Author Topic: Final Round of the plane vote  (Read 8831 times)

Offline BoilerDown

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Re: Final Round of the plane vote
« Reply #105 on: October 27, 2011, 04:06:41 PM »
voting Yak in hopes that we get the 9U and 9T remodeled with it.  :pray

Yup.
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Offline moot

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Re: Final Round of the plane vote
« Reply #106 on: October 27, 2011, 05:59:54 PM »
allright!

which one now?
...
or

ME 410


Armament

 Guns:
 2 × 7.92 mm (.312 in) MG 17 machine guns with 1,000 rpg, firing forward
 4 × 20 mm MG 151/20 cannons with 350 rpg, firing forward
 2 × 13 mm (.51 in) MG 131 machine guns with 500 rpg, each firing rearward from FDSL 131/1B remote-operated turret, one per side
 
Bombs: up to 1,000 kg (2,204 lb) of disposable stores

That's not nearly everything it used.  Dont have time to write it up..
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Offline Volron

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Re: Final Round of the plane vote
« Reply #107 on: October 27, 2011, 06:57:43 PM »
Yeah.  He forgot to mention that the 410 could also be equipped with a 50mm gun, depending on which version we get. :D
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Offline PR3D4TOR

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Re: Final Round of the plane vote
« Reply #108 on: October 27, 2011, 07:20:28 PM »
The 410 had an insane amount of factory and field modifications. It will be quite a challenge for HiTech and Co. to sort them all out.
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Offline STXAce8

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Re: Final Round of the plane vote
« Reply #109 on: October 27, 2011, 07:44:20 PM »
The 410 had an insane amount of factory and field modifications. It will be quite a challenge for HiTech and Co. to sort them all out.
I guess this just means we got lots of planes with big black crosses on the sides!  :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana:
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Offline Krusty

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Re: Final Round of the plane vote
« Reply #110 on: October 27, 2011, 08:39:36 PM »
Outboard of the engines the 410 could carry drop tanks (not so common, mostly long-range escorts up north, escorting Condors and such) or twin WGR21 pods like the 110G has.

Along the belly it could mount 4 external racks for 4x 50kg bombs, left and right of the bomb bay. It could alternatively mount a 2x 20mm gunpod similar to those found on some FW190As, like the 110G gunpod but more curvy.

In the bomb bay it could mount a number of things....

8x 50kg bombs
1x or 2x 250kg
1x or 2x 500kg
1x or 2x 1000kg (special small-casings to fit in internal bay and let the doors close) more commonly just 1

2x20mm internal gunpod
2x30mm Mk103 gunpod
4x20mm internal gunpod
1xBK50 50mm cannon internal gunpod

They could and were used in combination, so you would see the 2x20mm internal gunpod mounted with the 2x20mm gunpod externally, adding 4 extra guns.

There were a number of options for the basic loadout as well.

the A had 2x20mm and 2x 7mm (plus tail guns)
The B had 2x20mm and 2x 13mm (plus tail guns)
Some removed the MGs when mounting big guns packs like the BK5, so there's the option of cannons-only defaults
Some rarer still (but still an option) removed the tail guns themselves along with the rear gunner to save weight -- not common but still an option.


You can see the dizzying possibilities.



[edit: that's all off the top of my head. Forgive any mistakes, it's just a primer of sorts]

Offline PR3D4TOR

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Re: Final Round of the plane vote
« Reply #111 on: October 28, 2011, 04:25:05 AM »
And those aren't even half of them. Loadout options in addition to standard armament:

ME-410-A.Empty
ME-410-A.U2 A-1/U2: 2xMG151/20
ME-410-A.8x50SC 8x SC 50
ME-410-A.1x250SC 1x SC 250
ME-410-A.2x250SC 2x SC 250
ME-410-A.1x500SC 1x SC 500
ME-410-A.2x500SC 2x SC 500
ME-410-A.1x250AB 1x AB 250
ME-410-A.2x250AB 2x AB 250
ME-410-A.1x500AB 1x AB 500
ME-410-A.2x500AB 2x AB 500
ME-410-A.12x50SC 8x SC 50 + 4x SC 50
ME-410-A.2X250SC4x50SC 2x SC 250 + 4x SC 50
ME-410-A.1X500SC4x50SC 1x SC 500 + 4x SC 50
ME-410-A.A2 A-2 Default
ME-410-A.A2U4 A-2/U4: 1x BK5

ME-410-B.Empty
ME-410-B.U2 U2: 2xMG151/20 (B-2)
ME-410-B.U4 U4: 1xBK5
ME-410-B.R2 R2: 2xMK108
ME-410-B.R3 R3: 2xMK103
ME-410-B.R4 R4: 2xMG151 Gunpod
ME-410-B.R5 R5: 4xMG151
ME-410-B.R4U2 U2R4: 2xMG151+2xMG151 Gunpod
ME-410-B.U4R4 U4R4: 1xBK5+2xMG151 Gunpod
ME-410-B.R2R4 R2R4: 2xMK108+2xMG151 Gunpod
ME-410-B.R3R4 R3R4: 2xMK103+2xMG151 Gunpod
ME-410-B.R4R5 R4R5: 2xMG151Gunpod+4xMG151
ME-410-B.M5 M5: 6x Wfr.Gr.21
ME-410-B.U2M5 U2M5: 2xMG151+6xWfr.Gr.21
ME-410-B.U4M5 U4M5: 1xBK5+6xWfr.Gr.21
ME-410-B.R2M5 R2M5: 2xMK108+6xWfr.Gr.21
ME-410-B.R3M5 R3M5: 2xMK103+6xWfr.Gr.21
ME-410-B.R5M5 R5M5: 4xMG151+6xWfr.Gr.21
ME-410-B.U2R4M5 U2R4M5: 2x2MG151+6xWfr.Gr.21
ME-410-B.U4R4M5 U4R4M5: 1xBK5+2xMG151+WGr.
ME-410-B.R2R4M5 R2R4M5: 2xMK108+2xMG151+WGr.
ME-410-B.R3R4M5 R3R4M5: 2xMK103+2xMG151+WGr.
ME-410-B.R34x50SC R3: 2xMK103+4xSC 50
ME-410-B.8x50SC 8x SC 50
ME-410-B.1x250SC 1x SC 250
ME-410-B.2x250SC 2x SC 250
ME-410-B.1x500SC 1x SC 500
ME-410-B.2x500SC 2x SC 500
ME-410-B.1x250AB 1x AB 250
ME-410-B.2x250AB 2x AB 250
ME-410-B.1x500AB 1x AB 500
ME-410-B.2x500AB 2x AB 500
ME-410-B.12x50SC 8x SC 50 + 4x SC 50
ME-410-B.2X250SC4x50SC 2x SC 250 + 4x SC 50
ME-410-B.1X500SC4x50SC 1x SC 500 + 4x SC 50
ME-410-B.TORPEDO B5 Standard: 1x Torpedo


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Offline moot

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Re: Final Round of the plane vote
« Reply #112 on: October 28, 2011, 05:43:22 AM »
What's the source for that list?
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Offline PR3D4TOR

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Re: Final Round of the plane vote
« Reply #113 on: October 28, 2011, 05:45:26 AM »
It's the loadout options from Il2FB.
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Offline moot

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Re: Final Round of the plane vote
« Reply #114 on: October 28, 2011, 05:53:11 AM »
So you don't have a source.  Loadouts like the MK 108 and torpedo sound like the same fantasy loadouts that half the 410 books repeat without any real evidence.  The RLM meeting notes never mention the 108 as being fielded.  Only considered - some reports of field crews bootstrapping em into the bomb bay.  The nearest hard evidence for 108 loadout comes from Messerschmitt documents a few months before the 410 is cancelled, with the 108 package given as "in development".

Also the naming scheme is probably wrong.  Do I sound anal about this?  I am but it's because this thing is a mess.  IIRC the naming system for the 410 is different from the one used e.g. for the 190.  Meaning you have these /Rx things that don't stand for what you'd expect if you just went based on what it meant for other planes. 
« Last Edit: October 28, 2011, 05:56:33 AM by moot »
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Offline PR3D4TOR

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Re: Final Round of the plane vote
« Reply #115 on: October 28, 2011, 06:17:22 AM »
Like I said it's going to be quite the challenge for HiTech and Co. to sort it all out. Even if you remove half of the options available in Il2FB it's still a lot.
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Offline mthrockmor

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Re: Final Round of the plane vote
« Reply #116 on: October 28, 2011, 06:33:34 AM »
There seems to be as much diversity with various 410 configurations as there is with 109 and 190 models. When the 410B wins ( :rock) we will have three or four different gun package options. A couple options in the nose and two or three options in the gun/bomb bay. For the gun/bomb bay I see a 4x20mm package; 2x30mm package; or 1x50mm. On the wings you get options for the 210mm rockets or 50kg bombs.

Pretty simple.

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Offline Krusty

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Re: Final Round of the plane vote
« Reply #117 on: October 28, 2011, 08:45:23 AM »
Like I mentioned in another post the IL2 mod is totally subjective. When pointed out that their loadouts were inaccurate, the response was "so? It's fun" or something along those lines.

Also, it may LOOK like there's a lot more, but this is due to the ubisoft single-dropbox loadout menu. You see a different combo for 50kg, for guns, and for both 50kg and guns.

You'll note a lot of what you listed is a combination of stuff I outlined in my previous post (scroll up!).


I also don't hold much credibility in their naming conventions. I think they're applying a standard that's an after-the-fact designation. A standard taken from inaccurate source or just from bad info.
« Last Edit: October 28, 2011, 08:47:00 AM by Krusty »

Offline Grundle1

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Re: Final Round of the plane vote
« Reply #118 on: October 28, 2011, 09:54:34 AM »
I bet HTC is hoping for the Yak3 - 10 minutes then go drink a beer over the Me410 - hundreds of hours and headaches - maybe don't see your family for a couple of months.

Some of those loadout options look scary -  6 A2A rockets plus 2 x Mk103s or 6 rockets plus 4 x MG151s - in addition to the standard armament of a pair of MG151s and a pair of MGs firing forwards and a pair of MGs firing backwards.  That's before we even get to the 50mm frickin' cannon.   I bet weight is a huge issue.   A loaded up Me410 will probably fly like a battleship with wings.

Offline Krusty

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Re: Final Round of the plane vote
« Reply #119 on: October 28, 2011, 10:18:34 AM »
More like a heavy 110G. You know how you load it up with full fuel, DTs, ords, etc, and it's sluggish? I'd expect the same difference.

Also, as mentioned the Ubisoft listings are not to be read at face value. They didn't carry 6x WGR21s, just 4.