Snailman - K/D

[Wiley]

I think I got my K/D upto a few tours ago ...but boy was I bored .... although I enter into unfavorable situations it is always my intention to get home.... I just wish the red guys would understand that and let me play my way 

They do understand that.  They're trying to prevent you from getting home.   That's what makes it all the sweeter when you do with a few kills under your belt.

I'm very much a Jekyll and Hyde type player when it comes to K/D.  If I'm in the right mood, I'll fly fairly conservatively.  When I'm in that mode, I won't run from a 1v1 if I have ammo/fuel, but I will run from an enemy front that's headed my way unless I have alt on them.

I think I had my K/D up close to 8 one tour after a week or two of flying.  Yeah, I know it isn't much, but it was high for me.  Then I blew it all in a couple days because I got involved in a couple fights that required me to come down from my perch.  I was having fun all the way through though.

Wiley.

[Delirium]

Instead of flying fast aircraft, why don't you all decide to do the K/D 'race' in P40s and also bring the number of kills per hour into the equation. This way, aggression and skill is put into the equation instead of just SA and aim.

The thought of facing a bunch of people who used to fight like hellions who are now fighting like timid score monkeys doesn't seem like a whole lot of fun to me. Frankly, it is just enough encouragement to keep me off of Aces High for the next month.

[Lusche]

Instead of flying fast aircraft, why don't you all decide to do the K/D 'race' in P40s and also bring the number of kills per hour into the equation. This way, aggression and skill is put into the equation instead of just SA and aim.

As you can't determine kiss/hour for a single plane, one 'solution' would be using a similar format as my Top Players by Plane 2011 chart:

Proposal:

- We select one 'featured' plane.
- Only air to air kills do count, which means no bombing of vehicles.
- At the end of the tour, each pilot is ranked for a) K/(D+1) and b) absolute number of kills.
- Winner is the pilot with he lowest total rank.

This way getting a high K/D is important, but you also need a certain volume of kills. Just flying around extremely cautiosly for a whole tour wont get you to the top.

I would volunteer to do the administrative work... 

[Wiley]

As you can't determine kiss/hour for a single plane, one 'solution' would be using a similar format as my Top Players by Plane 2011 chart:

Proposal:

- We select one 'featured' plane.
- Only air to air kills do count, which means no bombing of vehicles.
- At the end of the tour, each pilot is ranked for a) K/(D+1) and b) absolute number of kills.
- Winner is the pilot with he lowest total rank.

This way getting a high K/D is important, but you also need a certain volume of kills. Just flying around extremely cautiosly for a whole tour wont get you to the top.

I would volunteer to do the administrative work... 

If I'm reading that right, might that approach be lacking a bit?  Might the absolute number of kills not be factored in?  Would perhaps just a straight up ranking of (K/(D+1))*K maybe make for a more exciting contest and a better metric?

It just seems to me basing it on relative rank makes it somehow easier to game.

Wiley.

[Lusche]

If I'm reading that right, might that approach be lacking a bit?  Might the absolute number of kills not be factored in?  Would perhaps just a straight up ranking of (K/(D+1))*K maybe make for a more exciting contest and a better metric?

Uhm... doesn't that formula (K/(D+1))*K  actually very much factor in the absolute number of kills?

[Wiley]

Uhm... doesn't that formula (K/(D+1))*K  actually very much factor in the absolute number of kills?

Ok, so that is what you're proposing then.  What I got out of your proposal was, rank them by K/D+1, then do a second ranking by number of kills, and take the total of those two relative rankings.

So if you were first among the contestants in K/D+1, and 5th in number of total kills, your ranking overall would be 6.

But, if you're doing the above, that sounds like a pretty good yardstick.  It rewards aggression and survival.

Wiley.

[Lusche]

Ok, so that is what you're proposing then.  What I got out of your proposal was, rank them by K/D+1, then do a second ranking by number of kills, and take the total of those two relative rankings.

So if you were first among the contestants in K/D+1, and 5th in number of total kills, your ranking overall would be 6.

That would be the same system our scoring is using in AH. Smallest total sum wins. It rewards agression (getting many kills) and survival (getting high K/D) at the same time, just with a different formula.

Let me prepare some numbers based on an actual example...

[Lusche]

This is based on the numbers for the C.205 for all of 2011. I took them and determined the top 10 list of pilots by using four different methods:





To me there, is at least no doubt that the pure K/D variant (#2) is the least meaningful of them all. Interestingly your variant (3), Wiley, is emphasiszing the raw number of kills more than my 'ranking' variant.

As I said before, the K-D method is the one I'm using internally a lot more lately to determine "arena impact".

[Wiley]

Simple K-D is one I hadn't thought of.  That's an interesting way of looking at it.  1 or 3 I think would make the most sense for a competition like this.  In an plane that can't run, like the 205 or 109G-6.

Wiley.

[Lusche]

Simple K-D is one I hadn't thought of.  

Took me a long time to think of that simple way, too  

Was conceived as a way to quantify actual arena impact of a given plane in a simple way, instead of interpreting 2D charts, following the thought that a fighter has more impact on the arena when it kills much more than it is being killed in absolute numbers. An impressive K/D alone doesn't mean anything if almost nobody is actually flying that plane, it has no big impact then.

One can argue the same goes for players. I'm more impressed by a pilot getting 150 kills to 100 deaths in a Spitfire I than by another one getting 7 kills to 0 deaths and then never flying that plane again, even though the latter one has a much better K/(D+1)

[katanaso]

you could have nosed down and ran...like 98% of 51 drivers....you stayed and fought and what a great fight it was

I always enjoy the 51 vs Ki-84 fight, much like a 51 vs Spit 16 fight.  I don't get why somebody would run from such a fun fight, where a true 1 v 1 was possible.  So whereas most others would've run, they would've missed out on some excellent turning and knife fighting on your part.  Win or lose, it's the fights like those that make the night.   

[mtnman]

I hate getting shot down. it may be more rooted in all my real world flying and flight training. losing even virtual airplanes goes against my grain and I prefer to land them in one piece even if they are just virtual planes. I guess it is a habbit.

every month I look forward to streaking till first death. it is a challenge that entertains me and I enjoy it. even after the streak ends I still hold more value to 5 kills landed over 10 kills and shot down.

k/t and hit% k/s etc never worried me much especially when streaking. all that matters is landing the kills when doing the kill and survive game.

as for the actual rank minigame within the game aces high I participate in the rank 1 competition every other tour or so. sometimes I do not care for the restrictions required to gain high rank such as flying only specific planes and hitting specific targets etc. sometimes it is more fun to fly bombers with tiny bomb loads and fly planes that have horrible dispersion shot gun effects that make high gunnery hit rates unlikely. flying slow obsolete planes that climb badly and hold little ammo don't help in gaining a high score so some tours it is more enjoyable to not even bother with the whole score system and enjoy the whole planeset/vehicleset.

even when flying the weak planes I still prefer to land them.


some people like the furball till dead gameplay style. I say thats great. whatever is fun for them. Ive tried both styles of flying and found I always felt like I messed up if I got cornered by many enemies even if I killed them all. baiting a high enemy is pretty much standard opperating procedure though regardless of flying style because there is always a higher enemy. unless its one of a handful of people the altitude and energy advantage can be neutralized easy enough.

If you like reading about ww2 combat read "the blond knight of germany". a book about hartmanns flying that explained how he came about the strategies he used to survive in the air. he called it head flying vs muscle flying. he did both but ussually the latter only when cornered.

Wow Fester!  Very similar interests/strategy/goals to mine. 

I really only have an interest in 1 or 2 planes in AH, so don't experiment much beyond that anymore, but I whole-heartedly agree with your statements.  Much better to land a few kills, than to die with a bunch.

[mthrockmor]

As you can't determine kiss/hour for a single plane, one 'solution' would be using a similar format as my Top Players by Plane 2011 chart:

Proposal:

- We select one 'featured' plane.
- Only air to air kills do count, which means no bombing of vehicles.
- At the end of the tour, each pilot is ranked for a) K/(D+1) and b) absolute number of kills.
- Winner is the pilot with he lowest total rank.

This way getting a high K/D is important, but you also need a certain volume of kills. Just flying around extremely cautiosly for a whole tour wont get you to the top.

I would volunteer to do the administrative work... 

I'll do this one as well. I like flying for purpose, as opposed to simply tool'n around looking to pick members of the 80th while they are on auto climb, getting a beer. It's dang near impossible to find'm this way but I keep trying!!

Boo

[Noir]

I always enjoy the 51 vs Ki-84 fight, much like a 51 vs Spit 16 fight.  I don't get why somebody would run from such a fun fight, where a true 1 v 1 was possible.  So whereas most others would've run, they would've missed out on some excellent turning and knife fighting on your part.  Win or lose, it's the fights like those that make the night.   

I don't know if dieing in 2 turns makes 'a night' because that's what will happen if the 16 or 84 half knows how to play...I prefer mixing with f4u's, 190's, k4's. Even if the matchup isn't easy I do have some cards to play,

[Debrody]

I prefer mixing with f4u's, 190's, k4's. Even if the matchup isn't easy I do have some cards to play,

i belive you if i see this once. Couse what i already seen from you, well, thats completely different.
No offense, but i would really like to fight against your pony in a 190 of your choice. Maybe that can happen once.