WHHHAAAAAH!!!

[rvflyer]

An idle engine still produces torque and thrust.

I have seen no proof of the efficacy or lack thereof in regard to shutting off the engine in the vertical to facilitate a hammerhead.  If he thinks it works, so be it.   I have no dog in this fight.


That said, a startup penalty is gamey in and of itself.   With a windmilling prop reintroduction of fuel/spark results in an immediate relight in every recip I have ever flown.

Actually a engine off is not producing thrust. The props keep turning because of the relative wind pushing against it causing it to continue to turn which causes drag. You did say idle engine which is different than shutting off a engine which is what I believe the topic was about.

[Vraciu]

Actually a engine off is not producing thrust. The props keep turning because of the relative wind pushing against it causing it to continue to turn which causes drag. You did say idle engine which is different than shutting off a engine which is what I believe the topic was about.

An engine at idle produces thrust.   Try sitting in a Mustang at idle without the brakes on.  It will roll--very fast if allowed.

We are discussing the difference between idle and off in regard to both thrust and torque.    The engine off trick is primarily meant to address torque, not thrust.   Whether or not it actually works is best left to gamers with more experience than I possess.

[JunkyII]

Did you watch the film I posted Fulcrum?

The difference between normal power and WEP is 10 mph in a ki43....where does the extra 30 mph come from is my question.

Is the wiki wrong...FM wrong...foul play...did he accidentally fly to 5 k then dive in and forgot  to let his Dueling partner know he had more E?

[Zerstorer]

Did you watch the film I posted Fulcrum?

The difference between normal power and WEP is 10 mph in a ki43....where does the extra 30 mph come from is my question.

Is the wiki wrong...FM wrong...foul play...did he accidentally fly to 5 k then dive in and forgot  to let his Dueling partner know he had more E?

I know exactly what you are stating, Junky....and at least you are directly stating it....but your statement isn't an acceptable substitute.  

Please allow Kappa and/or the other parties make a direct statement that cheating or underhanded tactics were used.  It is also fine if they acknowledge agreement with your assessment and consider your opinion as a suitable proxy.  Thanks.  

[Triton28]

I know exactly what you are stating, Junky....and at least you are directly stating it....but your statement isn't an acceptable substitute.  

Please allow Kappa and/or the other parties make a direct statement that cheating or underhanded tactics were used.  It is also fine if they acknowledge agreement with your assessment and consider your opinion as a suitable proxy.  Thanks.  

Junky was one of the other parties, so your motion to have kappa restate his statement is denied based on Junky satisfying the requirements you stated in your statement. 

[Zerstorer]

Junky was one of the other parties, so your motion to have kappa restate his statement is denied based on Junky satisfying the requirements you stated in your statement.  

Excellent.  

So, to be clear, both you and Junky are specifically stating:

1.) He had more E at the merge in the duels.

2.) His E advantage at merge could only be because he employed underhanded tactics.  

3.) It is the opinion of yourself, Junky and Kappa, three experienced and skilled cartoon pilots, that there is simply no other way to obtain that significant a difference in E regardless of the plane...but especially in the case of the Ki43 and it's 'three-legged hamster' engine.

4.) Thus the losses incurred by the two of you are, at best, questionable.  

Did I get all that right?  Please let me know if anything is incorrect or needs to be modified.

Oh, does Changeup want to weigh in on these questions? Or can I consider Junky's opinion as his proxy too?

[Triton28]

Excellent.  

So, to be clear, both you and Junky are specifically stating:

1.) He had more E at the merge in the duels.

2.) His E advantage at merge could only be because he employed underhanded tactics.  

3.) It is the opinion of yourself, Junky and Kappa, three experienced and skilled cartoon pilots, that there is simply no other way to obtain that significant a difference in E regardless of the plane...but especially in the case of the Ki43 and it's 'three-legged hamster' engine.

4.) Thus the losses incurred by the two of you are, at best, questionable.  

Did I get all that right?  Please let me know if anything is incorrect or needs to be modified.

Oh, does Changeup want to weigh in on these questions? Or can I consider Junky's opinion as his proxy too?

I don't think I stated in any of my statements a statement that's anywhere close to what you just stated.  My only statement was that your petitioning for more statements to clarify other statements was silly, since you stated to Junky that you knew what he meant when he stated what he stated. 

[DmonSlyr]

40 knots makes a huge difference in dueling. I don't see why someone would not use wep. You would have to be doing something obscure to have that much more speed in 1v1 duel in the DA. Just saying...

[Zerstorer]

I don't think I stated in any of my statements a statement that's anywhere close to what you just stated.  My only statement was that your petitioning for more statements to clarify other statements was silly, since you stated to Junky that you knew what he meant when he stated what he stated. 

Do you think he cheated, Triton?

[Nathan60]

I don't think I stated in any of my statements a statement that's anywhere close to what you just stated.  My only statement was that your petitioning for more statements to clarify other statements was silly, since you stated to Junky that you knew what he meant when he stated what he stated. 

Statement, did somebody learn a new word? Made quite the statement with your statement, statements.

[Zerstorer]

40 knots makes a huge difference in dueling. I don't see why someone would not use wep. You would have to be doing something obscure to have that much more speed in 1v1 duel in the DA. Just saying...

 Ah yes..."Obscure".   That sounds so much nicer than 'underhanded'...not as many negative connotations.  

Assume that no cheating or bending of rules was employed: If you, Kappa, Triton and Junky (all very skilled AH pilots, no one is disputing that) are unsure how the E advantage was gained....why wouldn't that be indicative of the pilot's skill?  

Is it because you and the others think it's probably something 'gamey' like turning the engine off?  

[Triton28]

Statement, did somebody learn a new word? Made quite the statement with your statement, statements.

Turrible.

[Triton28]

Do you think he cheated, Triton?

Did I state that?   Go review the plethora of statements I've made on the stated topic.   

[Aspen]

Here's how I do it:

I leave my gear down and break them off on a hangar to save weight.  Then I dump 1/2 my ammo to save weight.  Then I climb out and dive down to merge alt.  Then on the second merge I try and force the HO and position myself so that I lose one elevator and one aileron to his shots (more weight).  I will be E fighting so I don't really need many control surfaces.  Then I panic because in spite of all I've done right, I am losing.  In desperation, I stick stir until my controls lock up and then auger.  I rage log and give thanks that I was flying under my shade.  I run upstairs  and my Mom wipes my tears and makes me a peanut butter and honey sandwich.  She tells me I will always be a winner in her eyes.  I go to my room, hold a mirror up to the fish bowl and antagonize my Betta fish until I feel my confidence return.  Then back to the basement and AH.

[Slash27]

Here's how I do it:

I leave my gear down and break them off on a hangar to save weight.  Then I dump 1/2 my ammo to save weight.  Then I climb out and dive down to merge alt.  Then on the second merge I try and force the HO and position myself so that I lose one elevator and one aileron to his shots (more weight).  I will be E fighting so I don't really need many control surfaces.  Then I panic because in spite of all I've done right, I am losing.  In desperation, I stick stir until my controls lock up and then auger.  I rage log and give thanks that I was flying under my shade.  I run upstairs  and my Mom wipes my tears and makes me a peanut butter and honey sandwich.  She tells me I will always be a winner in her eyes.  I go to my room, hold a mirror up to the fish bowl and antagonize my Betta fish until I feel my confidence return.  Then back to the basement and AH.

I knew it!