PBY Idea

[Jayhawk]

I think the PBY would be used if it could carry troops.  Having the ability to land on the water outside of a base instead of trying to circle in a 47 or land somewhere else will be a big advantage for some.

However, since they weren't really used as a troop transport, it would be hard to justify that use.

[gyrene81]

stuka was faster than the pby-5a in level flight (255mph vs 196mph)...it could also dive at a steeper angle than the pby-5a...fully loaded climb rate was close. stuka has combat versatility.

Well, the PBY can carry two American torps. Might I remind you, that's the two big 2000 lb torps we have... you get 6 or 8 PBYs, you can completely wreck a TG.

you might want to research the f5b torpedo. the ju-88 carries 2 of them and even though it's faster at sea level than the pby, they don't survive a lot of torpedo runs.

historically the pby-5a was less significant to the u.s. war effort than the dewoitine d.520 was to the french war effort...and less effective than the fairey fulmar.

[Ack-Ack]

historically the pby-5a was less significant to the u.s. war effort than the dewoitine d.520 was to the french war effort...and less effective than the fairey fulmar.

That is an incorrect statement, the PBY-5 was a very important plane for US forces in the Pacific all throughout the war.  To say otherwise is to belittle its contributions in the SWPA and other Pacific areas of operations where the PBY-5 was critical to the war effort.  But the key thing people seem to forget about the PBY-5 was that it was most effective at night, which is what made it successful as a maritime bomber terrorizing Japanese shipping all throughout the Pacific region.  In the daytime, it was basically delegated to scouting and SAR efforts and PBY units were regularly rotated between tours doing scouting/SAR and anti-shipping/interdiction/harassment bombing.

To say that the PBY was just as effective as the Fulmar just shows you really don't know diddly squat about the PBY or what it did during the war.  If you would like, I could point you in the direction of some really good PBY books you can read that will show just how effective it truly was. 

ack-ack

[gyrene81]

That is an incorrect statement, the PBY-5 was a very important plane for US forces in the Pacific all throughout the war.  To say otherwise is to belittle its contributions in the SWPA and other Pacific areas of operations where the PBY-5 was critical to the war effort.  But the key thing people seem to forget about the PBY-5 was that it was most effective at night, which is what made it successful as a maritime bomber terrorizing Japanese shipping all throughout the Pacific region.  In the daytime, it was basically delegated to scouting and SAR efforts and PBY units were regularly rotated between tours doing scouting/SAR and anti-shipping/interdiction/harassment bombing.

To say that the PBY was just as effective as the Fulmar just shows you really don't know diddly squat about the PBY or what it did during the war.  If you would like, I could point you in the direction of some really good PBY books you can read that will show just how effective it truly was.  

ack-ack

point all you want ack ack...sounds like you don't know much about the achievements of the fairey fulmar. the pby did not play a significant role anywhere except the pto. pt boats had just as much of an impact on operations in the pto as the pby, as did b-25s, f4us and f6fs.

some, not all of the pby crews had some outstanding achievements, but to associate those achievements with all of the squadrons who operated pby's in theater is ludicrous.

[Baumer]

The PBY played a significant role over both the Atlantic and the Pacific oceans.

I just ran a quick count from the USN aircraft location reports for 5 SEP 44.

There were 329 PBY's deployed in combat areas in the Pacific. This is not counting planes in CASU, training, units or units that are preparing to deploy.

There were 173 PBY's deployed in combat areas in the Atlantic/Mediterranean. This is not counting planes in CASU, training, units or units that are preparing to deploy.

PBY's played a vital role providing Convoy Patrol, ASW, and SAR in many theaters, to dismiss the Atlantic and Mediterranean theaters is a disservice.

[gyrene81]

baumer, even you should know numbers deployed and operational numbers diverged significantly depending on when/where the aircraft were deployed to combat zones. and total numbers deployed was not equal to numbers in operation.

amazing how many aircraft provided "significant roles", when it's convenient for people to say so. the most signifcant roles the pby had in the pacific theater was night time anti-shipping against poorly armed cargo/transport ships and air-sea rescue operations. the iar80 had a significant role for the romanian airforce at one point. the russians considered the mig3 to have a significant role at one point. the british thought the fairey fulmar had a significant role. you don't see a lot of people arguing to have those aircraft added for many reasons.

try looking at reality for a bit, we're talking about toonville aces high, not reality. if there was a need to "rescue" cartoon pilots then aircraft like the pby would be useful in toonville. if there was actual night time, without the ability to manipulate the gamma settings, then aircraft like the pby would be very useful, as would other aircraft that were equipped with night flying equipment. but none of that exists in toonville aces high.

[STEELE]

It'll be fun to take off, land, and especially  destroy   +1

[guncrasher]

I think I give almost every plane in here a twirl now and then; rarely the spit or pony series, but other than that...  I enjoy flying what there is to be offered here, and would love a new addition.  I would also like a JU52 added.  Why should we be tied down and forced to fly C47s?

If your arguement is because another plane already fills that roll, then I guess HTC should just stop developing planes all together, because in the current setup every roll has already been filled.

Not everybody is in here to fly the bestest fastest most deadliestest armed aircraft... some of us get a kick out JU87 missions in Late War... OMG!  Waste of resources!  There's better ways to take down a field!  Why would anyone fly those?!?!  They're slow and defenseless!!!  They must be IDIOTS!  HiTech should probably take them out of the game.

Too much emphasis on drama on your part.  My thing is adding the pby is a waste of time that could better be used on adding other planes we wont use.


Semp

[Baumer]

I didn't say anything about it being useful in Aces High or that it should be added to "Toonville".  I was just stating that it did play a significant role in more than one theater and backing that up with deployment numbers.

[wil3ur]

Too much emphasis on drama on your part.  My thing is adding the pby is a waste of time that could better be used on adding other planes we wont use.


Semp

So again it comes down to if everyone won't fly the plane, then no one will...?  What praytell would be a 'usefull' expenditure of time in developing a plane that doesn't already have it's roll filled by a plane that's already in the game?

Just because you don't see everyone jumping out of the Pony and Spixteen to get into a P40 doesn't mean they aren't a very appreciated addition to the game, and it doesn't mean that people who want to fly them won't.  Just because it doesn't fit well in the MA doesn't mean it wouldn't be a great addition for the other arenas...  and who's to say the game couldn't develop further because of it's implementation.

One thing that could be built into it as part of the model and not require changing the game model while adding something to the game would be to have it's door open flush with the ground/water with a ramp.  Then your little downed pilot could run up the ramp and sit inside and the PBY could fly it back to the base.  Now when the pilot exits out of the flight, rather than being 'captured' in enemy territory, he has now "Bailed Successfully".  It'll take longer, but lets say you lost a 262... you'll save some of the perks you lost by getting someone to come pick you up.  This could even be translated into Scenario and FSO play...  all without having to change the coding of the game.

Did you have an emotional experience with a PBY as a child, or are you just that arrogant that you will not accept any additions to the game that you yourself wouldn't use exclusively?  I'm really trying to understand why you feel the way you do in regards to a great suggestion.

see the last planes that have been added that "everybody" wanted and very few people fly.

-1

[MachFly]

What is it about the PBY that makes so many of us like it so much? 

I'd love to own one and turn it into an RV?  I can't really come up with anything else.

Turn it into an RV? Those are completely opposite planes, it's like saying turn a Tiger into a Spitfire.

[wil3ur]

Turn it into an RV? Those are completely opposite planes, it's like saying turn a Tiger into a Spitfire.

I think he mean Recreational Vehicle...  You know... beds, kitchenette... a crapper.

[MachFly]

I think he mean Recreational Vehicle...  You know... beds, kitchenette... a crapper.

In that case I'm still confused, how are you going to turn a plane into a Bus? Especially in AH, what are you going to turn on AH before you go to bed, put the plane on the runway and pretend that your sleeping in it? 

[guncrasher]

So again it comes down to if everyone won't fly the plane, then no one will...?  What praytell would be a 'usefull' expenditure of time in developing a plane that doesn't already have it's roll filled by a plane that's already in the game?

Just because you don't see everyone jumping out of the Pony and Spixteen to get into a P40 doesn't mean they aren't a very appreciated addition to the game, and it doesn't mean that people who want to fly them won't.  Just because it doesn't fit well in the MA doesn't mean it wouldn't be a great addition for the other arenas...  and who's to say the game couldn't develop further because of it's implementation.

One thing that could be built into it as part of the model and not require changing the game model while adding something to the game would be to have it's door open flush with the ground/water with a ramp.  Then your little downed pilot could run up the ramp and sit inside and the PBY could fly it back to the base.  Now when the pilot exits out of the flight, rather than being 'captured' in enemy territory, he has now "Bailed Successfully".  It'll take longer, but lets say you lost a 262... you'll save some of the perks you lost by getting someone to come pick you up.  This could even be translated into Scenario and FSO play...  all without having to change the coding of the game.

Did you have an emotional experience with a PBY as a child, or are you just that arrogant that you will not accept any additions to the game that you yourself wouldn't use exclusively?  I'm really trying to understand why you feel the way you do in regards to a great suggestion.
 
-1

what does that come from?  you do realize that ah currently has no use for a pby.  none zilch, nothing , nada.  the thing about picking up pilots well it aint gonna happen in the near future as it has been discussed to death.  only reason I am against the pby is because it has no use in ah.  it cannot spawn from a port only because it only has  VH hangar.  if you wish to have an airplane spawn from a port perhaps you should wish for an airplane/bomber hangar first.

the pby had a good role in ww2 but no such role in ah exists now and you guys havent come up with a good use for it.  as for it being used in scenarios, you really think people are going to want to sit in the tower for hours while the pby goes looking for a cv that will most likely not find since the enemy fighters most likely will kill it before it finds anything.

you guys only saying you want it because you think it would be cool but in reality it will hardly be used as it really has no significant defensive armaments and seriously you think it will survive the ack to sink a cv even if it gets close to it?

semp

[Karnak]

you guys only saying you want it because you think it would be cool but in reality it will hardly be used as it really has no significant defensive armaments and seriously you think it will survive the ack to sink a cv even if it gets close to it?

semp

Done right, yes.  You can drop the torps from outside the CV's ack range.  The problem is the 185mph speed it does at best altitude, probably more like 150ish on the deck, that would make it very, very hard to reach torpedo range without being shot down by either a fighter or somebody in the 5" guns.


The H8K2 carried two torpedoes as well.  Just sayin'.