Author Topic: Tool Shedding-Get rid of it.  (Read 8986 times)

Offline BnZs

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Tool Shedding-Get rid of it.
« on: June 27, 2014, 01:19:54 AM »
This is something I see a great deal more of than when I started in 2006. It is a bad gameplay dynamic, the ultimate anti-fun. What purpose does it serve in game, other than to annoy?

We used to have furballs that went on for hours. Now you can expect the the life span of a gung-ho fight to be measured in minutes before an individual from one side or the other decide to cut off the endless supply of airplanes. CVs, once the ultimate source of near instant-gratification fighting in the MA, are now lucky if they last a quarter of an hour after the enemy knows they are there.

It really doesn't matter whether it is your own fighter hangars that just go dropped or that of the enemy base you just flew to-these egg-toting grinches cut out the supply of fun for BOTH sides in a fight.

So get rid of toolshedding I say. Bomb tards can still get the bizarre jollies they derive from smashing inanimate objects by taking out town, taking out guns, etc. Just make hangars indestructible, so that the fun of the majority is not subject to the whims to tiny number of fun-loathing cranks in a jabos or bombers. If one is not able to take a base except by removing the ability of the defenders to defend, then  one does not deserve to take the base anyway.
"Crikey, sir. I'm looking forward to today. Up diddly up, down diddly down, whoops, poop, twiddly dee - decent scrap with the fiendish Red Baron - bit of a jolly old crash landing behind enemy lines - capture, torture, escape, and then back home in time for tea and medals."

Offline MrKrabs

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Re: Tool Shedding-Get rid of it.
« Reply #1 on: June 27, 2014, 01:59:12 AM »
Kill the ords...

Kill the bombers...

Stop dying... Or tell everyone else to stop dying...
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Offline Ack-Ack

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Re: Tool Shedding-Get rid of it.
« Reply #2 on: June 27, 2014, 02:32:08 AM »
This is something I see a great deal more of than when I started in 2006. It is a bad gameplay dynamic, the ultimate anti-fun. What purpose does it serve in game, other than to annoy?

We used to have furballs that went on for hours. Now you can expect the the life span of a gung-ho fight to be measured in minutes before an individual from one side or the other decide to cut off the endless supply of airplanes. CVs, once the ultimate source of near instant-gratification fighting in the MA, are now lucky if they last a quarter of an hour after the enemy knows they are there.

It really doesn't matter whether it is your own fighter hangars that just go dropped or that of the enemy base you just flew to-these egg-toting grinches cut out the supply of fun for BOTH sides in a fight.

So get rid of toolshedding I say. Bomb tards can still get the bizarre jollies they derive from smashing inanimate objects by taking out town, taking out guns, etc. Just make hangars indestructible, so that the fun of the majority is not subject to the whims to tiny number of fun-loathing cranks in a jabos or bombers. If one is not able to take a base except by removing the ability of the defenders to defend, then  one does not deserve to take the base anyway.

LOL nice troll.

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Offline BnZs

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Re: Tool Shedding-Get rid of it.
« Reply #3 on: June 27, 2014, 08:22:18 AM »


Stop dying... Or tell everyone else to stop dying...

I love dying. I die time after time with a smile on my face defending bases.

Being denied the opportunity to die, and "my friends, the enemy" being denied the opportunity to kill me is the problem.

I dare anyone to explain to me what tool shedding does to add fun to this game that balances the anti-fun if causes by ending fights.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2014, 08:38:44 AM by BnZs »
"Crikey, sir. I'm looking forward to today. Up diddly up, down diddly down, whoops, poop, twiddly dee - decent scrap with the fiendish Red Baron - bit of a jolly old crash landing behind enemy lines - capture, torture, escape, and then back home in time for tea and medals."

Offline kvuo75

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Re: Tool Shedding-Get rid of it.
« Reply #4 on: June 27, 2014, 08:28:20 AM »

I dare anyone to explain to me what tool shedding does to add fun to this game

the shedders find it fun?

kvuo75

Kill the manned ack.

Offline BnZs

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Re: Tool Shedding-Get rid of it.
« Reply #5 on: June 27, 2014, 08:29:51 AM »
Kill the ords...
So become a minor toolshedder myself aye?  :rofl I do not pay $15 a month to waste my playtime destroying inanimate objects. And btw, the fact that one guy in a suicide 190 can take down ords and prevent defenders from dealing with vehicles is ANOTHER bad dynamic in this game, although not as bad as the ability of buffs to grief the primary focus of this game, fighter combat.

Kill the bombers...
Nor do I pay $15 a month to hunt buffs. I will kill them at opportunity, but stopping buff toolshedders is an unrealistic proposition. If every defender hung around at 15K in a cannon bird no buffs would get through, but they don't. They tangle with the other fighters coming in, and enjoy the furball, so a griefing toolshedder is normally able to get through and destroy the furball everyone else is enjoying.
"Crikey, sir. I'm looking forward to today. Up diddly up, down diddly down, whoops, poop, twiddly dee - decent scrap with the fiendish Red Baron - bit of a jolly old crash landing behind enemy lines - capture, torture, escape, and then back home in time for tea and medals."

Offline BnZs

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Re: Tool Shedding-Get rid of it.
« Reply #6 on: June 27, 2014, 08:32:15 AM »
the shedders find it fun?
Having fun by ending the fun for everyone else? I think absolute turds are a demographic to which AH does not particularly need to cater.
"Crikey, sir. I'm looking forward to today. Up diddly up, down diddly down, whoops, poop, twiddly dee - decent scrap with the fiendish Red Baron - bit of a jolly old crash landing behind enemy lines - capture, torture, escape, and then back home in time for tea and medals."

Offline Kodiak

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Re: Tool Shedding-Get rid of it.
« Reply #7 on: June 27, 2014, 08:33:24 AM »
Just make hangars indestructible

 :lol

Ummm...No -1

Go to the DA.

Offline BnZs

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Re: Tool Shedding-Get rid of it.
« Reply #8 on: June 27, 2014, 08:37:37 AM »
:lol

Um mm...No -1

Go to the DA.

It's usually empty now, especially at the hours when fights are becoming scarce in the MA.

I've explained what tool shedding does to detract from overall fun in the game. I challenge you to logically explain what tool shedding adds in overall fun that balances what it takes away.
"Crikey, sir. I'm looking forward to today. Up diddly up, down diddly down, whoops, poop, twiddly dee - decent scrap with the fiendish Red Baron - bit of a jolly old crash landing behind enemy lines - capture, torture, escape, and then back home in time for tea and medals."

Offline The Fugitive

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Re: Tool Shedding-Get rid of it.
« Reply #9 on: June 27, 2014, 08:54:09 AM »
Having fun by ending the fun for everyone else? I think absolute turds are a demographic to which AH does not particularly need to cater.

Some say pickers have fun zooming in and picking a guy who is other wise occupied. .... but you wouldn't know about that.

Tool shedders  have there place as targets as well as being the guys that a good fighter cover will defend all the way to the target there by bringing more fighters to a fight.

Offline Chalenge

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Re: Tool Shedding-Get rid of it.
« Reply #10 on: June 27, 2014, 09:31:25 AM »
Hitech has stated that one goal of the game is to piss people off.

Mission accomplished.
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Offline BnZs

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Re: Tool Shedding-Get rid of it.
« Reply #11 on: June 27, 2014, 09:41:32 AM »
Some say pickers have fun zooming in and picking a guy who is other wise occupied. .... but you wouldn't know about that.
Heh...picking is clearly all I know right? http://www.mediafire.com/download/25h3ina2eo9pyhz/20142slo_0041.ahf

Actually, I've let you slide on remarks like this a bit in the past. But I find it is getting a bit old, so I'm going to skip irony and play my cards open: I'm probably better at ACM than you. I took a quick peak. Stats aren't everything, k/d doesn't mean much, but having only 2-2.6 kills per hour does mean something. Simply put, you very seldom manage to shoot anyone down. Which clashes oddly with what you talk on the BBS, because hair-on-fire, will-fight-against-any-odds furballers generally have great kills/time, at the expense of k/d. Combine that with constant complaints about how other people are flying fighter, and I'm getting a picture of a guy who is frustrated by his own ineffectiveness in the MA, and turns the blame outwards rather than inwards.
But I digress...

Tool shedders  have there place as targets as well as being the guys that a good fighter cover will defend all the way to the target there by bringing more fighters to a fight.

I *think* I can get the gist out of this cluster of words. My response: It simply does not work this way. Typically a fight begins with fighters clashing. Most of the action will be at ten thousand feet or below. Bombers will come in high or jabos will come in fast, and defenders will have no opportunity to stop them before they drop their bombs because they are currently dealing with fighters at a lower alt and simply don't have the warning time or opportunity to get in position for proper attacks on bombers. This is how it ACTUALLY goes down time after time. The end result is an abrupt end to opportunities to fight, which actually screws fighter pilots on BOTH sides out of fun. (Toolshedding friendly bombers are possibly more annoying than enemies doing the same thing, at least the enemy bomber are themselves an opportunity to shoot something.)

Due to a range of factors there is simply not good balance between the ability of offense to destroy the very possibility of base defense and the ability of the defense to stop them.

Now, OTOH if offense establishes enough air superiority for a goon to fly in and have troops survive WITHOUT dropping the hangars, they actually deserve the take. And instead of being an anti-climatic bore with no combat, the fight will be a fun clash right up until the moment that the capture succeeds or fails. That is what important, for this is a combat game and its dynamics need to promote player vs. player fighting, not squashing opportunities for players to fight.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2014, 09:57:53 AM by BnZs »
"Crikey, sir. I'm looking forward to today. Up diddly up, down diddly down, whoops, poop, twiddly dee - decent scrap with the fiendish Red Baron - bit of a jolly old crash landing behind enemy lines - capture, torture, escape, and then back home in time for tea and medals."

Offline BnZs

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Re: Tool Shedding-Get rid of it.
« Reply #12 on: June 27, 2014, 09:47:47 AM »
Hitech has stated that one goal of the game is to piss people off.

Mission accomplished.
I am sure this is more of a joke aimed at people who complain about losing fights than a statement of serious intent or a design parameter. The goal of any game is fun for both sides. If not, then it is a bad game.

I am NOT complaining about losing fights. I am complaining about people not having the opportunity to win or lose fights because the flawed game dynamic known as "toolshedding" allows spoilsports to take away the ability of one side to up and fight, pretty much at will.
"Crikey, sir. I'm looking forward to today. Up diddly up, down diddly down, whoops, poop, twiddly dee - decent scrap with the fiendish Red Baron - bit of a jolly old crash landing behind enemy lines - capture, torture, escape, and then back home in time for tea and medals."

Offline Wiley

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Re: Tool Shedding-Get rid of it.
« Reply #13 on: June 27, 2014, 10:10:35 AM »
I am sure this is more of a joke aimed at people who complain about losing fights than a statement of serious intent or a design parameter. The goal of any game is fun for both sides. If not, then it is a bad game.

I am NOT complaining about losing fights. I am complaining about people not having the opportunity to win or lose fights because the flawed game dynamic known as "toolshedding" allows spoilsports to take away the ability of one side to up and fight, pretty much at will.

There is more than one base, there is also a great deal of sky above 3k AGL.  If you put those two facts together, you could come up with the idea that it is possible for fighters to get into position to stop the toolshedders with some regularity.  I am sure your response to that is that you don't want to, that's fine.  There are several people who do enjoy that aspect of gameplay from both sides, and frankly if you take away the urgency of trying to save the items they're bombing, it becomes less attractive to bother stopping them.

DA's on the left.  There are enough people that grumble about this kind of thing that you guys really should organize All Furball All the Time in the DA.  Why does that not happen?
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Offline BnZs

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Re: Tool Shedding-Get rid of it.
« Reply #14 on: June 27, 2014, 10:21:54 AM »
There is more than one base,
That is the base that the enemy is NOT at. Even if people would up to defend from the next base over in large numbers, (they usually don't) the spoilsports are greatly increasing the time and inconvenience before one gets to the tun part. Again screwing over fighter pilots on BOTH sides of the furball. And if significant resistance starts coming from the next base over, sure enough they'll toolshed that one as well.

DA's on the left.  There are enough people that grumble about this kind of thing that you guys really should organize All Furball All the Time in the DA.  Why does that not happen?
Why don't those who like smashing inanimate objects and apparently don't like actual combat between players to eist just go ahead and fly bomber missions offline?

Hell, they could build terrains for their offline bomber flying that are nothing but endless cities and buildings to bomb for hours and hours. Maybe even modify a sound pack so that they could hear simulated cries of women and children burning to death, that sort of thing would probably appeal to the personality type that toolshedds.
"Crikey, sir. I'm looking forward to today. Up diddly up, down diddly down, whoops, poop, twiddly dee - decent scrap with the fiendish Red Baron - bit of a jolly old crash landing behind enemy lines - capture, torture, escape, and then back home in time for tea and medals."