USMC & USAF Pilots on the capabilities of the F-35

[GScholz]

Lt. Col. David “Chip” Berke, USMC, former F-22 and F-35B pilot now the Force Management Branch Chief on the Joint Staff J-8, and Lt. Col. Scott “CAP” Gunn, USAF, the commander of the 33rd Operational Support Squadron at Eglin AFB, Fla., discuss the capabilities of the F-35.

[pipz]

Very informative insight. Thanks for posting GScholz.

[artik]

To be honest it is very interesting... but also tells something disturbing.

If the single and most important factor is avionics... Why we can't take any existing 4+ gen fighter and put all avionics there (sensor fusion) + some good ECM and we get the most important/unique F-35 advantage but with a fraction of cost.

Virtually all aircraft pass though avionics upgrades during their life time. So why it can't we get all these great concepts into so called legacy fighters. Finally software and sensors are easy/cheap to upgrade.

[GScholz]

"but with a fraction of cost" - Most of the delays and cost overruns with the A-model have been with the sensor fusion system. LM must recoup their development costs no matter what plane you put the systems in.

[Krusty]

To be honest it is very interesting... but also tells something disturbing.

If the single and most important factor is avionics... Why we can't take any existing 4+ gen fighter and put all avionics there (sensor fusion) + some good ECM and we get the most important/unique F-35 advantage but with a fraction of cost.

Virtually all aircraft pass though avionics upgrades during their life time. So why it can't we get all these great concepts into so called legacy fighters. Finally software and sensors are easy/cheap to upgrade.

For the same reason you can't upgrade your Commodore 64 to run Oculus Rift. It was great for its time, but every last bit of it, from size, to cooling (a major factor) to cpu processing power, to sensor integration (running wires internally and shieling them against external frequencies and EM to multiple dozens of sensor points all over the airframe) and then having the proper G-resistance mounting points, the proper shock resistances or shock absorption required to land and take off repeatedly.

What you suggest is an impossible task. F-16s are end of their practical development, for example, mostly because their avionics cannot be expanded beyond the current long-spine version. They just don't have the power generation, cooling, space, or integration capabilities. This is all built into an airframe from the start, or built in with the proper room/capabilities to include it in the future. Existing airframes currently are from the 1970s in nature. The computer technology and science of air combat has exponentially evolved since then. It's like trying to plug a Cray super computer into a D battery. Some things just don't work with other things.

[Randall172]

its funny how my thread was shut down right away but this one keeps chugging along

[bustr]

See Rule #14

[TequilaChaser]

See Rule #14

[Zimme83]

No one knows...

[mthrockmor]

A model of the F-15 was built, tested then dumped called the F-15SE (Silent Eagle.) It basically did what artik suggested, which was take the basic F-15 frame, strip it down to the bones and rebuild it with ultra modern avionics, etc and then handle some surfaces with radar absorbent design/material. It seemed to do much of what artik suggested, at a much smaller cost than the F-22. It was dumped. From a political point of view the SE variant has less umph than the F-22.

If the F-35 is all avionics there is no reason those could not be built into another bird. The F-35 is a platform, what they are describing is the data bus, link and system.

boo

[oakranger]

its funny how my thread was shut down right away but this one keeps chugging along

Skuzzy or HT don't adventure much in here.

[Vraciu]

With the fundamental change in Washington on 1\20\17, anyone have ideas to the future of the F35?

Joint Strike Failure gone or seriously reduced.   

Advanced Super Hornet with EPE and F-15SA procured. 

F-22 restarted OR its replacement developed.

IBTL.

[Vraciu]

Skuzzy or HT don't adventure much in here.

They'll be along.

[Vraciu]

its funny how my thread was shut down right away but this one keeps chugging along

It was dead until you brought it back to life. 

[Vraciu]

A model of the F-15 was built, tested then dumped called the F-15SE (Silent Eagle.) It basically did what artik suggested, which was take the basic F-15 frame, strip it down to the bones and rebuild it with ultra modern avionics, etc and then handle some surfaces with radar absorbent design/material. It seemed to do much of what artik suggested, at a much smaller cost than the F-22. It was dumped. From a political point of view the SE variant has less umph than the F-22.

If the F-35 is all avionics there is no reason those could not be built into another bird. The F-35 is a platform, what they are describing is the data bus, link and system.

boo

F-15SA.  FBW.   More payload.  Being delivered to Saudi.  I expect to see some built for the USAF.