Author Topic: Corner Speed Chart  (Read 2401 times)

Offline Drano

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Re: Corner Speed Chart
« Reply #15 on: February 03, 2012, 11:48:42 AM »
It's not a useful measurement for this game at all.

This oughta be a sticky. How many times does this get asked? Heck there's a post somewhere the last day or so somebody's asking for the corner for a Storch! Seriously? :rofl
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Offline FLS

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Re: Corner Speed Chart
« Reply #16 on: February 03, 2012, 12:31:24 PM »
I've seen this definition, it's engineering nomenclature ... And I'm sure it's valid for that purpose ... I'm not sure THAT is what the OP is about ... Pilot Jargon & Engineering Nomenclature aren't always mutually interchangable ... Now please go get me a can of prop wash from the toolroom. And Grab me a Left Handed Spanner Wrench too!
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I didn't think you'd learn anything. I just posted for the players that might read your post without realizing that you don't know what you're talking about.

Offline FLS

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Re: Corner Speed Chart
« Reply #17 on: February 03, 2012, 01:18:47 PM »
Corner speed ...  It's not a useful measurement for this game at all.

I wouldn't be surprised if 80% of the players in Aces High agree with you.   :devil

Offline hitech

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Re: Corner Speed Chart
« Reply #18 on: February 03, 2012, 02:13:49 PM »
Knowing corner speeds and how draggy a plane is , is very very very useful in a fight. Btw it is very simple to find the speed in AH.

Climb, start fast enough that you can black out, pull to tunnel vision, the speed when the plane stalls with you in tunnel vision is your corner speed.

HiTech

Offline Wiley

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Re: Corner Speed Chart
« Reply #19 on: February 03, 2012, 02:21:32 PM »
Climb, start fast enough that you can black out, pull to tunnel vision, the speed when the plane stalls with you in tunnel vision is your corner speed.

HiTech

I absolutely am not knowledgeable about such things beyond the vague notions I have gotten from online gaming/flight sims, but that doesn't sound right to me.  Is 'stalls' what you actually meant?

I had thought the way to check for it was to look at the speed indicator when you're at the lowest speed where you are still capable of pulling to blackout.

By the by, is the interesting part of corner speed TAS or IAS?  Looking at it logically, it would seem to me TAS would be what applies?

Wiley.
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Offline FLS

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Re: Corner Speed Chart
« Reply #20 on: February 03, 2012, 04:13:16 PM »
I absolutely am not knowledgeable about such things beyond the vague notions I have gotten from online gaming/flight sims, but that doesn't sound right to me.  Is 'stalls' what you actually meant?

I had thought the way to check for it was to look at the speed indicator when you're at the lowest speed where you are still capable of pulling to blackout.

By the by, is the interesting part of corner speed TAS or IAS?  Looking at it logically, it would seem to me TAS would be what applies?

Wiley.

Just 2 different ways to get to the same place Wiley. Pull to tunnel vision, listen for the stall buffet ( or wait for a wing to drop), look at the speed. Once you're pulling you'll slow down fast so film might make it easier to be accurate.  The lowest speed you can pull 6G is essentially the lowest speed you can fly at 6 G,  the stall horn is on to tell you you're at your lift limit, so that's why it's the same point.

Corner speed is IAS. It's like stalls, the amount of lift from air speed and AOA is affected by air density, so TAS varies and IAS remains the same.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2012, 04:24:22 PM by FLS »

Offline Wiley

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Re: Corner Speed Chart
« Reply #21 on: February 03, 2012, 04:21:47 PM »
Just 2 different ways to get to the same place Wiley. Pull to tunnel vision and listen for the stall horn.

Corner speed is IAS. It's like stalls, the amount of lift from air speed and AOA is affected by air density, so TAS varies and IAS remains the same.

Hmp.  Never noticed the stall going off when I was pulling that hard.  I pull that hard for that long so rarely, I just about never get my plane into that condition.

I would've thought the TAS would apply because at first glance it would seem to affect your G load, with it being how fast you're actually moving through space.  However, 'at a glance' reasoning rarely applies when you get into the technical end of this stuff. <g>

Thanks for the info.

Wiley.
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Offline FLS

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Re: Corner Speed Chart
« Reply #22 on: February 03, 2012, 04:27:20 PM »
If you're a little above corner speed you won't hear the stall horn because you don't need to be as close to your lift limit to pull 6 G as your speed increases.

Remember G load comes from lift not from speed. Speed just allows more load with less AOA.
« Last Edit: February 03, 2012, 04:29:58 PM by FLS »

Offline Darkdiz

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Re: Corner Speed Chart
« Reply #23 on: February 03, 2012, 04:41:08 PM »
Sweet  :devil  Looks like I opened a bit of a can 'o worms here.

From my experience with fast jets (I do military T&E), there is a certain speed, aerodynamically-defined, where you can SUSTAIN a turn while turning in the smallest radius.  For example, if a Spit is doing 350 kts and turns using max turn-rate performance, he will turn through a certain, aerodynamically-defined radius.  If he is doing 80 kts and turns, again using max turn-rate performance, he will also turn through a certain radius, and that radius will be significantly different,  likely significantly smaller, than that at 350 kts.  But at 80kts, he will likely stall, and so therefore not be able to SUSTAIN his turn.  However, at 350 kts (humour me and don't consider blackout as we are talking pure plane performance vice the carbon-based stick and rudder interface here), he will likely be able to sustain the turn.  However, he will likely bleed E, getting slower, and so his turn will likely tighten (radius will decrease).  Blackout would not likely be a problem at this speed.  At what point, assuming a sustained turn at max performance is maintained, does the turn radius STOP decreasing, and he turn is sustained (E-neutral)?  That point would be corner speed.

I realize it would be different for different configurations of any given aircraft, just as max speed and climb-rate is, but clearly there is a most efficient speed that a given aircraft turns at (I like the efficiency comment above).  All I was wondering was is there a document in AH (great sim btw HT) that has this info.  I suspect it would be a plot of speed vs altitude, similar to what is available for TAS and climb are.
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Offline FLS

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Re: Corner Speed Chart
« Reply #24 on: February 03, 2012, 04:48:01 PM »
You're confusing corner speed with best sustained turn speed.

Offline RTHolmes

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Re: Corner Speed Chart
« Reply #25 on: February 03, 2012, 04:49:27 PM »
At what point, assuming a sustained turn at max performance is maintained, does the turn radius STOP decreasing, and he turn is sustained (E-neutral)?  That point would be corner speed.

that point would be just above stall speed. it is not corner speed, which has been explained above.
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Offline FLS

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Re: Corner Speed Chart
« Reply #26 on: February 03, 2012, 04:58:11 PM »
that point would be just above stall speed. it is not corner speed, which has been explained above.

Just make sure it's at least your 2.5 G stall speed and not your 1 G stall speed.    :joystick:

Offline Darkdiz

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Re: Corner Speed Chart
« Reply #27 on: February 03, 2012, 05:21:20 PM »
Whatever it is called, is there a chart for it?  Or can we get one?
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Offline EVZ

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Re: Corner Speed Chart
« Reply #28 on: February 03, 2012, 06:59:23 PM »
No... he's right EVZ. It's not semantics. That's the definition of it. Even for pilots.
Gee-ze Lou-eezee guys ... Will you -READ THE OP- ...? Now MAYBE he used the WRONG WORD, but is this thread about what the OP asks or is it about hi-jacking it so everyone can show of their Engineering Dictionarys ... ? As previously noted ... There SEEMS TO BE SOME MISUNDERSTANDING taking place.
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Offline EVZ

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Re: Corner Speed Chart
« Reply #29 on: February 03, 2012, 07:09:57 PM »
Heck there's a post somewhere the last day or so somebody's asking for the corner for a Storch! Seriously? :rofl
Lot's of computer pilots use the term loosely to define an aircrafts BEST turning speed ... when you think about it ... this might be a nice thing to know when circling around in a storch looking for GVs ... don't you think ... ? It might be a nice thing to know when deciding which fighter you want to spend the next couple of months training in ... ? don't you think ...? It MIGHT BE a nice thing to have a comparison chart for AH aircraft ... ? seems like a reasonable request, once you're finished laughing at people for using a technical term descriptively.  ???
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