Armor / Damage Points for Aircraft

[guncrasher]

Sure, why not?  I don't particularly see it as making a huge difference, but I guess all information is useful in some way.  I wouldn't stop aiming for wingroots or engine/cockpits, but some people might.

The only problem I can see with releasing it is, if people start going over it with a fine tooth comb, it would more than likely turn into, 'Why does Plane X's tail have this many hit points while the Plane Y's has this many?!  I demand justification for every number on this table!  My favorite plane's numbers aren't the highest!  Conspiracy!!!'

You know it'd happen.  

Wiley.

exactly.  that's what it going to turn into.  there's people still arguing that some plane should be 200 lbs light due to blah, blah


semp

[bustr]

You guys can load up every plane in the offline drone circle then dismantel test them from behind at 100 yards on full zoom.

You can pick 4 or 5 aircraft whose guns are representative of .30, .50., 20mm, 30mm, and 37mm. Then single tap test what it takes to remove everything from the fuslage starting at the wing tips working in. Single tap test what it takes to get a fuel leak and to ignite it. Single tap test what it takes for an oil leak and so forth.

Ask Pervert about his 190D testing in a custom arena with a freind spawning it and he using a jeep to 50cal it to find out why it gets oil hits so easy.

I do this on occasion when I'm confused to why some planes just absorb damage like the Brewster, A6m's and Hurri's. Or what it takes to make the 190's burn. Or why B25H and A20 take forever to fall apart.

I've always wondered why the trainers aren't doing this kind of testing for every plane and handing out lists to everyone. Or why they don't have a cataloge for downloading of every custom gunsight anyone has ever offerd in this game since 1999.

But, the real question is why aren't you guys spending the weekend it would take to do it yourselves? Otherwise what you are asking Hitech for is his damage lookup list values and relationship to each mapped region on each aircraft so you don't have to do anything. You want an aimbot with this cookies and milk demand? 

[Pand]

You guys can load up every plane in the offline drone circle then dismantel test them from behind at 100 yards on full zoom.

You can pick 4 or 5 aircraft whose guns are representative of .30, .50., 20mm, 30mm, and 37mm. Then single tap test what it takes to remove everything from the fuslage starting at the wing tips working in. Single tap test what it takes to get a fuel leak and to ignite it. Single tap test what it takes for an oil leak and so forth.

Ask Pervert about his 190D testing in a custom arena with a freind spawning it and he using a jeep to 50cal it to find out why it gets oil hits so easy.

I do this on occasion when I'm confused to why some planes just absorb damage like the Brewster, A6m's and Hurri's. Or what it takes to make the 190's burn. Or why B25H and A20 take forever to fall apart.

I've always wondered why the trainers aren't doing this kind of testing for every plane and handing out lists to everyone. Or why they don't have a cataloge for downloading of every custom gunsight anyone has ever offerd in this game since 1999.

But, the real question is why aren't you guys spending the weekend it would take to do it yourselves? Otherwise what you are asking Hitech for is his damage lookup list values and relationship to each mapped region on each aircraft so you don't have to do anything. You want an aimbot with this cookies and milk demand?  

Because it's already coded into the game, and may be able to be extracted and shared (if HTC chooses to do so), potentially with minimum effort.  The alternate option you are suggesting could take days of testing and retesting, and results could still be inaccurate.  

Heck, why does HTC even share any information with us, we should all just have to 'figure it out', apparently.
http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/map.html#targets
http://trainers.hitechcreations.com/guns/guns.htm

Regarding people complaining about X and Y, they're already doing that about everything, adding more data for them to complain about I don't imagine would make that much difference.  If it's not one thing it's another.  Examples:
- 15 minutes is/isn't long enough for hangars to be down
- Plane Z isn't as fast as it should be.
- You didn't model the plane I voted for! You stink!

HTC still makes the rules and makes the decision, so I ask again, why are people against them sharing the decisions with us?

[RTHolmes]

-1

this information wasnt available to WWII fighter pilots, except maybe in the local pub if your squadron was lucky enough to have any experienced pilots left and you bought em a drink or 2 ...

[bustr]

I take it some of our players never took the famly Chevy's engine apart to see what made it go? Then had one weekend to put it back together befor Dad broke anything important you needed to play football that fall? Or financed college by rebuilding a 1950's light plane. Or made gunpowder substitiuting powdered sugar for charcoal to make fireworks. Or took the family TV apart without tagging the tubes. Or reload instead of buy new rounds.

And no one can create a visual offline test to reverse engineer the damage into tables either. It's no different than what you had to do pre Y2K to figure out how your company's old programs worked to get them certified for the clock change.

Hey Hitech,,,while you are at it giving away data. Can I get get some BBQ from Kreuz in Lockhart every time I logon to the game and when I pull the trigger all of my guns go "Piu, Piu' Piu" in the voice of the nice lady who say's "Check 6"?

[Kingpin]

-1

this information wasnt available to WWII fighter pilots, except maybe in the local pub if your squadron was lucky enough to have any experienced pilots left and you bought em a drink or 2 ...

Well, neither were enemy aircraft climb rate or speed charts.  Then again, I like your idea of having to buy HT a Cragganmore first.  $14.95 may get at least half a pour of the 21yo in a pub, though, should it not?

[FLS]

 I can see why the information would be interesting and useful but I think it would be a bad idea to release it. Flight sims are part magic and magic is more fun when you don't know the trick. I think we're better off without too much detail  about the necessary compromises between reality and playability. I'd also hate to see debates about the proper amount of hits for a/c A vs a/c B.

[RTHolmes]

those are rather different. speed/climbrate charts were available in all the period pilot notes Ive seen. when captured aircraft were available, speed/climbrate charts were also available.

Ive never seen a chart of exactly how many rounds in which exact location were required for different amounts of damage. although I'm certain that tests were done on friendly and captured equipment and tactical desicions were passed down to frontline pilots based on them (lw live-fire tests on captured US buffs springs to mind.)

the speed/climbrate charts were based on repeatable tests, quantitative, and widely distributed.

the data being asking for were almost entirely anecdotal, qualitative, and not widely distributed.

thats why I think it should stay anecdotal


edit:

I can see why the information would be interesting and useful but I think it would be a bad idea to release it etc.

agreed, a little mystery is a good thing, the game (like the real thing) should be more than just a number-crunching exercise

[Peyton]

think about it all that work to post it.  when will you use all that info and can you memorize it for every single airplane?  in addition you have to add the variables, in which case will be your aim and what bullets you are using. 

for example let's say the tail in x plane will come off if you put 30 .50 bullets into it.  are you really going to count the bullets?  is there a way to even see the amount of damage you are causing to an airplane and to which parts of an airplane you are actually hitting and how many rounds you are putting into it?




semp

Always a Nay Sayer in the group...............

[guncrasher]

Always a Nay Sayer in the group...............

actually there's a lot, I'm not the only one.

semp

[Pand]

Definition #1  -  NSFW

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=naysayer

[Lusche]

the speed/climbrate charts were based on repeatable tests, quantitative, and widely distributed.

the data being asking for were almost entirely anecdotal, qualitative, and not widely distributed.

thats why I think it should stay anecdotal

 

[Pand]

the speed/climbrate charts were based on repeatable tests, quantitative, and widely distributed.

the data being asking for were almost entirely anecdotal, qualitative, and not widely distributed.

thats why I think it should stay anecdotal

So you're saying this data should be removed/changed and the vehicle armor detail in the hangar should be removed as well?
http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/map.html#targets
http://trainers.hitechcreations.com/guns/guns.htm

[Wiley]

Definition #1  -  NSFW

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=naysayer

The power of accurate observation is often called cynicism by those who do not possess it.

Wiley.

[earl1937]

So you're saying this data should be removed/changed and the vehicle armor detail in the hangar should be removed as well?
http://www.hitechcreations.com/ahhelp/map.html#targets
http://trainers.hitechcreations.com/guns/guns.htm

Guys, Capt Pand has a very good point and is only trying to improve the game for all. While there was a certain amount of very useful information in the POH for each aircraft, the best method they had at the time was gun camera's. While the filming was not on the level of today's camcorders and etc, it did a good enough job to point out for inexperienced pilots where they should aim. Example, 8th Air Force escorting pilots quickly found out the ME-109 and FW-190 series of aircraft had very weak tail assembly at the point where it joined the fuseledge. The A6M series of Japanese aircraft would flame quickly by hitting a wing and etc. What Capt Pand is asking is, "Does it take 50 .50cal bullets to disable the tail Assembly on the German fighters? Does it take 10 rounds of .50 cal to flame a "Zeke"? Because of the "lag" effect of packets, he just doesn't want to waste any ammo than necessary to get the job done!!