Author Topic: Any rumors about improving the terrain?  (Read 12513 times)

Offline Karnak

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Re: Any rumors about improving the terrain?
« Reply #120 on: June 07, 2013, 08:42:34 PM »
Both Il-2: Forgotten Battles and Lock On: Modern Air Combat were released in 2003.
Neither of which look better.  In particular I'll single out IL-2's terrain graphics as looking good from thousands of feet up, but utter crap on the deck.  The trick they did for "3D" trees is clever for minimal frame rate hits, but it looks terrible on the deck and would be entirely useless in a GV inclusive game.

Lockon's terrain graphics look about the same level as AH.  I don't know the view range on Lock On though.  I do agree that AH's terrain graphics are heavily dated.
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Offline Dragon Tamer

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Re: Any rumors about improving the terrain?
« Reply #121 on: June 07, 2013, 10:54:37 PM »
I think there are a lot of little things HTC can do to make the game look better. Update the sprite models, maybe add a small amount of randomness to it. Seeing the same gun flash animation over and over can loose it's luster. Make a new sprite for when anything explosive hits the water.

Shadows for planes being cast on the ground could look better if the shadow became larger and fainter as the plane increased in alt. Clouds could also cast shadows on the ground. As far as I can tell, the clouds don't move so that could remove the dynamic calculation that goes with that.

The buildings, when barns and houses are on hills why are they always crooked? Either take them off the hill or have the terrain editor provide a level surface for the building to sit on.

On the note of the more advanced graphics;

The current detailed water (detailed terrain and water together) lacks a lot of luster. I think the look of the water when the detailed terrain is on (detailed water off) would look better if it was given a level of specular mapping. Adding flickers of light over the surface of the water to mimic sunlight would be look amazing as well. I suspect that would be quite a hit to frame rates though, even on better systems.

Making the sky change color as the sun sets would be a major improvement IMO. As of right now I can't tell if the lighting model is correct or if the contrast between the sky and darkened ground is too sharp. I think changing the color of the sky as the sun is setting or rising could help make tanking at dawn or dusk easier on the eyes.

Just my $0.02

Offline Zacherof

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Re: Any rumors about improving the terrain?
« Reply #122 on: June 07, 2013, 11:58:46 PM »
The old halo remark "Dude! Check,out the water!!!!"
 And then they get eaten by this

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Offline MrRiplEy[H]

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Re: Any rumors about improving the terrain?
« Reply #123 on: June 08, 2013, 02:18:08 AM »
do you currently have all graphics options to the highest they can go with a steady 60fps frame rate?

There are some games coded on 2001 that look crappy and still modern computers freeze when all options are turned on. One example is a 2002 F1 game which simply had poor coding. If the code is unoptimized it places 1000 fold demand on hardware for nothing.

So the point about not being able to crank up the settings is void. I'm sure the sample video posted above didn't have to fill up the whole video memory to produce fluid and sharp shadows for example ;)
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Offline Zacherof

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Re: Any rumors about improving the terrain?
« Reply #124 on: June 08, 2013, 02:23:58 AM »
There are some of us who dont care about the eye candy. We just wanna have fun :old:
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Offline gyrene81

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Re: Any rumors about improving the terrain?
« Reply #125 on: June 08, 2013, 06:50:11 AM »
You obviously know nothing. The largest maps in Il2 are much larger than any in AH. Small maps in Il2 are typically 200x200 miles. That's 40,000 square miles. Large maps are 500x500 miles or more. It would take hours to fly from one edge to the other.

The number of players really has nothing to do with visual quality.
you're right, i don't know anything...the average lwma maps are 62,500 square miles, i calculated the distance of a single grid square wrong.

i have il2 and i know that with 64 players on a single map, you have to dummy down the graphics to keep frame rates up. i don't even want to know what it would be like with 300 players.
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Offline asterix

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Re: Any rumors about improving the terrain?
« Reply #126 on: June 08, 2013, 07:39:17 AM »
I do not understand how can some of you state so firmly that the better and more PC demanding graphics increases the number of players. Do you have any statistics to back up your opinion? If it needs a better PC, some may unsubscribe and some may join. I am a returning customer and I love this game, but I would not buy a new computer just because I can`t play AH2. Any change that puts a higher demand on the hardware or network connection seems like a risky one. I am shure that a better terrain will come some day, but I understand it takes time.

If this discussion gets heated and some threaten to leave because of the graphics, then maybe the solution would be a poll among the subscribers. There could be an option to give your vote near the account information or something. People could vote if they want an improved graphics and that they are willing to accept the new minimum system requirements, if that can be predicted.

If there is a cunning way to program a better terrain without the increase in video card load or if there is an option to tune it down, then by all means. Anyway "eye candy" is pretty low on my wishlist.

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Offline MarineUS

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Re: Any rumors about improving the terrain?
« Reply #127 on: June 08, 2013, 09:11:07 AM »
I do not understand how can some of you state so firmly that the better and more PC demanding graphics increases the number of players. Do you have any statistics to back up your opinion? If it needs a better PC, some may unsubscribe and some may join. I am a returning customer and I love this game, but I would not buy a new computer just because I can`t play AH2. Any change that puts a higher demand on the hardware or network connection seems like a risky one. I am shure that a better terrain will come some day, but I understand it takes time.

If this discussion gets heated and some threaten to leave because of the graphics, then maybe the solution would be a poll among the subscribers. There could be an option to give your vote near the account information or something. People could vote if they want an improved graphics and that they are willing to accept the new minimum system requirements, if that can be predicted.

If there is a cunning way to program a better terrain without the increase in video card load or if there is an option to tune it down, then by all means. Anyway "eye candy" is pretty low on my wishlist.



You don't even NEED statistics. Look at the player-base of AH. Its dying. Everyone sees it except those few who are in such deep denial that they are going to drown.

When you have games that have crap physics and flight modeling pulling in more players than AH one has only to think for any amount of time to realize that it is the eye candy. Even with commercials it wouldn't improve the AH player-base by much because that is one of the biggest things for the modern gamer. Graphics. We are in an age where every respectable gaming computer would have been a super computer in the day of what some of you are running.

Am I saying they need to make it so that everyone has to drop four grand on a PC? Absolutely not. Heck, my computer couldn't run any of the IL2 games, but I DO see that in order for this game to live on it needs to be re-worked. It doesn't take a genius to see that.

Those of you refusing to try to upgrade when you have the means to do so are doing nothing but slowly contributing to the death of your favorite game. If you can go out and buy a new car, restore and old car, build a new man-cave etc. you can upgrade your PC. You simply do it one piece at the time if you cannot go all out and get a new PC.

For those who ARE wanting to buy a new PC I recommend www.digitalstormonline.com - they have a baseline computer that can run any modern game of $699, which can be upgraded to all kinds of fancy stuff (even liquid cooling, which is not necessarily a big feat).

---

Back OT: Just look at any modern game. The game-play sucks but they have a lot of players. Why? It looks good. People are tired of playing the same old games with the same old graphics. Why play something that looks like it belongs on an Atari? The game-play may be good, but on this new game over here I lose a little bit of game-play for....my gosh...it's so beautiful....

Am I saying HT needs to sacrifice game-play? No. It's merely a means of showing you how the modern gamer works.
Like, ya know, when that thing that makes you move, it has pistons and things, When your thingamajigy is providing power, you do not hear other peoples thingamajig when they are providing power.

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Offline Tinkles

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Re: Any rumors about improving the terrain?
« Reply #128 on: June 08, 2013, 11:15:57 AM »
You don't even NEED statistics. Look at the player-base of AH. Its dying. Everyone sees it except those few who are in such deep denial that they are going to drown.

When you have games that have crap physics and flight modeling pulling in more players than AH one has only to think for any amount of time to realize that it is the eye candy. Even with commercials it wouldn't improve the AH player-base by much because that is one of the biggest things for the modern gamer. Graphics. We are in an age where every respectable gaming computer would have been a super computer in the day of what some of you are running.

Am I saying they need to make it so that everyone has to drop four grand on a PC? Absolutely not. Heck, my computer couldn't run any of the IL2 games, but I DO see that in order for this game to live on it needs to be re-worked. It doesn't take a genius to see that.

Those of you refusing to try to upgrade when you have the means to do so are doing nothing but slowly contributing to the death of your favorite game. If you can go out and buy a new car, restore and old car, build a new man-cave etc. you can upgrade your PC. You simply do it one piece at the time if you cannot go all out and get a new PC.

For those who ARE wanting to buy a new PC I recommend www.digitalstormonline.com - they have a baseline computer that can run any modern game of $699, which can be upgraded to all kinds of fancy stuff (even liquid cooling, which is not necessarily a big feat).

---

Back OT: Just look at any modern game. The game-play sucks but they have a lot of players. Why? It looks good. People are tired of playing the same old games with the same old graphics. Why play something that looks like it belongs on an Atari? The game-play may be good, but on this new game over here I lose a little bit of game-play for....my gosh...it's so beautiful....

Am I saying HT needs to sacrifice game-play? No. It's merely a means of showing you how the modern gamer works.

Sadly what you said has some merit.  Being one from the properly named "entitled" generation.   If the graphics aren't "uber doober all that" then some gamers won't even look at that game. That has happened with quite a few games.  Most of the games that have been released in the past 3 years have been 'uber doober" graphics, Assassin's Creed series, Call of Duty, Crisis etc.

Point being, some can look past the graphics and see the quality of the game, others HAVE to have the eye-candy.  While I wouldn't mind having the better graphics (even if I couldn't use them), I think we need to have other things fixed or updated before graphics. 

That being said, I do think if HTC wants to grab some of "this generations" attention, graphics would need to be updated.    However for me, I'm fine with graphics as they are :aok.

Respectively,

Tinkles

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Offline Megalodon

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Re: Any rumors about improving the terrain?
« Reply #129 on: June 08, 2013, 11:20:39 AM »
:O :O :O :O :O :O :O :O :O :O :O :O :O :O :O :O :O :O :O :O :O
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Offline Sunka

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Re: Any rumors about improving the terrain?
« Reply #130 on: June 08, 2013, 11:23:05 AM »
I got to say, the big money for HTC would be under 25 your olds. I play a few other mmorp games (now and then) i also have a lot of friends on FB under 20. ALL of these people first thing they say when a game comes out is its awesome graphics. This this game is about 10 years back as far as that. So HTC will die a slow low GFX death so old players that don't want to spend money on a PC less then 5 years old can play. Its a bad business model.
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Offline asterix

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Re: Any rumors about improving the terrain?
« Reply #131 on: June 08, 2013, 11:23:31 AM »
Back OT: Just look at any modern game. The game-play sucks but they have a lot of players. Why? It looks good. People are tired of playing the same old games with the same old graphics. Why play something that looks like it belongs on an Atari? The game-play may be good, but on this new game over here I lose a little bit of game-play for....my gosh...it's so beautiful....

I am not in a denial, just expressing my own views. I can`t understand why would anyone sacrifice gameplay for graphics. It does not seem that bad to me and I use very low settings. The graphics may become new, but it will still be the same "old" game (straight from WW2  :)). Can you please give me some examples about the modern games you are talking about?
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Offline The Fugitive

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Re: Any rumors about improving the terrain?
« Reply #132 on: June 08, 2013, 11:59:35 AM »
I got to say, the big money for HTC would be under 25 your olds. I play a few other mmorp games (now and then) i also have a lot of friends on FB under 20. ALL of these people first thing they say when a game comes out is its awesome graphics. This this game is about 10 years back as far as that. So HTC will die a slow low GFX death so old players that don't want to spend money on a PC less then 5 years old can play. Its a bad business model.

It's not the old people leaving due to graphics, it's the younger crowd who can't/won't spend the time to learn the game. I'm 55, both my kids are grown up and have jobs making twice the money I make. My wife makes more money than I do. My hobbies are flying Aces High and drinking beer  :devil I have no problem blowing a couple grand every few years to build a new smokin computer. I'm sure a lot of "older guys" are in the same boat.

The younger generation gets bored doing the same old "base attack" (read Horde if you wish  :P ) and so NEED eye candy to keep it exciting enough to hang around. Us old guys just get bigger monitors so we can see those blasted little planes flopping around and continue to play. Game play is more important to us.

Offline Sunka

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Re: Any rumors about improving the terrain?
« Reply #133 on: June 08, 2013, 12:32:42 PM »
 
It's not the old people leaving due to graphics, it's the younger crowd who can't/won't spend the time to learn the game. I'm 55, both my kids are grown up and have jobs making twice the money I make. My wife makes more money than I do. My hobbies are flying Aces High and drinking beer  :devil I have no problem blowing a couple grand every few years to build a new smokin computer. I'm sure a lot of "older guys" are in the same boat.

The younger generation gets bored doing the same old "base attack" (read Horde if you wish  :P ) and so NEED eye candy to keep it exciting enough to hang around. Us old guys just get bigger monitors so we can see those blasted little planes flopping around and continue to play. Game play is more important to us.
  Well you might be right,you saying you will spend money to keep playing every few years,your not the one that statement was aimed at.
But the game is behind badly as far as games go these days in the "eye candy" department when you look at ALL the other games with a large player base.


I love its realistic flight model,but that was done many years ago,now eye candy.
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Offline Tank-Ace

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Re: Any rumors about improving the terrain?
« Reply #134 on: June 08, 2013, 12:42:09 PM »
I'd be fine if they just made a more realistic layout of the land. Barns by big open fields, instead of in the middle of the woods. Some grain in the fields (give an option for a solid block of grain with texturing, or individual stalks if your computer can handle it), hedges and trees marking the boundaries for the fields...


Even with the current quality of graphics, the game would  FEEL more realistic.
You started this thread and it was obviously about your want and desire in spite of your use of 'we' and Google.

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