One determined dog...

[mtnman]

This right here is BS.

ANY animal in the world.

Any. Animal.

How could those not fit the specified criteria?

The criteria you asked for was "aggressive towards people at all times".  You asked for it, not me.

I simply asked for you to list an animal that is "aggressive towards people at all times".  You haven't done that yet.  The animals you listed are NOT "aggressive towards people at all times" so they don't meet the criteria you gave.

If you cannot list an animal (any animal) that meets the criteria you asked for, is it reasonable to expect anyone else to provide proof that the dog you seem to like meets that criteria?

[skorpx1]

You really don't believe that it is the owners fault every time do you? You do know dogs have had crappy owners since the beginning of time right? The difference is most other dogs with crappy owners don't KILL people. Sure there are hundred upon thousands of dog bites every single day by all breeds of dogs, but PB are KILLING people (especially children). How can you blatantly ignore the stats and facts right in front of your face and blame only the owners. The breed is a problem. Maybe not every single PB but the breed as a whole. Again the cause of 60% of DEATHS and only account for LESS than 5% of the total dog population. It is clearly a breed problem.

I'm not blaming only people, but owners normally do have a large chunk of the issue to deal with. There are pitbulls that are mean with nice and good owners, but what about the previous ones? Pitbulls just don't come aggressive and hateful right out of the box.

I don't care about the death statistics, i'm not even on that topic, i'm only in it for the behavioral part -as in how they act and not who they kill.

Also, I should quote MarineUS here: "Might wanna clean yourself up...there's some Hitler running down your chin."

You clearly want to blame one problem on an entire species. Its like saying that 100 out of 100,000 people killed/stabbed/stole from someone so therefore that entire group of people shall be wiped out.

Get rid of your bias and then try again.

[mtnman]

Species?

I don't think anybody is arguing that.

ALL dog fatalities are traceable to the same species.

[SilverZ06]

Q: How come pit bull owners say, "My dog might lick you to death."

To understand the experience of owning a negatively perceived dog, Tufts Center for Animals and Public Policy did a study on pit bull owners. Researchers found that owners of out-law dog breeds directly feel the stigma targeted at their breed and resort to various tactics to lessen it. One of the tactics included attempts to counterbalance the pit bull's menacing appearance and physical power with overwhelming "affectionate" behavior, such as: "My dog might lick you to death."

Dog Biting Incidents: 2008 to 2013

DogsBite.org - Animal control departments in at least 25 U.S. states report that pit bulls are biting more than all other dog breeds. These states include: Arizona, Arkansas, California, Colorado, Delaware, Florida, Georgia, Illinois, Indiana, Kansas, Massachusetts, Maryland, Michigan, Nebraska, Nevada, New York, North Carolina, Ohio, Rhode Island, Pennsylvania, Tennessee, Texas, Utah, Virginia and Wisconsin. The oft-quoted myth by pro-pit bull groups that pit bulls "do not bite more than other breeds" is categorically false. In addition to leading bite counts, the pit bull bite is also the most damaging, inflicting permanent and disfiguring injury.

It's not a little Hitler running down my chin. It's the huge blinders you and other PB owners are wearing.

[skorpx1]

It's not a little Hitler running down my chin. It's the huge blinders you and other PB owners are wearing.

Just because they are more aggressive, doesn't mean that every pitbull in existence is bad and deserves to die. I'm not wearing blinders, I do accept that all dogs do go killer and end up killing someone, but it doesn't mean the pitbulls themselves are singled out for execution.

Once again your bias is showing.

ALL dog fatalities are traceable to the same species.

So...You're saying that if a poodle kills a human, it can instantly be traced back to a pitbull?

That makes no sense at all. Screw the species thing, this is just downright outrageous.

[homersipes]

just my 2 cents, I have known more than 2 dozen PB owners and several breeders(used to work at a pet shop when I was in school)  All of the dogs that I ever met were nice as can be, now I am not saying that I would try to get inside any of their homes at night, but they were ALWAYS friendly.  They would let me bathe them, and clip their toes and never got growled at.  I have only ever seen 1 aggressive PB and he came from a bad home where he was starved and beaten.  I believe about 99% has to do with the way the animal has been treated.  I was working in a lady's apartment several years ago, and she had some kind of a shepard mixed with something well I had been playing with the dog all morning when I was going in and out of her apartment, fed him snacks and everything, the dog was never vicious at me.  Well I was in the bedroom changing a piece of broken glass and the tenant had went outside and the dog no longer wanted me in the house.  At first I thought about a hammer, but I was in his home so I yelled for her to come get her dog, as soon as she came in he was fine again.  to be perfectly honest I would rather deal with a pit than a chiwawa or however its spelled, EVERY one of them I have ever met I wanted to boot because EVERY one has bit my boots, but they aren't a threat? because they are small?  don't get it

[SilverZ06]

 to be perfectly honest I would rather deal with a pit than a chiwawa or however its spelled, EVERY one of them I have ever met I wanted to boot because EVERY one has bit my boots, but they aren't a threat? because they are small?  don't get it

that chiwawa nipping at your heels is annoying, a pitbull latching onto you is life threatening. I'm not sure how you could NOT get that 

[mtnman]

So...You're saying that if a poodle kills a human, it can instantly be traced back to a pitbull?

No, I'm saying that every single dog that kills a human is of the same species.  Actually, they can be narrowed down even to the subspecies (canis lupus familiaris).

You didn't seem to want to blame all dog troubles on one species, when, in fact they are all related to the one, single species. 

That's an inarguable fact (not just an opinion).

[Zacherof]

Out here where I'm at, in the high desert, horse owners are wary of wild dogs, but ismts the pit bulls that worry them. Just 1 can bring down a horse.




Okay let's just
blame it all on the white trash, and gang bangers.


Btw my lab was attacked by a
pitbulltwice. She's aggresive and scares away most scoundrels, but the pit bulls didn't care.
As for me I've only been threatened by pit bulls and boxers(whose owners I knew, and I also knew they took care of thier dog)

The pit bull got a steel toe boot in the chest. 


And let it go on record I'm an animal lover. And no they don't need to be exterminated but they do have an issue.

[SilverZ06]

http://www.scpr.org/news/2013/05/09/37202/deputies-search-for-pitbulls-who-mauled-kille-palm/

http://www.bubblews.com/news/491356-pit-bull-attacks-cop-after-killing-jogger
quoted from the second article

Apparently stray dogs are familiar and a problem in this particular California, Palmdale area, as residents say stray dogs are always around and have attacked others.

Uh oh, you don't have owners to blame, what is the next excuse?

There have been quite a few pitbulls attacks in the news as of late. In April, a horrific attack left a toddler dead after the family's own dog, turned on the child in Fulton County, Georgia. This poor child's mother went to use the bathroom, while the mauling took place.

Again in April, Claudia Gallardo, was killed in Stockton, California and again neighbors cried "they were not surprised by the attack because the pit bull had jumped its fence and attacked people before."

[skorpx1]

Uh oh, you don't have owners to blame, what is the next excuse?

Stray dogs have obviously harder lives. They need to kill other animals to stay alive, not only for food, but primarily for defense against other animals that would kill them. Sometimes people are that animal. On top of all of this they have nobody to train them to know what is right and wrong.
 
It doesn't take a genius to figure that one out.

[Zacherof]

Actually dogs have instincts. Ever heard if a pack of wolves with a dog in it?

[skorpx1]

Actually dogs have instincts. Ever heard if a pack of wolves with a dog in it?

There's a difference between instincts and knowing what's right and wrong.

[Zacherof]

There's a difference between instincts and knowing what's right and wrong.

*sarcasm end*

sigh....thiana one of those topics alot like them political ones. No ones going to change their mind

[mtnman]

*sarcasm end*

sigh....thiana one of those topics alot like them political ones. No ones going to change their mind

That's ok, it wasn't like we were going for anything beyond a lighthearted little chat anyway.  Even if we were, what we decide as a group on this forum isn't going to matter to the mainstream world anyway.

There really doesn't seem to be enough "real" factual knowledge about the animals, their breeding, and their behavior to have a legitimate 2-sided discussion.  About the best we can do is resort to an emotional tirade (which is entertaining, I admit).

There's some obvious confusion over the basics.  Obviously, there's only one, single species of dog in the entire world.  To think we could do anything but blame all of our dog woes (and successes) on one species is inaccurate, because there are simply no other species "out there" to blame!  "Breed" and "species" are not interchangeable.

Unless... we blame it all on humans.  We created the different breeds through highly selective inbreeding, so we have nobody to blame but ourselves.  Most modern breeders are probably not "culling" their less-than ideal animals, but are instead allowing them to breed (although not necessarily doing it themselves), and are therefore allowing them to continually pollute the genetics that took so long to perfect.  Again, our fault.  Several great dog breeds have been destroyed already due to that.  The Cocker Spaniel was at one time a fantastic field dog; now it's a lap dog.  It's our fault, and our mess to clean up (if we consider it worthwhile).
 
Dogs don't have the slightest concept of "right and wrong" either.  Those are human concepts of morality that don't exist in a dog's brain.  They're operating on a much more simplistic level than that. 

Of course, they're not operating purely on instinct either.