Escorts could only stay with bombers for 20-40 minutes?

[GScholz]

Nice try 

[GScholz]

Ran out of fuel before I ran out of WEP in the 109K-4, so that's business as usual. 

[Vraciu]

OK so I just did. Upped a D-Pony. Flew it on WEP for five minutes until it shut down. Cruised on MIL for ten minutes to let it cool down. Watched the temp needle go back down to normal. Turned WEP back on for another full five minutes. Vraciu, I want those 20 minutes of my life back! 

You gotta keep going.  Eventually it quits for good.    I fly Mustangs pretty much exclusively.  They have a total time limit now for WEP.

[Vraciu]

I would bet you don't get a third five minutes

Correct.   It has a definite limit.  Eventually it doesn't come back no matter what. 

[GScholz]

I'll find out one of these days.

[morfiend]

Correct.   It has a definite limit.  Eventually it doesn't come back no matter what.

  This is correct!  If you want to test do it offline and set fuel burn to .1,not 1 but .1 and you will have plenty of flight time to test the WEP limitations.

 The AH wiki has the wep times and recharge rates but it doesnt list the total limitation,since HTC hasnt released that yet I cant say definitively what the total limits are but there is indeed a point where you can no longer recharge the wep cycle in the plane you are flying,that said with a 2 fuel burn rate most planes will run out of fuel before the wep limits because there just isnt enough flight time. There are a few exception like the 51 that can fly forever,well not really, on full fuel and DT`s.



   

[Devil 505]

The real question is what effect rearming has on recharging WEP/ resetting charge times.

[Vraciu]

The real question is what effect rearming has on recharging WEP/ resetting charge times.

Zero.  At least in the P-51D.

[Vraciu]

I'll find out one of these days.

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,381703.msg5082736.html#msg5082736

[drgondog]

How many is lots?

Here is a list of the 8th AF's heaviest losses, http://www.taphilo.com/history/8thaf/8aflosses.shtml

Which were because of fighters not showing up.

Haven't been around for some time - and that link doesn't work now.

That said, the great losses had three root causes. 1) Either fighters or bombers missed r/v times and location. Examples 4th FG missed R/V by minutes for the 2nd BD task force heading to Bernberg on 7 July,1944 and 355th/4th FG missed R/V by minutes for 2nd BD headed for Stettin on 20 June 1944 . 2.) The bombers were far off course and missed R/V. Examples 1st/3rd BD 29 April 1944; 1st BD on 12 May, 1944; 445th BG on 27 Sept, 1944. 3.) Numerically Overwhelming and persistent LW attacks against insufficient fighter escort - Berlin 6 March 1944, Munich area 24 April 1944.

[drgondog]

We have the best possible 109K in the game, and it is significantly faster than the P-51D on almost the same power. With 100/150 grade fuel the Pony should edge out the 109 though. Pitty we don't have that as perk-fuel or something. Souped up Spits and Ponies would be awesome, even if we could only fly them once in a while.

(Image removed from quote.)

For unknown reasons I can't explain I revisited this thread

Your data on the P-51D doesn't reflect the later Flight Tests for your speed vs altitude and Hp ratings. Two significant points on the May 1945 test results below. First, the top speed of 442mph at 67"/3000RPM at 26,000ft with 1410Hp - is With external racks. The improved racks for D/H achieved about 50% reduction in drag penalty overP-51A/B racks. For purposes of this comparison you should find Flight testing of the K with Schlob 503 rack inclusion for your 109K speeds.

I exchanged a lot of emails with Dr. Millei (Kurfurst) to try to get best individual comparisons between P-51B and various ther fighters, normalized to full (internal) gross weights, including 109G-6 (including DB606A/S. I included those in my book (co-authored with Lowell Ford) P-51B:North America's Bastard Stepchild that Saved 8th AF" (agree to a little hyperbole).

Didn't find a 'racked' 109K at full combat load that exceeded 440mph. Your source? From your source, what were the conditions at takeoff and FTH?

Further comment - you rebutted 'much larger' comment of Mustang compared to 109 (all) as in 90% range but that isn't representative of 'size' relative to area, volume or drag.

While the Linear span of a 109 is about 90% of the 51, the AREA of 172x2= 344sf to P-51 235x2= 470sf, a 70% factor with similar effects for all wetted area. It is much smaller - and yet according to Hoerner, chaper 14-9 the CDw=.0095 for the109, to P-51 CDw=0.0040. 

You might also note that MILITARY Power at 29K results in 439mph in the P-51D-15-NA with the 1650-7 developing 1288hp.


http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/mustang/p51d-15342.html

BTW - this Reports also is a strong reference to the final range tables of the P-51D.

[MiloMorai]

Haven't been around for some time - and that link doesn't work now.

That said, the great losses had three root causes. 1) Either fighters or bombers missed r/v times and location. Examples 4th FG missed R/V by minutes for the 2nd BD task force heading to Bernberg on 7 July,1944 and 355th/4th FG missed R/V by minutes for 2nd BD headed for Stettin on 20 June 1944 . 2.) The bombers were far off course and missed R/V. Examples 1st/3rd BD 29 April 1944; 1st BD on 12 May, 1944; 445th BG on 27 Sept, 1944. 3.) Numerically Overwhelming and persistent LW attacks against insufficient fighter escort - Berlin 6 March 1944, Munich area 24 April 1944.

It is over 6 years old.