Author Topic: One tough Russian built Helo Video - Takes Sam hit, flies off  (Read 1138 times)

Offline nrshida

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Re: One tough Russian built Helo Video - Takes Sam hit, flies off
« Reply #30 on: December 01, 2012, 03:54:44 AM »
As I have clearly demonstrated, this is no nitpicking, and those two examples were no Mi-24s. I've yet to see a real Mi-24 being blown apart in the air, and I am beginning to think that no such footage exists. Something spectacular would have to happen for a MANPADS missile to blow up a 26,000 lbs aircraft like the Hind. Even the less-than-half-as-big AH-64 Apache has survived missile hits again and again. In a few cases multiple hits from MANPADS' and flown home.

I'm a bit confused by your agenda GScholz. You are trying to assert that the Hind cannot be blown apart by a Stinger missile?

If that's your purpose I really don't see how it's relevant, those first two videos you posted show aircraft making very 'unscheduled landings' shall we say  :lol

Besides, lack of video footage doesn't support the 'for all' logical assertion.


This is thin, probably too thin for you, but if you apply your imagination look at 48 seconds into your video here:-


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJaZtAYM9KU
Another Afghanistan documentary showing a hit against what looks like a small target drone.

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Offline GScholz

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Re: One tough Russian built Helo Video - Takes Sam hit, flies off
« Reply #31 on: December 01, 2012, 10:25:57 AM »
I had no idea those were target drones, and those were the videos I referred to in the post where I said I was impressed on how tough the Mi24 was in the first video as I'd seen others of them exploding when impacted.

Yeah, one of the reasons I dislike Discovery channel type documentaries is their tendency to use inappropriate stock footage like this without telling the viewer.


I realize how tough they are, in fact I get time up close and personal with an Mi24 occasionally.  Nic Bicanic, the film maker who produced and directed Shadow Company, a documentary narrated by Gerard Butler that featured my company and some of the training courses we ran as well as our operations in Iraq and Afghanistan became a good friend of mine after following me around for weeks.  He also happens to own an Mi24, and can be seen flying it in the movie "Blood Diamond".  The only Russian made helos I would get to see up close in the mid-east were troop carriers like the Hip, but I've climbed all over and through his Mi24, and I always figured it would stop small arms as it was designed, but really surprises me with its resilience to explosive missile hits. 

You're making me quite envious... :)   I've seen plenty of Mi-24D/Vs up close at Split airbase as the Croatians flew them against the Bosnian Serbs, but I've never got to look inside one. About your friend's Hind... In the movie it is seen with an extensive upgrade of South African manufacture. Do you know if this was just temporary "product placement" or do your friend still have this upgrade? Where does he fly his Mi-24 "Superhind"? Neall Ellis, the merc who flew the Hind in Sierra Leone and for EO (the backdrop for Blood Diamond), flew/flies a pretty standard 24V:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BdsiZOE-5zY



I wonder how the Mi24's that were shot down by Aim120's and Aim9's fared by comparison to the Sa7 and Stinger impacts, when the warheads are much larger.  It wouldn't surprise me if the result was much the same, as there are lots of pictures of A10's that took SA-6 hits and still made it home, even in poor shape.  Like I said in the original post - one tough machine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KpBpzuDRt0A

That's a video of the Aim9x hitting an F4 drone.  The first sequence it looks like the F4 really doesn't suffer a whole lot of structural damage or loss, just fire, until it starts going out of control.  Is this typical of Aim9 hits?  It makes me wonder about even their lethality if large pieces aren't being chopped off or the target being blown up somewhat.

Survival against larger missiles like the AIM-9 and 120 is very unlikely. Even if the missile doesn't blow the aircraft physically apart it is much more likely to render it unflyable. These missiles have much larger warheads, and also more kinetic energy from their higher speeds. The smaller AIM-9 has a warhead three times the size of the Stinger's, and what, 8 times that of the Igla? That's some serious bang.

Fast jets tend to break apart after missile hits, not because of the explosive force of the missile, but because of aerodynamic forces over stressing the airframe after losing control.


---

Nrshida, you'll have to do better than that if you want to troll me. ;)
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Offline nrshida

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Re: One tough Russian built Helo Video - Takes Sam hit, flies off
« Reply #32 on: December 01, 2012, 12:16:11 PM »
I'm not trying to troll you, you seemed to be contradicting yourself and I'm trying to see your point.

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Offline GScholz

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Re: One tough Russian built Helo Video - Takes Sam hit, flies off
« Reply #33 on: December 01, 2012, 04:57:26 PM »
My point was that I wanted to see the claimed footage of Hinds being blown apart in the air if such footage existed. That would be an extraordinary sight in my opinion since I've never heard of something like that happening to an armored gunship before. Nothing more than that.
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."

Offline nrshida

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Re: One tough Russian built Helo Video - Takes Sam hit, flies off
« Reply #34 on: December 01, 2012, 05:31:24 PM »
That would be an extraordinary sight in my opinion since I've never heard of something like that happening to an armored gunship before. Nothing more than that.



"DeHeever approached to 500m from the Mi-24 in front and opened fire, hitting the tail boom and the rotor. The entire rear section of the Soviet helicopter was blown away and the fuselage spiralled straight into the ground".

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Offline GScholz

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Re: One tough Russian built Helo Video - Takes Sam hit, flies off
« Reply #35 on: December 01, 2012, 06:59:36 PM »
Yeah, twin DEFA 30 mm cannons will do that. So will the GAU-8 on the A-10. I've seen a few unfortunate Iraqi helos being strafed to oblivion by gunfire.
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Offline nrshida

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Re: One tough Russian built Helo Video - Takes Sam hit, flies off
« Reply #36 on: December 02, 2012, 05:36:57 AM »
 :lol
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Offline Wolfala

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Re: One tough Russian built Helo Video - Takes Sam hit, flies off
« Reply #37 on: December 02, 2012, 11:42:31 AM »
Yeah, twin DEFA 30 mm cannons will do that. So will the GAU-8 on the A-10. I've seen a few unfortunate Iraqi helos being strafed to oblivion by gunfire.

Hell werent there are a few helicopters which were  shot down by the gau8 during Desert Storm?


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Offline GScholz

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Re: One tough Russian built Helo Video - Takes Sam hit, flies off
« Reply #38 on: December 02, 2012, 08:24:36 PM »
Those were the ones I was thinking about. Saw an interview with an A-10 driver; he couldn't get a lock with his AIM-9s because of the hot desert background, so he spun up the gun and put about 300 rounds into the Iraqi helo. In his words: "There wasn't much left after that."
"With the first link, the chain is forged. The first speech censored, the first thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."