Last night's "memorial" strat run

[SlidingHorn]

We had every intention of going in cold.

B.S. - So why, then, were the bombers heavy?  Why did they go to an enemy strat, and not their own?

You guys can sit there and whine that someone shot at you (there were MORE than enough of you to cover the few fighters that disobeyed their country's requests to allow passage) all you want and act like you had no ill-intention, but the fact that you upped with bombs in the MA toward enemy territory essentially negates any of these claims.  I may be new, but it's my understanding that these memorial flights are not uncommon, however are held either in the TA/a custom arena/within friendly territory, and without bombs.

As my previous post stated:  I'm aware that this is a game, and that really, no true harm was done.

That being said, to play off the emotion of the overwhelmingly vast majority of the Knights who wanted to give their respect by allowing the airspace is just as deplorable as you accuse others of being.

[Tank-Ace]

See Rule #4

[Badger85]

Earl, I am deeply sorry for your loss.

I look forward to flying in more of the fine Pickup Missions under your leadership in the MA 

[hcrana]

Sir, I advise you swallow some bleach.

What a snappy comeback!  Do you have a point or are you just another sad troll?

[surfinn]

B.S. - So why, then, were the bombers heavy?  Why did they go to an enemy strat, and not their own?
 
That being said, to play off the emotion of the overwhelmingly vast majority of the Knights who wanted to give their respect by allowing the airspace is just as deplorable as you accuse others of being.

If you will read earls post you will see why the bombers were heavy. It was a pre agreed on flight plan with the support of many knights.

It may have been a lot of knights but there were enough on that attacked the formation to cause us to react in the way we did,which was to go guns hot and drop bombs.
I wouldn't call two full sectors of dar bar and lost formations of b29s prior to reaching the strats allowed airspace. I say it again If we hadn't (escorts) gone guns hot there wouldn't have been any b29s left to drop ords. That said there is no excuse for the personal attacks on earls character in this post. There was no deliberate play on anyones emotions from the missions point of view.

[bmused55]

Sorry, but a fully armed mass bomber run to the enemy's main target is just a very bad idea for a peaceful, non-combat memorial mission. I never had the though they did not wanted to be attacked, else they would never had carried bombs to the strats in B-29s, else they would have done it either in the SEA, or at least had plotted a course steering way clear of any critical targets (there's enough room for that on Tagma).

So it was very clear for me from the start it's all about combat, and boy! Combat we did have! One of the largest missions in years, and very alert escort fighters almost bagged me more than once... great fun! Thank you for that... and feel free to do more such missions.  

So, you attacked a well advertised memorial flight because in your opinion you knew better?    Shame on you, you disgust me sir. And the same goes to everyone that attacked this memorial flight.  

The intentions of the flight were well advertised on this forum.  They stated that at the end of the flight, they would target a near by airfield or two.   That's why they were heavy. Seems pretty crystal clear to me!
All the defenders had to do was monitor the flight and attack once weapons were declared hot.  Very simple.

Earl is a proud and very upstanding member of this community and is not one to lie. A lot of people in this game and on this forum who consider themselves better than others could learn a thing or two from this humble gentleman.
To drag his name into the dirt because of some selfish whine about how an game target got bombed and it hurt your feelings in his time of mourning is disgusting! And people wonder why the membership is dwindling?!
Read this thread and all the "I knew it was a memorial flight, I attacked anyway" posts and you'll find your answer.  Arrogance, indifference and pig headedness.

[hcrana]

Earl doesn't deserve this. Any of this. You people whining about some virtual tool shed being bombed are out of line. Way out of line.

NOBODY deserves this.  I'd like to see all these Internet heroes talk toejame like this to someone's face. 

[Tank-Ace]

What a snappy comeback!  Do you have a point or are you just another sad troll?

The point of this thread should be obvious; just because it took place online doesn't make what happened any less disrespectful, and we should no just sweep it under the rug, as you so idiotically advised.

[SlidingHorn]

If you will read earls post you will see why the bombers were heavy. It was a pre agreed on flight plan with the support of many knights.

It may have been a lot of knights but there were enough on that attacked the formation to cause us to react in the way we did,which was to go guns hot and drop bombs.
I wouldn't call two full sectors of dar bar and lost formations of b29s prior to reaching the strats allowed airspace. I say it again If we hadn't (escorts) gone guns hot there wouldn't have been any b29s left to drop ords. That said there is no excuse for the personal attacks on earls character in this post. There was no deliberate play on anyones emotions from the missions point of view.

Yes...it's admitted that there was intent to drop ord from the beginning.  That's not what I would call a "memorial flight" - it's a horde attack, and to ask others to "show respect" by not attacking said horde attack is absolutely ridiculous.  There are places for memorial flights:  The SEA/TA, etc.

So, you attacked a well advertised memorial flight because in your opinion you knew better?    Shame on you, you disgust me sir. And the same goes to everyone that attacked this memorial flight.  

The intentions of the flight were well advertised on this forum.  They stated that at the end of the flight, they would target a near by airfield or two.   That's why they were heavy. Seems pretty crystal clear to me!

Bombs hot =/= memorial flight.  It's an attacking horde, and will be treated as such in the future.  The irony of a participant in a mission that preyed on the decency of most of us who wanted to allow the flight path shaming someone else and claiming disgust is off the charts - especially when you admit in the same post that there was intent for the mission to attack.  To be honest, and you can call me a D-Bag all you want for it, but had I known they were flying hot, I'd have picked every one I could have off the runway they started from.

My friend died in a wreck over the weekend (true story).  In memoriam, I'm going to arrange a large bomber squad to be loaded heavy and attack "a base or two" at the end.  Anyone who attacks this "memorial flight unlike all other memorial flights that have been held in the past and that will be attacking your base" will be publicly shamed, called a disgusting excuse for a human being on the forums, and made a pariah in the AH community.  

Sounds pretty ridiculous, right?  That's exactly what you're doing right now.

Again, I know: cartoon planes, etc. --  Someone died (a horrible thing - they have my sympathy), those that loved that person are grieving (a horrible thing - they have my sympathy)

Those cartoon planes will simply be shot down next time, is all.  Fool me once...

[Lusche]

So, you attacked a well advertised memorial flight because in your opinion you knew better?    Shame on you, you disgust me sir. And the same goes to everyone that attacked this memorial flight.  

1. It was not "well advertised". I did not know anything about any memorial flight before. I just saw a multi sector darbar creeping toward our strats.
2. Then a rumor came up while I was already airborne to intercept. And it was just that, a rumor with a lot of contracitory statements. Nobody on my side seemed to know anything
3. The mission was not happening in the SEA, it was not flying in no mans land - it flew directly to our key strats, armed, escorted at altitude. It was behaving totally opposite any memorial flight with no intention of combat would behave.
4. Friendlies had been engaged long before I even had vis on this raid. I killed my first enemy at our strats, not in a random remote place.


Again: Who in the world would plan such a flight in this manner with no combat in mind? In the MA, where most players NEVER read the foums, are not tuned to CH 200 and on top of that many players are from foreing countries with little command of the English language.
And you think you can then fly to the most valuable enemy target (strats), with bombs in your bellies and nobody will shoot at you? A memorial mission not looking for combat would use the SEA or at least carry no bombs and stay away from the front, instead of flying fully armed into the hornet's nest. It's just like going into a bank with a gun in your hand, and then wonder why you are being attacked as you "never had the intention to rob any money".

Your moral indignation is as ridiculous as the one of those Knights screaming bloody murder and personally attacking a griefing old man just because bombs were dropped. All of you should ask your doctor for a presciption of common sense.

[hcrana]

The point of this thread should be obvious; just because it took place online doesn't make what happened any less disrespectful, and we should no just sweep it under the rug, as you so idiotically advised.

Did you even read what I said?  Nice ad hominem slander style, BTW.  Dot-ignore much?

[VuduVee]

there ya go lusche, well said. it makes common sense that the MA is the MA, there may be guns hot. my flight was escort on the nose of the formation, we assumed guns cold, and make a pretty fighter formation. we didnt hear vox on the tail end of the bomber stream. someone in this thread says there was a bomber formation shot down though, i didnt hear that in flight, it couldve been rear of the bomber formation. what i seen and have film of is this: my flight seen a cold gun 109 filming. a 110 that for sure had hot guns, popped his rockets off into the bomber stream, but no E to get the 30mm shot he wanted. he was shot down. this was BEFORE we got to strats. a 262 right wing of the formation trying its best to get in and shoot, who did get a bomber AFTER bombs away. and those are the planes i saw myself and have film of. theres a question of timing between 200 and the actual flight happenings and i dont know if the 110 was on his second run when i seen him.

[pangea]

Your moral indignation is as ridiculous as the one of those Knights screaming bloody murder and personally attacking a griefing old man just because bombs were dropped. All of you should ask your doctor for a presciption of common sense.

^This.  I don't really care much that the memorial mission planning was somewhat flawed, or that bombs were carried, that the bombers were attacked and said bombers then dropped their bombs on the strats.  It is the MA after all.  But to kick a man who is mourning the death of his WIFE for any reason, let alone something as trivial as a cartoon air combat game is horrible and inexcusable.  You should all crawl under a rock and stay there for a very long time.  Shame on you!

[Aspen]

Knowingly attacking a memorial flight = poor form

Retaliating by attacking the strats belonging to all the guys who respected the flight and let it pass = poor form

Any of this isn't worth adding to a man's load when he is already carrying more than some folks are able.

Please axe this thread.

[Alpo]

Please remember, the MA is where Santa Claus often gets vulched on Christmas Eve so pretty much anything goes... kills will be recorded no matter what peace flag you are flying.

This is not about some about some Trojan Horse tactic to get to anyone's strat.  It was about a group of people who wanted to make another member feel cared for, in a time of grief, by showing some solidarity and flying together (from multiple AH countries).  If they wanted it for filming as a Memorial Flight, the training corp could have set them up in a different arena.  That's what we have done in the past.

Expecting everyone to "know" what is going on and/or respecting that in the MA is basically delusional and in the long run, kills were made, buildings were blown up.  However, those who were pilots which were shot down immediately reupped to fight again in brand new planes, and the buildings which were destroyed magically rebuilt in a few hours.  Earl's wife is gone... forever.  Now get off his back guys and learn to separate a damn game and real life for a change.  There are bigger things in this world than the Late War Arena map.

  ET, I'm truly sorry for your loss.