dewoitine D.520
« Reply #143 on: June 12, 2012, 05:02:17 PM »
How can ya? Its such a beautiful looking airplane that simply did not get enough credit - I hear more about "spitfires over france" then I do D.520.

While most of france surrendered, this plane and its pilot continued to fight (bad joke I know).





« Last Edit: June 12, 2012, 05:06:01 PM by TwinBoom »
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Offline TwinBoom

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Re: Dewoitine D.520
« Reply #144 on: June 12, 2012, 05:09:40 PM »
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Offline Babalonian

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Re: Dewoitine D.520
« Reply #145 on: June 12, 2012, 05:13:53 PM »
+1 to this idea, but if you comlpained about the Dora and it's glass radiator....  ~50% of fuselage hits may result in an oil hit and/or radiator hit, and the pilot wounds from the rear I think will be brutal.
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Offline TwinBoom

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Re: Dewoitine D.520
« Reply #146 on: June 12, 2012, 05:39:33 PM »
+1 to this idea, but if you comlpained about the Dora and it's glass radiator....  ~50% of fuselage hits may result in an oil hit and/or radiator hit, and the pilot wounds from the rear I think will be brutal.

Its fairly small and nimble though
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Offline Babalonian

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Re: Dewoitine D.520
« Reply #147 on: June 12, 2012, 06:34:38 PM »
Its fairly small and nimble though

An advantage, for sure... but so's a Storch.
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Offline Butcher

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Re: Dewoitine D.520
« Reply #148 on: June 12, 2012, 06:52:25 PM »
An advantage, for sure... but so's a Storch.

Its one reason I fly the Yak 9 so much, it seems to be nearly impossible to hit unless you get a lucky HO shot on it.
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Offline Krusty

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Re: Dewoitine D.520
« Reply #149 on: June 12, 2012, 07:19:20 PM »
There's plenty negative to comment about it.


First of all, it arrived too late to play a real part of the Battle of France. It's role as a low-tier German capture plane was minimal. It did see some use in the deserts of Africa, but so did so many other planes that it is still a minority. It's role as a Free French plane was merely a footnote in history. Overall it would only fit in a Afrika Corps setting, where other planes (Italians/Germans) would be far more important.

People like to latch onto it as an example of French aviation, but let's be honest -- the Moraine Saulnier M.S. 406 was the front line fighter for the French, along with lend-lease Hawks and the like. If you want what the French had -- The M.S. 406 is key. The 520 wasn't even satisfactory enough for combat until April 1940 -- 1 month before German invaded. They had only 75 accepted at the time, the rest sent back for retrofitting of improvements because they were unsatisfactory. That means that only one group with 36 planes was operational to meet the Germans in the air. They scrambled to re-equip 4 more groups in the short span before France surrendered at the beginning of June, 1940. As far as the fighting goes, I'm not going to pretend it didn't see any -- but it was a very small minority of the main fighter force of France.

It's about as representative as the Ta-152C is to the Fw190 line. Nice to have? Maybe... But not representative nor very important as far as history goes. It's like the Meteor: People focus on it because it was the most advanced of its time (regardless of what actual impact it had on the war).

As far as all the claims that this was such a perfect fighter? It wasn't. quite...

A quick and dirty copy/paste:

Quote
Although employing a modern design philosophy for its time, the D.520 was considered more difficult to fly than the older MS.406. Capt. Eric Brown, commanding officer of the Royal Aircraft Establishment's Captured Enemy Aircraft Flight, tested the D.520 at RAE Farnborough, saying that “It was a nasty little brute. Looked beautiful but didn’t fly beautifully. Once you get it on the ground, I was told not to leave the controls until it was in the hangar and the engine stopped. You could be taxiing toward the hangar and sit back when suddenly it would go in a right angle."

...

In comparative trials on 21 April 1940 at CEMA at Orleans-Bricy against a captured Bf 109E-3, the German aircraft had a 32 km/h (20 mph) speed advantage owing to its more powerful engine. However, the D.520 had superior maneuverability, matching its turning circle, although displaying nasty characteristics when departing and spinning out of the turn repeatedly during the tests. The Bf 109, owing to its slats, could easily sustain the turn on the edge of a stall.

There's also commentary that the fuselage fuel tank was exactly at the center of gravity so it made little difference how much fuel was in there, but the wing tanks would throw it into highly unstable flight characteristics.


Alternative suggestions I'd make instead (not before) the D.520:
Batle of France era:
M.s. 405
P-36 or Hawk export variant
C.200
Cr.42 (even so obsolete and being phased out before this time)
Gloster Gladiator
Hurr Mk.I (early model with 2 blade prop)

Afrika Corps era:
Hs 123
bf110C-6 and/or bf110e-1
bf109e7 (trop)
ju-52 (played a big part)
sm.79



All of those were vastly more important in the same time frames and the same theaters as the D.520 was. It's like wanting the F.22 -- best of the best, but very little use and in small numbers.