How or Why we will reverse global warming

[-ammo-]

Good to see the Conservatives stepping up and debunking the horse shaat of the lefties.  <S> Eagl, Caldera, and the rest

[Someguy63]

 

[PJ_Godzilla]

Of course, I will note that the California drought did coincide with a statewide effort to get signatures on petitions to ban dihydrogen monoxide, the leading transport agent of man-made toxins, and present in huge amounts in every child born with a birth defect...  Looks like the petition was at least partially successful in banning that particular toxic chemical.  Did you know some people actually *purify* dihydrogen monoxide in their homes, and don't even realize what it does?  Get educated people!

Man learned to reliably produce potable water some time before 4000 BC and has been doing so thus for better than 6000 years.

It took Californian leftists about 20 years or so to make it economically undesirable to do so.

Progress?

It was even worse than that, Eagl. For example, the State, for the sake of a small darter fish, allows some 400 million gallons of fresh water to be exhausted to the SF Bay every year. It has, additionally failed to permit the construction of any additonal catchment reservoirs since the 1980's.

It's a wonder they still have power, since they also have failed to add to the grid in that time.

[FLOOB]

For goodness sake why haven't you guys updated the wikipedia page?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surveys_of_scientists%27_views_on_climate_change

[Someguy63]

For goodness sake why haven't you guys updated the wikipedia page?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surveys_of_scientists%27_views_on_climate_change

Good thing to know the people who are experts know better than most here.

[bustr]

Man learned to reliably produce potable water some time before 4000 BC and has been doing so thus for better than 6000 years.

It took Californian leftists about 20 years or so to make it economically undesirable to do so.

Progress?

It was even worse than that, Eagl. For example, the State, for the sake of a small darter fish, allows some 400 million gallons of fresh water to be exhausted to the SF Bay every year. It has, additionally failed to permit the construction of any additonal catchment reservoirs since the 1980's.

It's a wonder they still have power, since they also have failed to add to the grid in that time.

California for all purposes is a single party state. Most of that party's leadership lives in and around the City of Los Angeles while controlling the state's water and power utilities. And relationships with the federal government for federal funds and initiatives.

1. - 60% of the California population lives in and around L.A.
2. - 60% of the natural water in California occurs in NorCal.
3. - Farmers in the imperial valley are growing alfalfa and exporting it to China and the middle east. Their water comes from the Colorado River which means during a drought California is exporting about 1b feet of water out of the west locked up in plant cells. The Imperial Valley voted for Moonbeam by a very large margin. Central valley farmers, many of them live in districts represented by the opposition party, and are going out of business because their water has been cut off. Those with ground water rights older than California, are being told they no longer own their wells. And are in opposition party districts.
4. - San Diego is about to cut itself off from the water issue by building a $1b Desalinization plant which comes on line in 2016. Naturally the rest of California tried every way possible to stop them for "environmental reasons  ".
5. - Governor Moonbeam's high speed rail project funds could build desalinization plants for L.A. and S.F.
6. - The Delta Smelt may be a smoke screen for Governor Moonbeam's $60b project to bore tunnels to bring in more water from the head of the Sacramento river to SoCal. The smelt allows Moonbeam to cut off the valley water which the federal government controls the actual spigot, to the valley farmers exacerbating a natural drought. Moonbeam looks like a victim of the endangered species act just like his state's farmers so he gets his $60b water rescue project for the "state", errr SoCal. Instead of building more dams and catchments to store water from good years, the tunnels just drain existing water faster to SoCal. On average these California droughts last 4-5 years every other 5-6 years. In the last 60 years the state population has grown without any growth in dams and water catchment. SoCal has reached the point that it can suck dry the state water storage in 4 years along with impacting the state aquifers which take decades to replenish. 

Welcome to Stupidfornia, a glimpse at any country run by ideological brethren of Governor Moonbeam and our current White House resident. Oh ,and Mr. resident refused to turn the federally controlled spigot on that is helping Moonbeam push his tunnels that will mean union jobs in Stupidfornia. And the Carlsbad CA, desalinization plant is owned by the County of Sand Diego, out of the hands of the Moonbeam ideological brethren controlled California water commission on purpose. 60% of the population of Stupidfornia lives in and around Los Angeles and votes 80% Stupid. Sand Diego would never see any of the water they paid $1b to create if the water commission controlled the output because they mostly don't vote Stupid in San Diego county.

Never politically allow a good natural or other disaster go to waste.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/09/29/1425993/-Experts-reveal-many-terminal-flaws-of-Delta-Tunnels-Plan-EIR

1.)

They noted that this giant project will cost California tax and ratepayers between $15 and $60 billion — "one of California’s largest public investments to date." And there will be no public vote, unlike in 1982 when the voters turned down the original peripheral tunnel plan by a big margin

2.)

"The Delta Water Tunnels would instead destroy endangered and threatened fish species," said Michael. "The Tunnels would divert for the Central Valley and State Water Projects vast quantities of freshwater from the Sacramento River near Clarksburg that would no longer flow through the lower Sacramento River, sloughs, and Delta. This would jeopardize the continued existence of endangered and threatened species of fish and adversely modify their designated critical habitat by taking away freshwater flows for Winter Run Chinook salmon, spring-run Chinook salmon, Central Valley steelhead, green Sturgeon, and Delta smelt."

[NatCigg]

California for all purposes is a single party state. Most of that party's leadership lives in and around the City of Los Angeles while controlling the state's water and power utilities. And relationships with the federal government for federal funds and initiatives.

1. - 60% of the California population lives in and around L.A.
2. - 60% of the natural water in California occurs in NorCal.
3. - Farmers in the imperial valley are growing alfalfa and exporting it to China and the middle east. Their water comes from the Colorado River which means during a drought California is exporting about 1b feet of water out of the west locked up in plant cells. The Imperial Valley voted for Moonbeam by a very large margin. Central valley farmers, many of them live in districts represented by the opposition party, and are going out of business because their water has been cut off. Those with ground water rights older than California, are being told they no longer own their wells. And are in opposition party districts.
4. - San Diego is about to cut itself off from the water issue by building a $1b Desalinization plant which comes on line in 2016. Naturally the rest of California tried every way possible to stop them for "environmental reasons  ".
5. - Governor Moonbeam's high speed rail project funds could build desalinization plants for L.A. and S.F.
6. - The Delta Smelt may be a smoke screen for Governor Moonbeam's $60b project to bore tunnels to bring in more water from the head of the Sacramento river to SoCal. The smelt allows Moonbeam to cut off the valley water which the federal government controls the actual spigot, to the valley farmers exacerbating a natural drought. Moonbeam looks like a victim of the endangered species act just like his state's farmers so he gets his $60b water rescue project for the "state", errr SoCal. Instead of building more dams and catchments to store water from good years, the tunnels just drain existing water faster to SoCal. On average these California droughts last 4-5 years every other 5-6 years. In the last 60 years the state population has grown without any growth in dams and water catchment. SoCal has reached the point that it can suck dry the state water storage in 4 years along with impacting the state aquifers which take decades to replenish. 

Welcome to Stupidfornia, a glimpse at any country run by ideological brethren of Governor Moonbeam and our current White House resident. Oh ,and Mr. resident refused to turn the federally controlled spigot on that is helping Moonbeam push his tunnels that will mean union jobs in Stupidfornia. And the Carlsbad CA, desalinization plant is owned by the County of Sand Diego, out of the hands of the Moonbeam ideological brethren controlled California water commission on purpose. 60% of the population of Stupidfornia lives in and around Los Angeles and votes 80% Stupid. Sand Diego would never see any of the water they paid $1b to create if the water commission controlled the output because they mostly don't vote Stupid in San Diego county.

Never politically allow a good natural or other disaster go to waste.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2015/09/29/1425993/-Experts-reveal-many-terminal-flaws-of-Delta-Tunnels-Plan-EIR

1.)

They noted that this giant project will cost California tax and ratepayers between $15 and $60 billion — "one of California’s largest public investments to date." And there will be no public vote, unlike in 1982 when the voters turned down the original peripheral tunnel plan by a big margin

2.)

"The Delta Water Tunnels would instead destroy endangered and threatened fish species," said Michael. "The Tunnels would divert for the Central Valley and State Water Projects vast quantities of freshwater from the Sacramento River near Clarksburg that would no longer flow through the lower Sacramento River, sloughs, and Delta. This would jeopardize the continued existence of endangered and threatened species of fish and adversely modify their designated critical habitat by taking away freshwater flows for Winter Run Chinook salmon, spring-run Chinook salmon, Central Valley steelhead, green Sturgeon, and Delta smelt."

   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=neGdoqsuiN8

It's a bull three ring circus sideshow of freaks

Here in this hopeless ing hole we call L.A.
The only way to fix it is to flush it all away.
Any ing time. Any ing day.
Learn to swim, I'll see you down in Arizona Bay.

Some say a comet will fall from the sky.
Followed by meteor showers and tidal waves.
Followed by fault lines that cannot sit still.
Followed by millions of dumbfounded dip its.

Some say the end is near.
Some say we'll see Armageddon soon.
I certainly hope we will cause
I sure could use a vacation from this

Stupid it, silly it, stupid it...

One great big festering neon distraction,
I've a suggestion to keep you all occupied.

Learn to swim. [3x]

Mom's gonna fix it all soon.
Mom's comin' round to put it back the way it ought to be.

Learn to swim.

F L Ron Hubbard and
 all his clones.
 all these gun-toting
Hip gangster wannabes.

Learn to swim.

 retro anything.
 your tattoos.
 all you junkies and
 your short memory.

Learn to swim.

 smiley glad-hands
With hidden agendas.
 these dysfunctional,
Insecure actresses.

Learn to swim.

Cause I'm praying for rain
And I'm praying for tidal waves
I wanna see the ground give way.
I wanna watch it all go down.
Mom, please flush it all away.
I wanna see it go right in and down.
I wanna watch it go right in.
Watch you flush it all away.

[PJ_Godzilla]

Bustr, thanks for the backstory on the darter. I had my suspicions. As an ex-Palo Alto resident, I now place a prayer rug on my Ann Arbor floor, take my knees, and bow in your direction. you've nailed it in some depth, yet summarized nicely.

You are a very large and very good sort of turd and I apologize for ever having quibbled with you. And I use that turd term in a friendly and disarming way... 

I should add, I'm assuming that the odds of the sane north and south seceding from the "stuck on stupid" part is approx nil.

[Brooke]

Welcome to Stupidfornia, a glimpse at any country run by

  

In 1999, we moved our company out of The People's Republic of California, mainly because of high taxes.  We went on to hire in Washington State and spend about $100M into the economy of Washington State, and California got $0.  We were an example of what happens on the right side of the Laffer curve.

The only problem with people leaving California for, say, Texas is that some of them bring their political philosophy with them and start to wreck the places they move to (having already wrecked they place they are leaving).  I worry that it will be like New Hampshire, which was taken over by people from Mass.

[PJ_Godzilla]

 

We were an example of what happens on the right side of the Laffer curve.

Ah yes, the side of the curve in which rate increases cause incremental decreases in revenue. Yet some still call it voodoo and are baffled (see the City of Detroit as a fine example of economic illiteracy amongst leadership) that jacking rates further leads to base flight and erosion of revenue. Perhaps "stupidfornia" isn't the only example.

[NatCigg]

I thought they were going to farm in Detroit. 

[Brooke]

Detroit farmland.

[Brooke]

Some historical perspective on climate and CO2 in the atmosphere.

Temperature over time:


CO2 over time:


If you burned all the known reserves of oil, natural gas, and coal in the ground that we know of, all in one shot, atmospheric CO2 would go from 400 ppm (today's level) to about 800 ppm (unless I made a math error).  As you can see from the above graph, 800 ppm is half or less of the amount during the time of the dinosaurs.

Also, while historically the effect of warmer temperatures on earth and higher CO2 on earth has been beneficial, we do know that there is a very strong history of periodic ice ages that were not.  Warmer temperatures might trigger some undesirable things or it might not be that bad.  An ice age very definitely would be far worse to the point of wiping out most people on the planet.

Think of adding CO2 to the atmosphere as a trial insurance policy against a next ice age.

[Peanut1]

See Rule #6

What the hell is this for?

[Brooke]

(see the City of Detroit as a fine example of economic illiteracy amongst leadership)

Unfortunately, there are cities that tread the same path as Detroit and are (unsurprisingly) having the same things happen.  They are blind to history.  Most people don't look at history to see the clear examples of what works and what doesn't work.