Author Topic: Components of fighter score...  (Read 8985 times)

Offline grizz441

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Re: Components of fighter score...
« Reply #150 on: November 30, 2011, 12:08:06 PM »
easiest way to game hit% is attack bombers

 :rofl

exactly

Or get really close... :noid

Offline ink

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Re: Components of fighter score...
« Reply #151 on: November 30, 2011, 12:20:22 PM »
Or get really close... :noid

in that case its usually my plane that does the hitting and not my rounds :rofl

Offline Vinkman

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Re: Components of fighter score...
« Reply #152 on: November 30, 2011, 12:48:38 PM »
Ground targets supply count as misses while in fighter mode. That why some people won't straf buildings

So what counts as a hit in fighter mode?  planes, vehicles, ships, anything else?  Can anyone confirm?
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Offline Lusche

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Re: Components of fighter score...
« Reply #153 on: November 30, 2011, 12:59:22 PM »
easiest way to game hit% is attack bombers


My hit % can attest to that!  :rock
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Offline grizz441

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Re: Components of fighter score...
« Reply #154 on: November 30, 2011, 01:47:32 PM »
in that case its usually my plane that does the hitting and not my rounds :rofl

Not dat close.  :bhead  :D

Offline Shane

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Re: Components of fighter score...
« Reply #155 on: November 30, 2011, 01:58:33 PM »
So what counts as a hit in fighter mode?  planes, vehicles, ships, anything else?  Can anyone confirm?

Just use Lusche's oracle (based on tour 141 data) and plug in yourr original tour nbrs, then play around with the various sub-categories to see what the effect *would* have been in Tour 141.

I did this, specifically for my gunnery % a few pages earlier in this thread:

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,324028.msg4234917.html#msg4234917 




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Offline Vinkman

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Re: Components of fighter score...
« Reply #156 on: November 30, 2011, 02:01:04 PM »
Just use Lusche's oracle (based on tour 141 data) and plug in yourr original tour nbrs, then play around with the various sub-categories to see what the effect *would* have been in Tour 141.

I did this, specifically for my gunnery % a few pages earlier in this thread:

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,324028.msg4234917.html#msg4234917 

(Image removed from quote.)



Yes I thought I suggested using the tool, but I must have forgot to add that to the post. But I guess I can't hit a shore battery and have it count as hits in fighter mode. has some one confirmed what counts in fighter mode?
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Offline Lusche

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Re: Components of fighter score...
« Reply #157 on: November 30, 2011, 02:17:49 PM »
Yes I thought I suggested using the tool, but I must have forgot to add that to the post. But I guess I can't hit a shore battery and have it count as hits in fighter mode.

If that were the case, 20% hit percentage would be barely average ;)

No, objects do not count. You need to hit planes. (Wheels up no requirement  :noid)
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Offline Vinkman

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Re: Components of fighter score...
« Reply #158 on: November 30, 2011, 02:29:40 PM »
If that were the case, 20% hit percentage would be barely average ;)

No, objects do not count. You need to hit planes. (Wheels up no requirement  :noid)

ok so it's much harder to "game it" which is good.  :aok
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Offline ink

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Re: Components of fighter score...
« Reply #159 on: November 30, 2011, 02:32:44 PM »
Not dat close.  :bhead  :D

 :rofl

the other day I dropped on an AFK badguy totally missed all shots and slammed into his plane, I fell away broken he kept flying straight...don't even think he knew what happened because he never moved and kept flying straight..... :rofl :rofl :rofl

Offline mtnman

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Re: Components of fighter score...
« Reply #160 on: November 30, 2011, 06:55:05 PM »
ok so it's much harder to "game it" which is good.  :aok

Like any other facet of any other rank, Hit% can be "gamed".  Of course!  It may be more difficult that some of the other components, but it certainly can be done...

And, like others mentioned, bombers are a good way to do that.  You need to shoot planes to have bullets counted as hits while scoring as a fighter, and since bombers are big, mostly helpless, and don't dodge much they make easy targets...  Beyond that, shooting them should also allow you to "game" your K/D, since once you learn the basics you should be able to shoot them down with little risk to yourself.  It's been 5+ years since I checked, but my personal K/D against bombers was in the 80/1 range (and that was because I counted C47's as bombers, since they had the most "kills" on me; it should have been higher than that).  Coupled with the 40%+ Hit% I was enjoying on them at that point (I wasn't as accurate on bombers as I am now) I could have had a nice K/D and a nice Hit% to go along with it.

Of course, that would have also lowered my K/T substantially, and probably my K/S unless I re-armed a lot (my F4U carries enough .50 rounds for 12+ fighter kills per hop, but I have trouble getting more than 4-5 bomber kills without running out of ammo).  Another option would be to NOT kill the bombers quickly, but instead "prolong the agony" by distributing your hits all over his plane (allowing for more hits on each bomber before it dies).

For the most part, it's difficult to "game" any one aspect of your rank without hurting another, but if someone really wants to do it... 

Other options less-often mentioned to "game" the various components of fighter rank are vulching (especially if you have a friend on another team or a second account), and bailing to avoid RTBing (fighting to the death accomplishes the same thing, but is seen as more "legitimate").  Or, you could carefully "select" which hops you wanted scored as fighter vs. attack.  Or fly with a wingman, squad, or horde (which will allow you to use the skill of others to "pad" your K/D, K/S, and K/T (they help keep you alive, and you spend less time flying back to the fight).  Of course, that'll help your points as well...  And the perks you earn will allow...  Ah, won't go there.  Regardless, someone is always willing to argue that all of those options are perfectly legitimate (and they probably are).

Keep in mind, I don't give a rats bahooty what my rank is, or your rank is, or how we compare.  So my Hit% is just that; my Hit%.  It tells me how many hits I get on my opponents...  As such, it's true value (to me) is a measure of my skill or improvement over time.  I have enough respect for myself that I won't try to "game" myself.

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Offline mtnman

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Re: Components of fighter score...
« Reply #161 on: November 30, 2011, 07:15:20 PM »
Only a guy selling something looks to the rate of change of blips in the noise floor and discribes them as 'significant changes'.  ;)  :salute

I will only buy that if he's killing 40% more planes with the 40% greater hit percentage. If he's not killing anymore planes, than it's proof that the 2% difference in actual percent, and hence the 40% relative comparison, are irrelevant.  

I wasn't going to respond to this originally, because I was pretty sure you were just trolling.  I honestly have trouble thinking that folks would argue that the "shooting" part of "shooting someone down" was over-rated.

It is significant, because it's a simple, basic comparison between the two numbers.  In the same manner, 10 is twice as many as 5.  It's even more significant because the overall Hit% of ANYONE in the MA is so pitifully low.  When it comes to low percentages like that, whole numbers often aren't really sufficient for measuring.  For example, we measure waste percentages in the hundredths of a percent, because we're measuring something that's only around 10% of the whole.  Small changes can have a large impact at that level.

As far as relevance, it would come down to several things before we could make a solid judgement on that.  Your method wouldn't necessarily work, because it doesn't take time into account.  Or targets (is one shooting bombers, while the other shoots fighters?).  Is one a lone-wolf, doing it all on his own, while the other has friends to protect him while he saddles up for an easy shot?

I also wouldn't take a one month performance as "gospel".  Are these two players still showing the same Hit% now, a few days later?  Were their 5% and 7%'s "flukes", or are they continuing to display this level of competence?

Lots of other factors to consider as well.  But for a simple, basic, comparison, one is definitely a 40% improvement over the other.  Ask your math teacher or someone who plays with statistics.  Be sure to include the information that these are just two data points of several thousand, and that the data points are primarily concentrated between 0 and 6% with limited outliers as high at 15-18%.  That 2% difference is quite significant in a situation like that, especially if it's used in a simple sequential ranking system.

Of course, if I wanted to "sell" a different idea I could argue that it was only a measly 2% higher than the other guy and has no real significance (and hope nobody saw that it was a 40% improvement over the other guy?).
« Last Edit: November 30, 2011, 07:25:21 PM by mtnman »
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Offline Vinkman

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Re: Components of fighter score...
« Reply #162 on: December 01, 2011, 12:31:12 PM »

I don;t find killing buff easy. They're tough and have lots of guns. I find killing a fighter 1v1 easier than killing a buff formation. If the buff doesn't kill me, It usually damages me enough that I'm not fighting anything else after I encounter them.

The K/D of B-17s is .40, and B-24s is .35, B-29 is .99, and Lancs is the lowest at .22.  But I think its artificially low due to the number of ditches and landed bandits because they fight right over the bandits base. I bet if you counted a damaged fighter that had to break off a buff attack as a kill, buffs would have K/D > 1.0

I find it a challenge. My new high speed approach to attacks has lead to a sharp decrease in getting shot up, but has also lead to a unsatisfactory increase in collisions!  :eek:
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Offline Lusche

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Re: Components of fighter score...
« Reply #163 on: December 01, 2011, 12:36:51 PM »
The K/D of B-17s is .40, and B-24s is .35, B-29 is .99, and Lancs is the lowest at .22.  But I think its artificially low due to the number of ditches and landed bandits because they fight right over the bandits base. I bet if you counted a damaged fighter that had to break off a buff attack as a kill, buffs would have K/D > 1.0


Apart from the B-29, this doesn't match my observations in the MA at all. Even with lots of fighters getting shot up due to their stupidity on the bombers 6 o'clock, the buffs still take much more than they dish out. And most of the time I see fighters going boom instead of a controlled descent & ditch anyway.
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Offline JUGgler

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Re: Components of fighter score...
« Reply #164 on: December 01, 2011, 12:49:34 PM »
Sniping with taters produces the best hit%, other than maybe vulching with a chog  :aok




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