T 34/85 GV ?

[WEZEL]

Howdy first let me say a big thanks for fixing the torque problem with the last update, that was a huge help.

Now for my question since the update it seems the HVAP and AP rounds got nerfed with the T34/85's, it now takes in most cases 2 rounds to kill and M3, M8 wirbs at less than 1k when they use to slice trough them like butter, side, front or rear hits it dont matter. Also I have been getting a bunch of Bounce hits or the round appears to go right trough  without any damage off regular tanks when hitting them on the side or rear at less than 500m, front hits seem to have less of an effect than they use to, 3 hits to turret another T34 or panther. I drive a Panther sometimes also and it has not changed in it stopping power, just the  T34 tanks. Any enlightenment on this will be a great help, thanks in advance.   

[bangsbox]

Your wrong lol nothing has changed

[WEZEL]

Your wrong lol nothing has changed

Must just be me then 

[Butcher]

Howdy first let me say a big thanks for fixing the torque problem with the last update, that was a huge help.

Now for my question since the update it seems the HVAP and AP rounds got nerfed with the T34/85's, it now takes in most cases 2 rounds to kill and M3, M8 wirbs at less than 1k when they use to slice trough them like butter, side, front or rear hits it dont matter. Also I have been getting a bunch of Bounce hits or the round appears to go right trough  without any damage off regular tanks when hitting them on the side or rear at less than 500m, front hits seem to have less of an effect than they use to, 3 hits to turret another T34 or panther. I drive a Panther sometimes also and it has not changed in it stopping power, just the  T34 tanks. Any enlightenment on this will be a great help, thanks in advance.   

Problem is the hit sprite you see isn't always a "Hit" you could of easily hit the tracks or completely missed the tank - thus being said you have to film EVERY sortie and watch it in slow motion.

The Closer the tank, the larger the hit sprite - it will appear as a kill shot which if you watch in slow motion it can show you exactly how far off you are - hitting the tracks or wheel will show a kill shot - but neither do any damage really.
Hitting a Panzer 4 H from the front - there's one section of armor that will always guarantee a deflection -

If you look right below the driver view port, the armor comes up on an angle - this will always be a deflection for most rounds whether its an 88mm or HVAP - I have no clue why but its just there, it will get frustrating you just have to learn to hit the hull or turret dead on.

I once had a guy complain that he hit a tank 15 times without a kill shot until I reviewed the film - one BIG problem is over 1.5k icons disappear for ground vehicles (or used to? I cant remember if they ever upgraded this) for these shots you simply have to track the shell, anyhow at 1.5k or so he hit a tank in the tracks 10 times,
each time he'd see a hit sprite and blame rubber bullets etc, film showed they were simply track hits and no serious damage was done.

[SmokinLoon]

Just a reminder on HVAP and AP damage in general:

First: HVAP rounds are LESS effective at AP ability beyond 1000 to 1200 yards. A player is wasting their time and ammo if they are shooting an enemy tank at distances further than HVAP effective ranges.  Use standard AP ammo for 1400 yards and further!

Second: I have no idea how HTC has modeled damage once the armor is defeated, but I get a lot of legit hit sprites within the effective range of HVAP rounds and in many cases the HVAP rounds does not destroy the enemy tank.  Case in point- once the projectile defeats the armor what it does to the tank mechanics (turret, engine, etc), or the crew seems to differ from tank to tank.  I do not seem to get that from the Panther's 75mm or the Tiger's 88mm at all.  So, there may just be a case of "good AP/sub-par damage".  One would thing the weight and/or kinetic energy of the projectile after penetration should be factored in to the equation just as the AP is.  I do not know, only HTC can really comment on that.     

[MK-84]

Howdy first let me say a big thanks for fixing the torque problem with the last update, that was a huge help.

Now for my question since the update it seems the HVAP and AP rounds got nerfed with the T34/85's, it now takes in most cases 2 rounds to kill and M3, M8 wirbs at less than 1k when they use to slice trough them like butter, side, front or rear hits it dont matter. Also I have been getting a bunch of Bounce hits or the round appears to go right trough  without any damage off regular tanks when hitting them on the side or rear at less than 500m, front hits seem to have less of an effect than they use to, 3 hits to turret another T34 or panther. I drive a Panther sometimes also and it has not changed in it stopping power, just the  T34 tanks. Any enlightenment on this will be a great help, thanks in advance.   

For some reason this never seems to come up so here I go

Any changes made to the game would be mentioned in the Update notes for each new version or patch.  Believe it or not, I am TOLD, that many players do not read these notes before posting comments about game changes.  Thats just unbelievable isn't it

Oh, and changes made to the game not requiring a patch would be listed in the message of the day.

[WEZEL]

Thanks for the replies, seem to be back to normal for me last night and today  It was just very odd that it took more hits than normal to kill something, might have been a sync thing on my end or just very bad delayed death on theirs lol

[BaldEagl]

Any changes made to the game would be mentioned in the Update notes for each new version or patch.  Believe it or not, I am TOLD, that many players do not read these notes before posting comments about game changes.  Thats just unbelievable isn't it

Oh, and changes made to the game not requiring a patch would be listed in the message of the day.

If a bug is introduced into the game through an update it won't be listed in the Update notes will it?  If HT knew about it my guess is they'd fix it before release even though there have been numerous changes throughout the years that were not listed in the Update notes.

Believe it or not, I am TOLD, that many players do not bother to post bug reports or chose to believe they don't exist.  Thats just unbelievable isn't it

[shermanjr]

tracks act like sponges fer rounds in here (more stuff to go thro) above the tracks and between wheels and all the stuff is easier to go thro i think

[Tank-Ace]

Problem is the hit sprite you see isn't always a "Hit" you could of easily hit the tracks or completely missed the tank - thus being said you have to film EVERY sortie and watch it in slow motion.

You've never adequately explained this. Do mean to say that the game is producing erroneous hit sprites?

[Butcher]

You've never adequately explained this. Do mean to say that the game is producing erroneous hit sprites?

No the game doesn't create erroneous hit sprites, but you have to watch the film viewer because for example aiming at the engine compartment on a T34 from the side - you have a very NARROW area to hit, you can get hit sprites all day with shells deflecting off the top part of the armor or track hits.

You need a dead hull hit to destroy the engine, then a second to kill the tank - however I've watched panther rounds bounce off the top part of the armor over the engine all day long, you simply have to watch the viewer really close to see it wasn't a hull hit.

Normally you'd aim for either the side of the turret or hull, but at distances of 2-3,000 yards a hit sprite can be anywhere on a tank, closer you are the more clear the hits can be.

[Tank-Ace]

No the game doesn't create erroneous hit sprites, but you have to watch the film viewer because for example aiming at the engine compartment on a T34 from the side - you have a very NARROW area to hit, you can get hit sprites all day with shells deflecting off the top part of the armor or track hits.

You need a dead hull hit to destroy the engine, then a second to kill the tank - however I've watched panther rounds bounce off the top part of the armor over the engine all day long, you simply have to watch the viewer really close to see it wasn't a hull hit.

So if you miss the tank entirely, you don't get a hit sprite, or do you? You've said both, and that simply can't be true. If you miss and get a hit sprite, then the hitsprite is erroneous, and that issue needs to be adressed. If you miss and don't get a hitsprite, then you don't get a hit sprite.


And I think you're using the term 'hitsprite' a bit too broadly. Since the game gives two different visualizations for armor penetration and a ricochet, the distinction needs to be made between the two.

[Butcher]

So if you miss the tank entirely, you don't get a hit sprite, or do you? You've said both, and that simply can't be true.

Not what I said, you are overly thinking what I am telling you. Its not complicated - if you miss the tank - there is no hit sprite. Depending where you actually hit the tank, determines the damage. You can get a hit sprite on the rear upper engine area of a T34 and it shows a hit sprite,
In fact the round deflect off which is extremely hard to see without the film viewer, aim to low and you hit the tracks which is another hit sprite.

At a distance of say...1500 meters, both will look like kill shots, instead the two hits are minimal. If you manage to hit the engine compartment you get the same hit sprites as before, except this time it should knock the engine out.

After you tank enough for 3,000+ kills in a GV you see patterns where to hit vehicles and where not too, it comes down to experience to learn these areas. If I wanted I can take a Panther and deflect rounds off a Panzer 4 all day long.

[Tank-Ace]

No, butcher, you've said that both:

1) you can get a hitsprite while entirely missing the tank

Problem is the hit sprite you see isn't always a "Hit" you could of easily hit the tracks or completely missed the tank - thus being said you have to film EVERY sortie and watch it in slow motion.

2) the game doesn't give erroneous hitsprites.

No the game doesn't create erroneous hit sprites,...

Asside from text formating, and paring the posts down to the relevent content, the above are unedited quotes from you, Butcher, on July 28 and August 3, respectively.



I'm taking what you've said at face value. If there is a misunderstanding, it is because you aren't clearly and effectively communicating your ideas.

[titanic3]

Tank-Ace...do you just roam the forums for Butcher's posts so you can start an argument with him somehow? Everyday? We need a cartoon for this...