you have shot yourself

[caldera]

Just killshot my own tail off when a friendly flew through my bullets. 

You have shot yourself 1 time
               "                  1 time
                    "             2 times
                "                 1 time

Also took a 20mm shell earlier but no damage, so no idea where it hit. 


My question is: did I hit the friendly with exactly 5 bullets, or is that an approximation?

[DmonSlyr]

I personally wish it did no damage. That way you could practice your aiming on the way out following your squadie 

[SPKmes]

I don't know...but if I could hit an enemy as hard and accurately as a friendly....I would be amazing hahahaha

[Shuffler]

Kill shooter is off in AHIII till it goes live.

With more folks in there they may think about changing that.LOL

[Scca]

I personally wish it did no damage. That way you could practice your aiming on the way out following your squadie 

You can do that in the TA if you like.  With kill shooter off in the MA, the spray and pray/ganging would be out of control.  There should be some penalty, and kill shooter is ok in my book. 

[captain1ma]

isn't the idea NOT to shoot friendly?

[bustr]

Search is your best friend when you want Hitech to answer most game questions. Some of his responses over the last 16 years. He seems to like kill shooter the way it's implemented.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A long time ago (sigh about 20 years) in a land far far away I was flying a P38.

I had a new record for myself of 8 kills on my shiny p38 and was flying home in the clear with no bullets left.

A brand spanking new guy comes along , flies behind me and pulls the trigger.

I die.

About 4 years later kill shooter was created.

HiTech

-----------------------------------------

Another on the same theme from Hitech...

-----------------------------------------


I don't even want to think of the response after the first 262 dies to freindly fire.

And I like the kill shoot system better then air warriors system.

Infact I disliked the PNG system so much I invented the Kill shooter system. Still have fond memories of having my first 13 kill mission, flying back , no enemies in the sector, and low and behold here comes a newbie from dead 6 to shoots me down.

-----------------------------------------

2005 still emphatic about kill shooter.

-----------------------------------------

Don't like the idea. The effect would be more people not whatching out for friendlies when they shoot.


And before this thread gets going.  Don't sugest somthing that has all ready been suggested because unless a new idea comes up ,(which is doubtfull) kill shooter will not be changing.

HiTech


-----------------------------------------

A very early 2002 answer.

-----------------------------------------

Unfortunataly responsibity ends when the tracers are flying. People fly into the bullet stream.

So you wan't the kill so bad,want points so bad, that you are willing to risk killingl a friendly.

Read again.

It is the shooters responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.

If some one is diving in you are NOT clear to fire.


Thats a bit off i'd say. Sure, they may dive into a con and not see you behind him, but they sure as heck can see the tracers you're firing his way.
Again .
It is the shooters responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.


 Point is, some people just dont give a damn and fly in there regardless.
Again.
It is the shooters responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.


Accidents happen as well, toejam happens. But penalizing the person that didnt cause the accident by having 1 or 2 killshooter pings whacking him off the sky doesnt sound right.

This would be like blaming a guy for hiting your car after you just ran a red light, because "well he saw me".

Again.
You want the kill so bad,want points so bad, that you are willing to risk killing a friendly.

It is the shooters responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.

All I'd like to see is a few more leniency towards hits received before causing damage, give the victims a chance to stop firing before killshooting themselves (target fixation, press trigger, BIG green icon plane jumps in front split second surprise, trigger still pressed, *plinkplink* *BOOM* you go).

Again.
You want the kill so bad,want points so bad, that you are willing to risk killing a friendly.

It is the shooter responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.


Tac everything you are aguing is you wanting the kill no different then the guy diving in wants the kill.

Only thing is the other guy is in a better position for the kill than you are. What you are acusing other people of, you are more guilty of yourself.


The rule is simple.

It is the shooter responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.


HiTech

---------------------------------------------

2001 official response.

---------------------------------------------

1. Some form of control either png or kill shooter must be in the game. It dosn't take a bunch, It only takes one person to abuse the system to destroy everyones day. If one persone choses to shoot friendlies it leaves everyone else with no choice but to shoot him, with in mins 1 big freindly only furbal erupts.

This point has been proven every time kill shooter has been off, take it as a fact.

2. PNG also has problems. I rember a few times when Kite and I were winging together that I would end up PNG, not sure why but  some how Kite and I would always end up in the the same space and I would end up pinging him. I would ended up having to fly for a new country when I would rather not have.

3. Almost always it's the shooter fault for the none intential friendly fire, most people say that the other person just got in my way, but thats not realy the case, normaly the person who "gets in the way" is comming from above and has no idea the shooter is there it's the person with the hand on the trigers job to not shoot friendlies, why should the guy getting shot take the penalty for the shooter screwing up?

This is not a new topic, just like how collision detection works, both system are not perferct , but there isn't a perfect answer to the problem.

HiTech

---------------------------------------------

1999 and it was a big question....

---------------------------------------------


Downtown Killshooter or somthing like it is here to stay. Ive seen what happens in the arena when kill shooter is off and it totaly destroys arena play with out it.

Killshooter is a realy nice soultion to the problem the only thing that is different from real life is who takes the damage, friendly fire still occurs but is charged to the guy who screwed up and shot his friends.

HiTech

[caldera]

Search is your best friend when you want Hitech to answer most game questions. Some of his responses over the last 16 years. He seems to like kill shooter the way it's implemented.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A long time ago (sigh about 20 years) in a land far far away I was flying a P38.

I had a new record for myself of 8 kills on my shiny p38 and was flying home in the clear with no bullets left.

A brand spanking new guy comes along , flies behind me and pulls the trigger.

I die.

About 4 years later kill shooter was created.

HiTech

-----------------------------------------

Another on the same theme from Hitech...

-----------------------------------------


I don't even want to think of the response after the first 262 dies to freindly fire.

And I like the kill shoot system better then air warriors system.

Infact I disliked the PNG system so much I invented the Kill shooter system. Still have fond memories of having my first 13 kill mission, flying back , no enemies in the sector, and low and behold here comes a newbie from dead 6 to shoots me down.

-----------------------------------------

2005 still emphatic about kill shooter.

-----------------------------------------

Don't like the idea. The effect would be more people not whatching out for friendlies when they shoot.


And before this thread gets going.  Don't sugest somthing that has all ready been suggested because unless a new idea comes up ,(which is doubtfull) kill shooter will not be changing.

HiTech


-----------------------------------------

A very early 2002 answer.

-----------------------------------------

Unfortunataly responsibity ends when the tracers are flying. People fly into the bullet stream.

So you wan't the kill so bad,want points so bad, that you are willing to risk killingl a friendly.

Read again.

It is the shooters responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.

If some one is diving in you are NOT clear to fire.


Thats a bit off i'd say. Sure, they may dive into a con and not see you behind him, but they sure as heck can see the tracers you're firing his way.
Again .
It is the shooters responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.


 Point is, some people just dont give a damn and fly in there regardless.
Again.
It is the shooters responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.


Accidents happen as well, toejam happens. But penalizing the person that didnt cause the accident by having 1 or 2 killshooter pings whacking him off the sky doesnt sound right.

This would be like blaming a guy for hiting your car after you just ran a red light, because "well he saw me".

Again.
You want the kill so bad,want points so bad, that you are willing to risk killing a friendly.

It is the shooters responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.

All I'd like to see is a few more leniency towards hits received before causing damage, give the victims a chance to stop firing before killshooting themselves (target fixation, press trigger, BIG green icon plane jumps in front split second surprise, trigger still pressed, *plinkplink* *BOOM* you go).

Again.
You want the kill so bad,want points so bad, that you are willing to risk killing a friendly.

It is the shooter responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.


Tac everything you are aguing is you wanting the kill no different then the guy diving in wants the kill.

Only thing is the other guy is in a better position for the kill than you are. What you are acusing other people of, you are more guilty of yourself.


The rule is simple.

It is the shooter responsiblity to make sure he is clear to fire.


HiTech

---------------------------------------------

2001 official response.

---------------------------------------------

1. Some form of control either png or kill shooter must be in the game. It dosn't take a bunch, It only takes one person to abuse the system to destroy everyones day. If one persone choses to shoot friendlies it leaves everyone else with no choice but to shoot him, with in mins 1 big freindly only furbal erupts.

This point has been proven every time kill shooter has been off, take it as a fact.

2. PNG also has problems. I rember a few times when Kite and I were winging together that I would end up PNG, not sure why but  some how Kite and I would always end up in the the same space and I would end up pinging him. I would ended up having to fly for a new country when I would rather not have.

3. Almost always it's the shooter fault for the none intential friendly fire, most people say that the other person just got in my way, but thats not realy the case, normaly the person who "gets in the way" is comming from above and has no idea the shooter is there it's the person with the hand on the trigers job to not shoot friendlies, why should the guy getting shot take the penalty for the shooter screwing up?

This is not a new topic, just like how collision detection works, both system are not perferct , but there isn't a perfect answer to the problem.

HiTech

---------------------------------------------

1999 and it was a big question....

---------------------------------------------


Downtown Killshooter or somthing like it is here to stay. Ive seen what happens in the arena when kill shooter is off and it totaly destroys arena play with out it.

Killshooter is a realy nice soultion to the problem the only thing that is different from real life is who takes the damage, friendly fire still occurs but is charged to the guy who screwed up and shot his friends.

HiTech

Thanks for the Magna Carta, but none of that answered my question.

did I hit the friendly with exactly 5 bullets, or is that an approximation?

[Invictus84]

You can do that in the TA if you like.  With kill shooter off in the MA, the spray and pray/ganging would be out of control.  There should be some penalty, and kill shooter is ok in my book.

Killshooter simply reverses the consquences of friendly fire, but so what?   There is no penalty for running through a friendly's fire and you might just bag a kill.  It doesnt eliminate a player gaming the game, it just alters what has to be done to do so. 

 

[bustr]

Knowing the mechanics of your demise doesn't change that you pulled your own trigger. Only Hitech can answer your mechanics question. Then what, you have him in a conversation with you about "kill shooter". Where do you go from there.......

Those 16 years of Hitech responses is for all of the barracks lawyers in this post.

The pattern with all of the posts I dug up went in two general directions. Angry and wanting kill shooter removed, then not walking away from the conversation when Hitech said no. Or, starting out talking about game play mechanics, then when Hitech entered the fray, not walking away accepting the same answer with slightly more depth from Hitech.

There is really no reason to bring up kill shooter in any depth other than trying to get Hitech involved in your post. And you already know how to use the forum search function.

[The Fugitive]

Just killshot my own tail off when a friendly flew through my bullets. 

You have shot yourself 1 time
               "                  1 time
                    "             2 times
                "                 1 time

Also took a 20mm shell earlier but no damage, so no idea where it hit. 


My question is: did I hit the friendly with exactly 5 bullets, or is that an approximation?

My "guess" ( seeing it doesn't look like HTC is going to answer and the rest of these guys are more interested in "reading into" your post more than answering it  ) is that it is an approximation, or maybe its a "burst". If it took only 5 rounds to drop a plane, either mine in a killshooter, or an enemy players I'd get a lot more kills than I do now.

[caldera]

My "guess" ( seeing it doesn't look like HTC is going to answer and the rest of these guys are more interested in "reading into" your post more than answering it  ) is that it is an approximation, or maybe its a "burst". If it took only 5 rounds to drop a plane, either mine in a killshooter, or an enemy players I'd get a lot more kills than I do now.

Thanks for an honest answer.   

Knowing the mechanics of your demise doesn't change that you pulled your own trigger. Only Hitech can answer your mechanics question. Then what, you have him in a conversation with you about "kill shooter". Where do you go from there.......

Those 16 years of Hitech responses is for all of the barracks lawyers in this post.

The pattern with all of the posts I dug up went in two general directions. Angry and wanting kill shooter removed, then not walking away from the conversation when Hitech said no. Or, starting out talking about game play mechanics, then when Hitech entered the fray, not walking away accepting the same answer with slightly more depth from Hitech.

There is really no reason to bring up kill shooter in any depth other than trying to get Hitech involved in your post. And you already know how to use the forum search function.

Your mind reading skills are not working on me.  I like kill-shooter as it is and can probably count the times I fell victim to it on one hand.
I did however, have a reasonable question to ask the community.  Your response is the long-winded equivalent of RTFM.
There was no expectation of HiTech's input, because he answers only when he feels like it.
And lastly, you used the search function and didn't come up with an answer to the question.

[Tilt]

Just killshot my own tail off when a friendly flew through my bullets. 

My question is: did I hit the friendly with exactly 5 bullets, or is that an approximation?

Your FE thinks you did............ REM against an enemy you fire bullets your FE records the hits and these are sent to your targets FE after a bit of "checking" is done somewhere............

In the case of Kill Shooter we should expect AH to use the exact same COAD except that now we have a simple piece of logic in the way that says "if friendly then............"

is the lethality of those friendly fire bullets dumbed down ?  I don't know
is the system report being given for every bullet......... I would assume that given it goes to the trouble of counting at all then yes ! or at least the ones that are being added to your damage status.

[DmonSlyr]

I wish killshooter could be turned off on friendly vehicles from a plane. Multiple times I've tried to kill a "bombard" who is bombing my friendly tanks, I go to shoot the bad guy, but he is lined up with my friendly, so I end up killshooting my self on the tank they are lined up with as my bullets pass. 

[hitech]

If the were shooter and shootie are in the same plane type, Kill Shooter applies the exact same damage as it would against an enemy.

But if you are in different aircraft what component takes the damaged can be more arbitrary depending on the shapes of the aircraft.

HiTech