Arena Fuel Burn Rates..

[Karnak]

For the "I only fly Luftwaffe planes" people there is the Ta152H-1.  It does fine as an escort fighter.

While I've never encountered one, an RAF only sap would be stuck with the Mosquito Mk VI or just admit that the RAF flew Mustang Mk IIIs and use that. I suppose one could try to baby a Spitfire Mk VIII into being an escort.

The VVS don't even have a domestic bomber to escort...

Certainly the Americans and Japanese are far better set for escort capable fighters.

[icepac]

I can fly a spit XIV for much more than an hour at near 400mph and have hunted plenty of me163s over enemy strats in spit VIII.

Of course, I have also flown the TA152 for nearly 3 hours without drop tanks.

[Karnak]

I can fly a spit XIV for much more than an hour at near 400mph and have hunted plenty of me163s over enemy strats in spit VIII.

Meaningless comments.

[icepac]

No it's not......but your answer shows your lack of trying or experience in getting long sorties out of high fuel consumption planes.

[Karnak]

No it's not......but your answer shows your lack of trying or experience in getting long sorties out of high fuel consumption planes.

No, it is meaningless because it is without context.  The game situation varies too much for hunting Me163s with a Spit VIII to mean anything.  That could be only a sector from the Spit's originating base.

As to the Mk XIV and more than an hour, sure, but not at 400+mph.  You are well known for your exaggerations.

As to relatively long range missions on short ranged aircraft, I have done those.  Even to the point where I had to shut one engine off on my Mossie (this was back when the Mossie had twice the fuel consumption rate it should have had, giving it about the same range as a Spit IX) to make it home after a nearly two hour sortie spent mostly on max cruise settings, boost, RPM and altitude.  I am the one who proved the Mossie was consuming twice as much fuel as it ought to have been by using cruise settings from the Mossie's pilot's handbook.

[Butcher]

No it's not......but your answer shows your lack of trying or experience in getting long sorties out of high fuel consumption planes.

Honestly in 10 years, I haven't given a crap about fuel consumptions or long range sorties - fact is I run my fuel until its out or the bullets run dry - in most cases, bullets go before fuel does. People don't need to know the best alt to cruise speed a Spit 14, there are thousands of things to learn and really fuel consumption is the least on the list to learn.

Basic learning such as setting your aircraft to cruise speed via the clipboard is just fine in my book when it comes to fuel consumption, fact is getting 20 extra minutes really only holds water if you are flying scenarios and FSO.

[Franz Von Werra]

WHAT DO WE WANT?    FUEL BURN 1X !!!
WHEN DO WE WANT IT?   NOW !!!
NO 1X,  NO PEACE!
FUEL BURN 1X !!!

Ok reasons:

MISSIONS:
*There is enough fuel for planes to FORM UP, we don't have to have 'military discipline' of normal 'missions' so stragglers etc all have time, fuel burn 1x compensates.
*SUPER DUPER SIZE SQUAD MISSIONS WITH ADD-ON SQUADS JOINING. Every squad would have a squad night, and others squads and singles would join in...
*Talking about taking off from 2 or 3 bases back in friendly territory to get to proper alt...
*Summed up: massive armadas of planes, flown by players, at VERY HIGH ALTS, GOING ACROSS THE MAP!!! (SCREW NOE... OPPOSITE OF NOE)
*Enemies fighters would up - a few bases ahead of the armada, hoping to get to a proper intercept altitude, hoping they stay on course! (the armada could turn)!!!
*EVEN THE C47 GOONS would be at max alt... chart says 25k?
*GET SHOT DOWN? that's ok, become a gunner? (too bad game doesn't allow multiple gunners!) sigh!
*Fighters would be 5k(?)feet or more above the bombers, or below? from front? back? or side? for best intercept possibilities. YOU DECIDE!!!
*TEAMWORK, imagine that. With such high numbers, players would have to group up, or die to gang rapes if not 'one pass hall arse.'
*Better quality of fights at this altitude people, totally opposite of players upping and ho'ing from a vulched base. Not so much suicide ho'ing!
*CAPTURE A BASE RIGHT NEXT TO ENEMY HQ !!! <--- achievement for that!! kk what up! And then attack THE HQ from the newly captured base... EPIC NORMAL 'BASE NEXT DOOR' FIGHTS YOU EVER SAW, THE HQ IS AT STAKE!!!
*FUEL BURN 1X WILL MAKE FOR THE MOST EPIC STUFF YOU'VE EVER SEEN IN ANY GAME!!!
*EPIC defined: You will feel like you were in the real deal war deciding stuff, going just by the number of planes involved, let alone who commands it - strategy!
*RANK MISSION LEADERS!

Rogue flights or small groups: 3hour flights!
*You alone, or with some wingys - suppose you are a knight, you can fly to a bish / rook fight. Maybe cherry pick their goons or weaker planes.
*You've all done it, let one enemy wound the other enemy, and then you kill the new one, finish the wounded one...
*Fly far distances into enemy territory at low altitude, under radar, to ideal enemy fields, its about loitering near enemy base at low alt, then going after a squad when they up, kill whats most dangerous to you, then kill the rest.
*same as above but just fly over there and park on the ground near by, sip some wine and have crackers and cheese... when they up, they die!

Same ole same ole 'next door' base fights:
*Even if that LA-7 or other shorter range plane comes over with his full tank thinking he can vulch for hours, he will get pwnt by the guys that up with 25% fuel. No's aye's problema's!
*Players might fly smarter than just ho'ing, you are no longer in a 'rush' race against time vs your fuel soo much.
*You wont have this '15min maximum attention span,  much longer soon!
*A draw back: if you take all day to get kills, your points rank will STILL suffer because 'kills per time' will sux. <-- the true difference from the old days. (top pilot not the guy with the most time)
*Players interested in NOT GETTING KILLED ALL SEASON will be able to fly even more defensively. RUN FOR 10 SECTORS <--- might be the kill you remember best if you catch him!
*AND DON'T WORRY ABOUT ABOVE, there will be VERY MANY MORE PLAYERS LOGGED ON, Just like on FSO nights, TELLING YA's, squad nights ever night, go join in!
*About 'late night' - THERE WERE NEVER A LOT OF PLAYERS AT LATE HOURS, the world does sleep, but THESE DAYS IT IS THE WHOLE WORLD BECAUSE BETTER PING TIMES! So maybe many on at night too?
*ITS BETTER THAN FSO, because FSO has stupid 'short range' ICON limiting stuff, great for realism, SUX FOR EPIC!!!
HTC's: I double triple dare you guys, I even OBAMA's DEBT dare you guys, LOL, to make a 'fuel burn 1x' day, and watch as it becomes the most populated day. Then I bet you add even more nights if not all week!
WE DONT NEED ALL THESE SEPARATE ARENAS for FLY IT YOUR WAY, WE JUST NEED FUEL BURN 1X !!!  PLEASE!

[SmokinLoon]

WHAT DO WE WANT?    FUEL BURN 1X !!!
WHEN DO WE WANT IT?   NOW !!!
NO 1X,  NO PEACE!
FUEL BURN 1X !!!

Ok reasons:

MISSIONS:
*There is enough fuel for planes to FORM UP, we don't have to have 'military discipline' of normal 'missions' so stragglers etc all have time, fuel burn 1x compensates.
*SUPER DUPER SIZE SQUAD MISSIONS WITH ADD-ON SQUADS JOINING. Every squad would have a squad night, and others squads and singles would join in...
*Talking about taking off from 2 or 3 bases back in friendly territory to get to proper alt...
*Summed up: massive armadas of planes, flown by players, at VERY HIGH ALTS, GOING ACROSS THE MAP!!! (SCREW NOE... OPPOSITE OF NOE)
*Enemies fighters would up - a few bases ahead of the armada, hoping to get to a proper intercept altitude, hoping they stay on course! (the armada could turn)!!!
*EVEN THE C47 GOONS would be at max alt... chart says 25k?
*GET SHOT DOWN? that's ok, become a gunner? (too bad game doesn't allow multiple gunners!) sigh!
*Fighters would be 5k(?)feet or more above the bombers, or below? from front? back? or side? for best intercept possibilities. YOU DECIDE!!!
*TEAMWORK, imagine that. With such high numbers, players would have to group up, or die to gang rapes if not 'one pass hall arse.'
*Better quality of fights at this altitude people, totally opposite of players upping and ho'ing from a vulched base. Not so much suicide ho'ing!
*CAPTURE A BASE RIGHT NEXT TO ENEMY HQ !!! <--- achievement for that!! kk what up! And then attack THE HQ from the newly captured base... EPIC NORMAL 'BASE NEXT DOOR' FIGHTS YOU EVER SAW, THE HQ IS AT STAKE!!!
*FUEL BURN 1X WILL MAKE FOR THE MOST EPIC STUFF YOU'VE EVER SEEN IN ANY GAME!!!
*EPIC defined: You will feel like you were in the real deal war deciding stuff, going just by the number of planes involved, let alone who commands it - strategy!
*RANK MISSION LEADERS!

Rogue flights or small groups: 3hour flights!
*You alone, or with some wingys - suppose you are a knight, you can fly to a bish / rook fight. Maybe cherry pick their goons or weaker planes.
*You've all done it, let one enemy wound the other enemy, and then you kill the new one, finish the wounded one...
*Fly far distances into enemy territory at low altitude, under radar, to ideal enemy fields, its about loitering near enemy base at low alt, then going after a squad when they up, kill whats most dangerous to you, then kill the rest.
*same as above but just fly over there and park on the ground near by, sip some wine and have crackers and cheese... when they up, they die!

Same ole same ole 'next door' base fights:
*Even if that LA-7 or other shorter range plane comes over with his full tank thinking he can vulch for hours, he will get pwnt by the guys that up with 25% fuel. No's aye's problema's!
*Players might fly smarter than just ho'ing, you are no longer in a 'rush' race against time vs your fuel soo much.
*You wont have this '15min maximum attention span,  much longer soon!
*A draw back: if you take all day to get kills, your points rank will STILL suffer because 'kills per time' will sux. <-- the true difference from the old days. (top pilot not the guy with the most time)
*Players interested in NOT GETTING KILLED ALL SEASON will be able to fly even more defensively. RUN FOR 10 SECTORS <--- might be the kill you remember best if you catch him!
*AND DON'T WORRY ABOUT ABOVE, there will be VERY MANY MORE PLAYERS LOGGED ON, Just like on FSO nights, TELLING YA's, squad nights ever night, go join in!
*About 'late night' - THERE WERE NEVER A LOT OF PLAYERS AT LATE HOURS, the world does sleep, but THESE DAYS IT IS THE WHOLE WORLD BECAUSE BETTER PING TIMES! So maybe many on at night too?
*ITS BETTER THAN FSO, because FSO has stupid 'short range' ICON limiting stuff, great for realism, SUX FOR EPIC!!!
HTC's: I double triple dare you guys, I even OBAMA's DEBT dare you guys, LOL, to make a 'fuel burn 1x' day, and watch as it becomes the most populated day. Then I bet you add even more nights if not all week!
WE DONT NEED ALL THESE SEPARATE ARENAS for FLY IT YOUR WAY, WE JUST NEED FUEL BURN 1X !!!  PLEASE!

The map scale compared to the real deal is the fish that is on the way to **SLAP** you alongside your head.

With the current burn rate of 2.0, the fuel burn in the main arenas is not a factor in the greater majority of aircraft on most maps.  On the larger maps the short legs of the La7 or Boston III's may be a factor, but not hardly enough to keep them out of the fight.

I still say HTC should up the burn rate to 2.25 just to see how, if at all, it affects the MA's.  This is one of the completely arbitrary settings that HTC has sat on "just because".  That, along with reload rates for tanks, down times for hangers, convoys, hardness settings for OBJ's, etc, etc, are ALL completely arbitrary and how wunnerful it would be for HTC to mix things up a bit and make the FH's more difficult to destroy, barracks paper thin, ammo bunkers tougher than nails, radar towers much harder to hit, add in about 4 different hardness settings for town buildings, etc, etc, etc.    

[bozon]

I still say HTC should up the burn rate to 2.25 just to see how, if at all, it affects the MA's.  This is one of the completely arbitrary settings that HTC has sat on "just because".  

That is not correct. HTC tried various FBM values during the transition period from AH1 to AH2. There were long and heated discussions about this in the forums.

[gyrene81]

I still say HTC should up the burn rate to 2.25 just to see how, if at all, it affects the MA's.  This is one of the completely arbitrary settings that HTC has sat on "just because".  That, along with reload rates for tanks, down times for hangers, convoys, hardness settings for OBJ's, etc, etc, are ALL completely arbitrary and how wunnerful it would be for HTC to mix things up a bit and make the FH's more difficult to destroy, barracks paper thin, ammo bunkers tougher than nails, radar towers much harder to hit, add in about 4 different hardness settings for town buildings, etc, etc, etc.    

              what a load of b.s.

[icepac]

No, it is meaningless because it is without context.  The game situation varies too much for hunting Me163s with a Spit VIII to mean anything.  That could be only a sector from the Spit's originating base.

As to the Mk XIV and more than an hour, sure, but not at 400+mph.  You are well known for your exaggerations.

As to relatively long range missions on short ranged aircraft, I have done those.  Even to the point where I had to shut one engine off on my Mossie (this was back when the Mossie had twice the fuel consumption rate it should have had, giving it about the same range as a Spit IX) to make it home after a nearly two hour sortie spent mostly on max cruise settings, boost, RPM and altitude.  I am the one who proved the Mossie was consuming twice as much fuel as it ought to have been by using cruise settings from the Mossie's pilot's handbook.

Please tell me of these exaggerations so I can refute you with film.

[Karnak]

Please tell me of these exaggerations so I can refute you with film.

How easy it is to intercept the perk bombers with Bf110s and Me410s and Yaks at 30,000ft.

I've not had time to test it, but I am quite skeptical of the Mk XIV for more than an hour in the MA at more than 400mph.

[Tank-Ace]

How easy it is to intercept the perk bombers with Bf110s and Me410s and Yaks at 30,000ft.

I've not had time to test it, but I am quite skeptical of the Mk XIV for more than an hour in the MA at more than 400mph.

Yeah, I call BS on that one too.

[icepac]

Funny.....I ran down a few B29s with a 110g at 30,000 feet this weekend.

You could ask the victims about it or the other doubters when I announced I would perform the feat.

If you want to up the stakes to include paying my account for two months, I will be willing to play along and post the film only after you take the bet.

The 262 is considered not to be a good interceptor of super high buffs but I caught more than a few this tour at altitudes as high as 34,000 feet by taking off right under them at the strats and climbing while maintaining vis on thier dot.

Can't do that in a 110 so a 110 intercept takes a lot of diligence to successfully perform the intercept.

As far as the yak, I have intercepted plenty of buffs as high as 35,000 feet and used to routinely fly 1.3 hour mission in them........ask lusche how many times he's shot down the foolish yak that intercepted his b29s or asked for help from a friendly 163 to help him land his milkruns.

Or you could ask wezel about the upping his 163 to clear the 110g from Lusche's B29s six so he could land and ending up losing the dogfight to the 110g.

Just because you lack the patience and/or skill to do something unusual doesn't mean others can't perform the feat.

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/newscores/killsof.php?playername=icepac&selectTour=LWTour161&pindex=114

[Karnak]

Funny.....I ran down a few B29s with a 110g at 30,000 feet this weekend.

You could ask the victims about it or the other doubters when I announced I would perform the feat.

That has nothing to do with how easy it is.  You persistently pass it off as easy.  In our conversation about it you were saying the Mosquito Mk  XVI was easy to intercept in things that are bluntly slower than it.

If you want to up the stakes to include paying my account for two months, I will be willing to play along and post the film only after you take the bet.

Why?  The film won't show it being easy, just you doing it, which has never been disputed.

As far as the yak, I have intercepted plenty of buffs as high as 35,000 feet and used to routinely fly 1.3 hour mission in them........ask lusche how many times he's shot down the foolish yak that intercepted his b29s or asked for help from a friendly 163 to help him land his milkruns.

Once again, it doesn't say anything about how easy it is.

Just because you lack the patience and/or skill to do something unusual doesn't mean others can't perform the feat.

Personal insults are pointless, particularly when they are wrong.  I have used the Mossie VI as an interceptor, I just don't lie about it being so easy that anybody can do it or that it isn't significantly luck based in some cases.

I know it isn't easy to intercept the Mossie XVI because I have flown many Mossie XVI sorties and I know how easy it is for me to avoid most interception attempts.  If it is easy for me to avoid them then by definition it is hard for them to intercept me.